Astroworld

http://riverdaughter.wordpress.com/

It appears that unity will be difficult, if not impossible ... the DNC, DLC, superdelegates, etc. may have made their choice. Good for them, for what it's worth. How many votes is that?

Very interesting analysis of McClellan. I have read elsewhere that his grandfather, Dean of Law School at UT, was Scott's guiding light. Apparently, the grandfather was a man of integrity and that has shown through with the writing and publication of Scott's book. He certainly deserves kudos for it and will need courage and support in the future for he has taken on some powerful and vengeful interests.

We'll have to see how things go, of course, but we're off to a good start: no more donations from registered lobbyists and PACS. And: Dr. Dean stays on!!

http://tinyurl.com/5exfcm

I just DON"T understand, how the caucus states DON"T count in the minds of some people????/
In our caucus, we had 46 attendees ( 2004 it was only 18, thank you Dr. Dean!)
15 people stood for Clinton, = 1 delegate
27 people stood for Obama = 1 delegate.
Come Nov. We will have at least 31 votes for Obama ( all 4 undecided will go Dem.I know hem all well!)
I'm going to guess that most of the Clinton people will vote for Obama, push comes to a shove.!

QOP, Your comment, "I'm going to guess that most of the Clinton people will vote for Obama, push comes to a shove.!"

I wouldn't take it to the bank.

The reason people discount caucus states is a minority of people show up and their votes are the ones that get counted, while others, who can't show up get disenfranchised. Look at Texas. Clinton won the vote, Obama the caucus. Obama got the delegates. That's not democratic.

The problem with votes/caucus/delegate is state's rules for both parties. An example is Colorado, we always had primaries and only registered Dems or GOP could vote in their primary. It was too expensive so the people of CO several years ago voted for Cauces instead and still only registered party voters could vote, there could not be a cross over, other states, anyone could vote for anyone they wanted no matter the party. This was a primary, not a general election, in the general election it's not the voters who decide, it's the Electoral Collage, in primaries, it's the delegates the voters pick.

Before primaries began, the Rules and Ethics Committee of each party meet and hammer out the rules for that primary season, each candidate, before they proceed must read the rules of the respective parties and decide if they can or want to abide by them, all candidates in both parties did so before the primaries started. One cannot change the rules in the middle of the primary season to suit themselves, it's unfair to the rest of the states. Each state draws up their additional rules for the candidates and each candidate, if they want to compete in that state, signs those rules as well.

If someone doesn't like the rules, there is ample time prior to the start of the primary season to make a request of the compliance committees to change their states/party rules, none of the candidates did so this year. For a caucus state not to be counted, the people of that state must file a grivience, none of the caucus states did that. The pledged delegates from each state are in the hands of that state, not in the hands of the candidate, the state parties are picking their nominee from a field of candidates, not really the voters. Sad but true. The way to change this is get involved with the parties and get on the Rules and Ethics committees and make your case.

The problem here is there was just one candidate that was fine with the rules before the primary season started and then wanted to change the rules in the middle of the election, in a lot of circles that is called cheating to try to change rules in the middle of the game.

Thanks for that post Sally. For someone who has difficulty in figuring out the American electoral process, that was enlightening.

Hillary Clinton... Acting like a 2 year old. Stop it!!!!!!!!

Posted by wowimthere in General Discussion: Primaries
Thu Jun 05th 2008, 11:40 AM

Risky. Calculating. Selfish. And yes... CHILDISH. These are the unflattering characteristics I'm witnessing in a candidate I once believed would make a great first female president. Gladly, she won't be our first. That historic moment will be awaiting another woman who shall get to the highest office in the land on her own merits.

I'm young but in my years of voting, I have never ever seen a democratic presidential candidate running for the highest office in the land exhibit the kind of behavior that Hillary Clinton has. When someone explained that she needed some "time" to retire from her campaign in a way of her own "choosing", I thought... this is someone who everyone said was strong enough to be commander in chief. She had balls of steel as one of her supporters alluded. Hillary Clinton, the candidate who talked tough and voted tough and threw back shots like she was just one of the boys needed to be treated with "KID" gloves? This is a woman who screams sexism then talks like a racist and she needs to be handled very carefully? She throws a tantrum it seems whenever she can't get her way. She starts out as the inevitable candidate with a boatload of money and a gargantuan machine and she ends her campaign in the back seat, in debt and a depleted army largely because of the mistakes she made and now she wants to blame Obama because he won like David over Goliath in large measure playing the cleanest game politics has ever seen?

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/wowimthere/2

Who the hell are the Hillary haters going to find to hate after she's no longer offending them with every breath she takes?! If any give a crap about getting everyone possible to vote for Obama you best stop the raging.

Obama supporters would do well to take a hint from him! Do you see him throwing tantrums about the latest thing Hillary has dared to do? He's actually being gracious and some of his supporters just can't seem to get his message!

Well, I hate NAFTA, actually the aftermath of NAFTA, and I prefer rending of garments of gnashing of teeth over issues that are life-and-death to the people of the earth and the earth itself. Here is an opportunity to evaluate NAFTA and craft more enlightened legislation dealing with international trade and related agreements.

http://www.citizen.org/trade/tradeact/

Hillary has a plan to restore America's middle class. After six and a half years of Bush administration policies, the middle class is struggling to succeed in an economy that is leaving more and more Americans behind.
Income inequality has risen to the highest levels since 1929, and wages have stagnated. In the meantime, health care premiums and college tuition have skyrocketed, squeezing middle class families who have largely relied on their home equity to make ends meet. The burgeoning problems in the housing market further threaten many middle class families.
Understanding that a vibrant middle class is essential to America's prosperity, Hillary will implement a broad set of policies to once again restore opportunity for all Americans.
Hillary's economic blueprint to restore the American middle class includes:

Lowering taxes for middle class families.
Providing quality, affordable health care to every American.
Making college accessible and affordable.
Confronting the growing problems in the housing market.
Bolstering retirement security by promoting savings and investment.
Returning to fiscal responsibility and moving towards balanced budgets.
Harnessing innovation to create the high-wage jobs of the 21st century.
Creating a $50 billion Strategic Energy Fund to jumpstart research and development of alternative energies.
Strengthening unions and ensuring our trade laws work for all Americans.

Even the moderators on DU have put their foot down about the fighting.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x6285770

from Skinner:
The primary infighting on DU ends at 12 noon ET on Wednesday, June 11. Updated at 5:21 AM

Now that it has become apparent that Senator Clinton will leave the presidential race, the primary infighting here on Democratic Underground will end at 12:00 noon ET on Wednesday, June 11. As promised, this gives all of you seven days to prepare yourself for the end of the primary season, and the beginning of the general election:

We understand that not everyone will be prepared to immediately put the primaries behind us. There will be some jerks on the winning side who insist on gloating. And there will be some sore losers on the other side who will want to keep attacking the nominee. Once we have a presumptive nominee, those people will have one week to get it out of their systems. We believe that a one-week transitional period is more than fair for those of you who cannot switch gears easily or quickly. After this week-long adjustment period, we're done.

At that point, the moderators and admins will step in and shut down the primary infighting. The vast majority of people on this site will be glad to be done with the primaries. Sadly, a very small number of bitter partisans will not be able to let it go, and will likely be removed from this community. Few people will miss them when they are gone.

The General Discussion: Primaries forum will be re-named and re-purposed to host discussions about the upcoming presidential election between Senator Obama and Senator McCain.

JudiGem,

I believe Hillary will work as a Senator to bring people together to work WITH Obama to make her initiatives happen. He has promised he will work with both sides of the aisle. I know we'll see, but it's a good idea and I hope he means it.

Luna, I only really want to see her be as respected as she SHOULD be, and she must pick that path, not me. Nor any of us. The thing which has been truly historic about this election wasn't this primary race, it was that the ugly underside of our anti woman culture has been exposed. Marie Cocco wrote this a while back but it is even more worthwhile to read now.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/14/AR2008051403090.html?wpisrc=newsletter&wpisrc=newsletter&wpisrc=newsletter

JudiGem, All of us women have our work cut out for us. It is we who have to change the culture, not the people who attack women. I've always been a feminist, even when it became a dirty word after Limbaugh and other spewing heads turned it into a thing to spit at. The pendulum is gonna swing back at hit them hard on the back of their thick heads. I think most people are basically decent and whatever wrong thoughts they have can be changed. The few that won't should just be left to rot in their own bile.

Caucuses should be outlawed, as they are NOT democratic in the sense of one vote=one person. Or at the very very least, there should be a national coherent policy, not different policies for different states that causes national rifts like this. The repubs are getting exactly what they planned, a divided party. If you vote, you count.....if you don't vote, you don't count. Then it would be about the candidates raising the voluteers and money to be who they say they want to be. And Texas was the great eye opener on that. Clinton won Texas by votes and Obama won by the caucuses...how does THAT happen?

But the most egregious was the manipulation of the apportioning that went on last saturday by the rules committee. It is obvious that the DNC rules committee is certainly throwing the Clintons under the bus. Believe me, if this had ended in the opposite way, security would have to be increased on Hillary.

It is just politics as usual.

The 'first' black man trumped the 'first' woman .....we do have our work cut out for us.....lest you think that is a racist thought, please.....it is exactly what has been projected in the race. We have a LOT of work to do...and really, WHY should we have to work to get respect? Luna, the men don't have to....they just make the rules of how the game is played.

We've accepted that at the core of our being as the way things 'are', and that is why we lose continually. So that is what is going to take a lot of work, and Hillary has proven to be another one of the long line of women doing that work. And see how accepted she is....on the one hand, 18 million voted for her, on the other, she is called a 2 year old child by a punk. Give me a break, women will have to do a lot better than this.

“But for all Clinton’s political blemishes, the darker stain that has been exposed is the hatred of women that is accepted as a part of our culture.”

the last line in Marie Cocco's piece

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApDM6UaH1KA&feature=email

Bill Moyers....

Breaking News....Clinton & Obama are meeting at her DC home. He tricked the journalists by leaving them sitting on his plane, & then taking off, while he headed over to meet with her.
MSNBC

More pieces of the puzzle spill out!
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/kpete/6318

Fitzgerald to Conyers: “Okay, Now I’m Ready to Talk”
By: emptywheel Thursday June 5, 2008 6:51 am

Thanks to BayStateLibrul for pointing out this provocative comment from Patrick Fitzgerald after yesterday's Rezko verdict:
The White House Rasputin, Karl "The Architect" Rove, also was mentioned in the trial, as was former House Speaker Dennis "Don't Ask Me About My Land Deal" Hastert, alleged to have been part of an effort by the bipartisan Illinois Combine to get rid of Fitzgerald. To demonstrate their kinship, Cellini and Rezko flew out to Washington on a play date and visited a White House reception with President Bush, where Kjellander joined them......
more......although the link to emptywheel.firedoglake won't work!

qop, here you go.

http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/06/05/fitzgerald-to-conyers-okay-now-im-ready-to-talk/

Thanks QOP and PatC for the links to the Fitzgerald comments. I thought they were strange and people are going to be waiting to hear what he has to say, that's for sure. Odd choice of words "I'm ready to talk." I guess it seems strange because we are so sure Fitzgerald must have some pieces of quite a few puzzles, maybe he does and maybe he doesn't, I hope he does.

I do wonder why he had to stay silent. Is it some part of the law, or was he in danger?

Look! Junya has united us!!!

http://tinyurl.com/69mz3a

He's a uniter!

JudiGem, whatever plan Clinton had to restore the Middle Class ended when her husband signed off on NAFTA. Not that NAFTA was by any means the beginning of the American Industrial sector's decline. But it certainly did its part to encourage and accelerate that decline in rapid fashion, and Bill Clinton played a fundamental role in that development.

My point is, the solution is inherent in the problem. Namely the behavior of the Clintons themselves. I started to post this in an earlier response, but ran short on the time to do so. Clinton's "moral relativism" paved the way for his own undoing, first when he gave the elder George Bush a pass on his criminal activities, including the Iran-Contra scandal and his sons' involvement in the Savings and Loan crisis.

Had Clinton allowed for his Justice Department to conduct a full investigation of Bush Sr, there would be no "Bush Dynasty" today because that family's political fortunes would have been all but completely destroyed with the exposure of their utter disregard for the Constitution and the well being of humanity itself. Instead, he befriended Bush, allowing him to sweep his crimes under the rug.

There is also the case to be made that a full investigation of the elder Bush would have severely damaged the Republican Party, undermining or perhaps derailing completely the Gingrich-led Right-Wing Republican Revolution, which reached its peak in 1994. His failure to take a stand for what was just and in the best interest of the nation when it mattered most paved the way for his second term immobilization by Monica and the successful Reactionary manufacturing of George W. Bush "victory" over a weakened would-be successor in Gore. Mrs. Clinton campaign couldn't help but echo her husband's philosophical and moral bankruptcies nearly a decade later. How could they possibly save the fortunes of the same Middle Class they've assisted in decimating?

Neo...that is just crazy stuff. I wish people would stop blaming the Clintons for everything and their hangnails.

This present situation is an internal power struggle for control of the Democratic party.....

Neo, this one's for you.

http://www.salon.com/opinion/conason/2008/06/06/primary_aftermath/

Democrats, put down your swords

Mourn defeat, yes, but the destruction wreaked by the Bush administration leaves little room for factional fights and identity politics between today and Nov. 4.

By Joe Conason

For Democrats of all persuasions, the conclusion of the primaries should encourage reflection rather than recrimination. Now is the time to listen to the calm counsel that cannot be heard amid the roar of combat, and to think.

Hillary Clinton needs to think about how best to preserve the gains of her campaign without spoiling it all. Barack Obama must consider how best to unite his party while making choices, including a running mate, true to his own instincts and style. Meanwhile their supporters can take deep breaths and try to imagine how they will feel on Nov. 5 if John McCain has won the presidency.

Nothing could be more naive than to expect politics to be governed by the golden rule, even within a party whose leaders and activists are supposed to share the same ideals. But as a mental exercise, I suggest that the supporters of Clinton and Obama consider how they would wish their adversaries to behave if their positions were reversed -- if somehow she had narrowly defeated him instead of the way things actually turned out.

More at the link...

And yes it is a power struggle for power of the Party. They will sort it out. No one involved is a weakling. They'll do just fine without the spatting of the factions.

Lynn, this is a terrific astrological overview of Scotty Mac. One of the reasons he WILL continue to impact the players in this ungodly administration is in what he will reveal as time passes. He may be holding the best for "last." Hopefully timed before a decision to obliterate Iran. Hopefully before an "October Surprise" and what might come to pass as a result.

Uranus figures prominently in my own chart, conjuncting my Sun. It's a two-edged sword and i often find myself going where others fear to tread. :)

In politics the fat lady never sings. It ain't never over. Howard Dean was supposed to stay dead dammit! Now looky what he's dun done! I got this in an email

-----------------------
As we move toward the general election, the Democratic Party has to be the Party of
ordinary Americans, not Washington lobbyists and special interests. So, as of this
morning, if you're a federal lobbyist, or if you control political action committee
donations, we won't be accepting your donations.

http://www.democrats.org/nonlobbyists

Al Gore was supposed to stay dead too and look how that turned out.

Neo, I am sure Judi didn't mean that what you wrote was "crazy talk." That's information anyone can find and has been there for years as a question the Democratic Party had regarding the Clinton's although the Democrats didn't do anything about it. But you are right, the investigation into George Sr. was stopped in 1993, not only into the Savings and Loan but also the connection GHWB had to the Bin Laden family before, during and after the WTC bombing in 1993 and that is well documented, just as there has been little investigation into the policies and corruption of the present administration and no one knows why that is and has happened and yes, people are questioning why and lots of people are being blamed for it all, not just the Clinton's.

I would ask that everyone refrain from personal attacks on someone because of their opinion or interpretation on events.

A long time ago in the San Francisco Bay Area there was an innovative radio station called KSAN where we could rock all day and night to our music. If the commercials interfered, the deejay of the moment would sometimes just run them all at once so we could get back to the music. There was a brilliant fellow named "Scoop" Nisker who gave us nightly news montages and, since this was Vietnam-era, they could be very hard-hitting, all about the war, police brutality, political insanity and so on. Scoop always signed off with the statement, "If you don't like the news, go out and make some of your own."

By extension, if you don't like the results of the recent primary, then get to work right now to change the rules and the process--just don't wait until the next go-round and then try to change the rules and process in the middle of the primary when things aren't going your way.

Nice article by Conason, Pat C., and there are certainly others who need to read it, including those who feel victimized by recent events.
NAFTA has almost done us in and shutting down those investigations into BCCI, Iran-Contra, etc., ensured that the same players would come back another day to try and screw us all. NeoB was simply stating what I thought we all knew. I would add that we need to struggle mightily to move the in-coming Dem (we hope) House and Senate (and Dem President, if we get there, too) to undertake all the investigations that rightfully should be done in order to uphold our Constitution and remove all the sleaze and slime engulfing us and our institutions. Yes, let us make better news.

shy, I thought the article was interesting since I think Conason supported Hillary Clinton.

I just heard on MSNBC that Hillary is set to bow out at 12 noon tomorrow. I don't know where it is to be done.

Sally, I have always been mystified with the fact that every single administration has either pardoned, or refused to prosecute crimes committed by members of the prior administration. It has allowed the steady increase in the number and quality of crimes against the Constitution and Bill of Rights, not to mention down and dirty Rico atrocities. This administration showed us in bold actions how much they truly despise the people....how much they dismiss us, and what fodder we are in their terribly vicious game for riches and power. Now this President, like Reagan has used US soldiers in a war for corporate purposes. I wonder what will be done this time?

In the end I returned to my support for Clinton, I know that she learned how to swim with the sharks and did not get out without eating her pomegranete seeds-she is a wealthy woman now protected in the way bunches of money can protect but I love her voice and the way she sums up what my concerns are. i will support Obama nd my companion has supported him all along but I am afraid of his Neptune connection and the phrases that enchant but are never specific.
I guess I don't really trust the national level of things-too much wealth just floating around too much deceit too much mind control. I just saw an article saying that clinton doesn't understand the new way of communicating and shows her as Big Brother.so tell me are we for Obama or against Clinton-big difference there.

clymela, I second that post. You speak for me. The Neptune worries me more than I can say, along with all the rest of what you said.

I think it would be instructive to take a look at Dean's chart, because I think he is at the root of all of it.

http://therealnews.com/t/index.php

the Real news

Thank you Shy and PatC.

This is an article a poster on DU just put up with some backroom realities of politics. I have never gotten over the sense of watching a movie when dealing with politics, and you never know or can figure out who are the good guys or the bad guys; constantly leaving the theater somehow dissatisfied and uncomfortable or angry.

Someone is always dissatisfied with this movie. There are people who want to see more bloodshed, more torture, people who want to see more religion (several different religions) see more peace, see more women, see more minorities etc. We want to see less power or more power and everyone believes their idea of what the plot should be to make the whole thing perfect is the right plot, in the meantime we miss the plot because of all the pieces never explained.
On top of that, we are rarely satisfied with the actors chosen. I was born with the curse of just trying to unravel the threads of the plot only to find they go back over 200 years, even longer.

The movie never ends folks and no one is ever really satisfied with the plot, plus we argue and fight over what movie we are watching. Here are some interesting sub-plots explained.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x6299936

The thing is, it's not a movie.

No offense taken, Sally. I do understand the emotional involvement many people have for the candidate of their choice.

I think that's in part why it has taken me so long to warm up to the campaign season this year. I still remember how angry I was with John Kerry for not putting up a genuine fight against Bush and his cabal's dirty tactics. Kerry genuinely could have won, countering them on everything, while articulating a genuine vision for the nation, even by taking the high road with these folk. But he ran a half-hearted, ineffectual campaign, and we are all worse off for another four illegitimate years of Bush.

I once supported the Clintons, but with the revelations that Sally mentioned, and the subsequent ascendancy of Dubya for Clinton's failure to prosecute his father, I withdrew my support, blaming them for the Bushes unworthy ascendancy and return to power in 2000. I see Bill Clinton posing and jetting around the world now with old George Herbert Walker Bush, and I can't help but think that he has aligned himself with one of the slimiest, most corrupt and criminal politicians of our time. And as the old addage goes, one cannot lie down with dogs and help but rise up with fleas.

I believe Hillary's failure to win the nomination is part of the Clinton family's karma for failing to act in the better interests of the nation and the world when the opportunity was present for them to act. That's just how I see it.

In my view, Hillary declaring she would have opened the books on the previous administration and having Bill openly repudiate and distance himself from the Bush family and its corrupt and reprehensible practices would have been the greatest thing she could have done for her campaign, and would have given her the moral authority to claim that she really was a forward-looking candidate of reform. As things stand, she was and remains mired in the useless and corrupt status quo that has weighed us down for so long.

Now I admit at this point that I am not entirely sold on Barak Obama, and I don't think anyone should be, because blind allegiance to any particular candidate, ideology or party, as Pluto's time in Sagittarius has illustrated to us, can be a most dangerous and destructive thing.

Behold the grevious self-inflicted damage to the once powerful "true believing" wing of the Republican Party, which once held that party's reigns and thought it could impose its' ideology upon the rest of the country and the world itself. As Pluto finishes up in Sag, now the entire Grand Old Party as it stands, appears more and more like it might just take that "Grand Old Hiatus" from the political stage off into history. The Democrats, if they lapse into a similar, stubborn and violently ignorant mindlessness, might not make it either.

There is a time for everything, and a time for change. Ideas and the people who hold them, who resist or refuse to change when called to do so, become casualties of time.

A time of change once again confronts and challenges the United States, although in actuality, it has been facing us since the 1960s (Uranus Pluto Conjunction in Virgo). We simply chose to do everything else but acknowledge it, and the results of our determined ignorance are now evident. To the extent that we resolve to finally change with the times, empower ourselves and new, forward-looking leadership, we will meet and master this challenge of time. To the extent that we fail to meet the challenges of this time of change and remain entrenched in the status quo, we will become casualties of time, perhaps joining that endless list of failed movements, cultures and nations for future historians to someday unearth and analyze.

If I may be a little more clear, the Democrats and the Left (or what's left of it) must be careful not to make the mistake of beliving that a "female president" or a "minority (black, hispanic, etc.) president" alone will somehow solve all of our problems and serve on appearance alone as the self-evident panacea to right-wing politics.

If we lapse into that notion, we will fail every bit as much as the right wing evangelicals have, who believed that Bush, just for claiming "Born Again Christianity" would restore morality and decency to the White House and to America. We must examine and practice our politics on a far less simplistic basis if we are to be successful in governing and taking on the challenges that now confront us.

This needs no introduction... enjoy the "reality show."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF5Kdm4Eu6w&eurl

But it is a "movie" PatC, from a pure historical and quantum level life is all in our minds. Here in the US we are engaged in the political drama in this country and lord knows we have it, in the Middle East they are engaged in war and violence and lord knows they have it. The energy of the collective can change it from one thing to the other and we will as soon as we truely understand the movement of energy.

I completely agree NEO and before this primary started I reminded people not to get emotionally involved in one candidate or the other that's what got us into this mess with GWB. Neither Hillary nor Obama nor the Democratic Party is the second coming, neither is the GOP. The people cannot evaluate honestly or objectively unless we look at government and leaders honestly and objectively. We forget as a people that we elevate these people, those we call leaders throughout the world, they are not different from us in wants, needs or abuse of qualities. It is so easy to step off the path of good intentions if one believes their own press clippings, and hopefully we will be mindful of that.

Very wise words Neo!

Example of why we still need thorough investigations into BCCI:

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=4996285&page=1

http://tinyurl.com/69jf2h

The DOD just awarded $80M contract to a Saudi financier "who has been indicted by the US Justice Department . . . [and ] is wanted in connection with the . . . failed Bank of Credit and Commerce International (BCCI). . . ." There's much more.

Yes Neo, case well stated, and very balanced presentation.

You too, Sally. As you truly said, it's difficult to keep everyone happy.

I'm thinking Shy that between now and January 20th this administration is going to shift into high gear and drain everything they can from what's left in the US and leave as much as they can in even more shambles. I don't know who is there to stop the flow, or will stop the flow.

Everyone buy your video cams, the RNC and McCain wants everyone to spy on their neighbors with a video and send it in to see who will win first prize capturing "Islamofacists" or whatever nasty word they use to identify people of Middle Eastern descent. I am guessing this is a way to re-energize their own neo-con base and show people they still have much much to fear. One keeps thinking it cannot go lower, but surprise it does.

Neo, what I meant by 'crazy' talk is the emphasis on the past, the blaming of the Clintons, the ignoring of the very little difference between Hillary and Obama on issues, except Hillary voted more on all of them and is more liberal than O it seems. AND, above all, the idea that in this history of our country that anyone has EVER prosecuted a former president when they came into office. Truly, what the 'crazy' represents is 'neptunian'....I apologize, I was dealing with high emotion and should have considered this more carefully.

I really really really don't think we will see much progress in these kind of wishes for prosecution, although one wishes it would happen....and really, Bill Clinton jaunting all over the world with Bush sr has nothing to do with politics, and everything to do with post presidential diplomacy, another kind of tradition (and remember, it was Bush sr. who threatened BC in 1991 with being 'gotten' if he ran against him)....it was the tsunami which Bill and George were dealing with then, remember? And I would bring in another issue about another Congressional behavior....it is considered normal in DC to run a hard campaign against their opponents, but NOT to take it to the personal level, which is why so many speeches are prefaced by 'my good friend Senator so in so'....this is the language and the ways in which the government has learned to deal with these emotions. It is historical....we may find it hypocritical, but it works for them.

The realities of Washington DC (Saturn) are up against the neptunian wishes for a higher spiritual calling and enough people believe that this new zeitgeist represented by Obama will supercede the old ways.

I wouldn't count on it.

On the other hand, Mark Morford has written a nice piece on Obama's impact...
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2008/06/06/notes060608.DTL&nl=fix

Neo, this is in your neck of the woods. What is Ohio doing about it ?

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/6/5/20956/61571/286/530606

http://tinyurl.com/6b6uon

The Clintons, along with many of the activists closest to them, are veterans of the civil rights struggle, notably Harold Ickes, the hard-bitten lawyer and advisor who was nearly beaten to death by a racist gang in Mississippi more than 40 years ago while trying to register black voters. What Obama represents is a future for which they fought valiantly before he was born. It is ironic, of course, that the price of that triumph has turned out to be so high for them personally.

from Joe Conason's article which Pat C posted.

Morgana, that is news to me. I might have readily expected to see and hear about such an incident in Cincinnati, for instance, given that city's history, culture and politics, or outside of the state's major metropolitan areas.

There has been nothing apparently mentioned about it in Columbus' local media. Perhaps the underground? Certainly it is a black eye to the city and the state of Ohio itself. I shouldn't be surprised, yet it seems that Columbus, which is home to and increasingly prides itself upon fostering a culture of youth and diversity, is by no means immune to such levels of violent ignorance. Let me see what I can find out.

Do any of you keep up with "Matthew's messages?" This came out a few days ago:

Attention is being given around the globe to the United States presidential candidates. Despite the rigged primary elections to favor Hillary Clinton and John McCain’s supporters waffling because he himself waffles, soon it will be glaringly apparent that Barack Obama’s greater popularity among voters will be sustained. Thus free will choices of the majority have been made and now, without influencing those choices one whit, we can reveal that in the energy field of potential, Obama’s momentum always was unstoppable, and we can tell you that this highly evolved soul with many lifetimes as a wise and just leader came from a spiritually and intellectually advanced civilization specifically to rise to his current prominence. At soul level he knows this is his mission, but consciously he is aware only of his innate leadership abilities and genuine intent to serve his nation as he so states; in time he will become consciously aware of his origin and purpose for embodying in this lifetime. Once he is in office, some darkly-intentioned persons expect to control him just as they and others before them have controlled a succession of US presidents and many members of Congress. However, that vicious kind of governing is at an end, and contrary to the protestations of Hillary Clinton that this race is not over, she and other top Illuminati know they are witnessing the demise of their “secret government”; therefore, the Obama family members are among the most intensely light-protected persons on Earth.

http://www.matthewbooks.com/mm/anmviewer.asp?a=88&z=2

I thought that quite interesting ... however, there is no way for us to verify the truth, of course. Just thought it of interest.

\Bush is the new Hoover.

http://www.truthout.org/article/a-tale-two-conservatives-comparing-bush-and-hoover-economy

Not a pretty sight:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080606/ap_on_bi_st_ma_re/wall_street

Laurie, being an Obama loyalist, I'm glad to hear that. It's what I have always felt about him, and I've made myself enough of a nuisance on this board where he's concerned. Unfortunately, as you said, it can't be proven, but we can only "hope"!

Yet Laurie, I still have that nagging concern, that November is a long way away, and anything can happen.

Crystal - yes indeed, we can hope. I have always liked Obama a great deal, but after seeing his speech at AIPAC(?) I just "felt" the destiny in him and I can't help but imagine a circle of protection around him, sending him light as much as I can.

Hey Laurie, if that be the truth, my heart is filled with great joy!

... a little bit of amusement, perhaps? Check out Brilliant Sun Signs (short video theater ...:)

http://astroknavery.wordpress.com/

Why Hillary Needed to Lose the Election ..... Darmarucci (a soft, polite exposition - interesting astro - no bombs)

http://astrotabletalk.blogspot.com/

Degrees of Significance: The Nomination of Barack Obama

Written by Chris Floyd

http://www.chris-floyd.com/

"The two candidates emerged laughing from their hour-long meeting."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080606/ap_on_el_pr/clinton

Clinton, Obama talks held without aides present

WASHINGTON - Democrat Hillary Rodham Clinton met rival Barack Obama face-to-face with no one else present, hours before her campaign formally announced she would endorse him Saturday at an event in Washington.

California Sen. Dianne Feinstein said Friday the two Democratic presidential candidates arrived separately at her home for their Thursday night meeting. Feinstein said she took them to her living room, where they sat "in two comfortable chairs facing one another" and then she left the room. No one else was present during the meeting and nothing was served except water.

"There was a desire on both sides, I think, to have private meeting," Feinstein said.

The two candidates emerged laughing from their hour-long meeting.

The California senator had gone up stairs to do her own work when the meeting began at 9 p.m. EDT.

"They called me when it was over," Feinstein said. "I came down and said, `Good night everybody, I hope you had a good meeting.' They were laughing, and that was it."

more...

Veering totally off topic and into different universes...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/7440217.stm

Hints of 'time before Big Bang'

Cosmic microwave background could hold clues about the Big Bang

A team of physicists has claimed that our view of the early Universe may contain the signature of a time before the Big Bang.

The discovery comes from studying the cosmic microwave background (CMB), light emitted when the Universe was just 400,000 years old.

Their model may help explain why we experience time moving in a straight line from yesterday into tomorrow.

Details of the work have been submitted to the journal Physical Review Letters.

The CMB is relic radiation that fills the entire Universe and is regarded as the most conclusive evidence for the Big Bang.

Although this microwave background is mostly smooth, the Cobe satellite in 1992 discovered small fluctuations that were believed to be the seeds from which the galaxy clusters we see in today's Universe grew.

Dr Adrienne Erickcek, and colleagues from the California Institute for Technology (Caltech), now believes these fluctuations contain hints that our Universe "bubbled off" from a previous one.

more...

The list of the 2008 Bilderberg attendees

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x3398720

Tom Daschle and Condaleeza Rice are attendees

Remember those poor telecom companies who are so terrified of being sued by people who don't like having their Constitutional Right to Privacy violated that they just must have Congress give them a get-out-of-jail-free card?

Well, in 2007 alone, they received about $2.7billion in US government contracts (our tax dollars at work, doncha know).

http://tinyurl.com/425ude

Also, Kathleen Sebilius, gov. of Kansas - think there's a clue there?

Kathleen Sebelius = Bilderberg attendee

Marta, this is absolutely adorable!

http://astroknavery.wordpress.com/

I noticed that too! NOLASharon!
Good posts tonight!

Edwards was invited to the Bilderberg Meeting when Kerry was picking Veeps, however everyone on Edwards list has already been vetted by the Bilderberg group in years past.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/6/7/92258/44097/570/522178

Sally that's an interesting take on six maybe veep candidates. I have to say I liked the dark horse, Russ Feingold, or Clair McCaskill.

Morning all.

Happy Birthday JudiGem.
Hope it is as beautiful day in CA as it is here!

http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/nelson-bill-would-abolish-electoral-college-2008-06-06.html

Nelson bill would abolish Electoral College
By Michael O'Brien

Sen. Bill Nelson (D-Fla.) introduced a constitutional amendment to abolish the Electoral College on Friday, less than a week after the Democrats settled on how to handle delegates from Florida at their national convention.

“It’s time for Congress to really give Americans the power of one-person, one-vote, instead of the political machinery selecting candidates and electing our president,” Nelson said in a release announcing the amendment.

Nelson had announced he would offer the legislation in an address to his state’s senate in March.

Nelson said his principal argument for making the change is that the Electoral College permits a candidate with fewer votes nationally to win the presidency by capturing narrow victories in big states. In 2000, then-Vice President Al Gore won the popular votes but George W. Bush won the Electoral College.

Nelson cited that election along with this year’s contentious Democratic primary in Florida as reasons for his legislation. He sued the DNC last fall for initially refusing to recognize Florida’s full delegation at the Democratic National Convention.

more...

Thank you NolaSharon, glad you enjoyed it ... he has an excellent sense of comedic timing and nailed it!

Happy Bday Judigem!

Beware of Salmonella poisoning from raw tomatoes:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080607/ap_on_he_me/salmonella_tomatoes

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x144347
Obama speaks to HQ staff. MUST WATCH.

This is an awesome 13 minute speech where he really conveys the immense weight on the shoulders of these (mostly) young staffers. The country is depending on them.

Well, now, this is really interesting (note the dates):
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tag/clinton-burkle

Particularly, when you consider this:
http://tinyurl.com/5felcy

Do you think the Obama campaign will stand firm against this sleaze? We'll see.

Happy Birthday Judi hope the birthday fairy was so good to you.

The problem with politicians Shy is they do have to lay down with dogs and do get up with fleas. McCain has already sold his soul completely, I am counting on Obama maybe having to dance with the devil but he doesn't have to go home with him. Obama introduced a bill in the Senate for transparency hope it passes. When I think about the giant lumbering behemoth we call a government, I cannot even imagine the people one must deal with in order to even begin to turn it into a new way. Jack and Bobby wouldn't dance and they are dead, what good has that done us in the long run.

A friend of mine said she saw Obama's IQ published and it was 172, I don't know how accurate that is but he will need every single degree of it to lift this country up, even with our help.

I saw an interesting clip from Sicko where some American ex-pats were talking about the benefits of living in France. One woman said "the difference was in France the government is afraid of the people, and in America the people were afraid of the government." I wonder if we can ever get over that fear and continue to stand up ourselves in this country.

Sadly, that fear seems firmly embedded in many, Cap'n Sally. If the aftermath of Katrina didn't stir people to action, what will? It did lead people to question and, finally, shed any allegiance to BushCo, but nobody rose up. Of course, when people try to, they are penned in in "Free Speech" zones or else the marches by millions are simply ignored. The futuristic stuff they've developed for crowd control is really horrifying. Tasers are bad enough, but they have much worse now.

Imagine a future if this kind of thing continues to be tolerated. Time to put away your video games, turn off the Faux nooze, and go shopping at the local Wal-Mart (there being no alternative). You line up to get access to a vacant computer, and there enter the products you'll be needing. The Wal-Mart computer has a detailed demographic profile on you and, of course, can compare your current shopping requests with what you've ordered previously. It will tell you if you've exceeded your quota of milk, flour, leafy green vegetables, etc., for the month, so don't expect them in your bag. Then you walk over to the long counter with check-out machines, insert your Wal-Mart credit card into one and ok the transaction, walk through the one-way turnstile and onward to the carousels, find your package, then proceed to the exit, showing your receipt and package to the Blackwater guard, who inspects to make sure all is in order, then allows you to leave.

Shy, that is exactly why I am learning to grow my own, and learning make my own. I moved out of the big OC in 1994, Oct 31 in fact to live in the Santa Cruz Mountains. Fresh water source with a climate favorable to growing food. Plus natural medicine since I don't want to be held hostage to big Pharma and their poisons. I recently read an article about the cancer immunization that is mandatory for girls is causing these 11 and 12 year old girls to become paralyzed, permanently, it's only 1 in several thousand, no big deal right? I'm betting there will be an entire generation of sterile women. Oh oops so sorry, so sad too bad. The other nifty drug they are marketing lets you have a period twice a year, boy how to screw up your body in one easy step.

Ok that's my rant for the day.

I hear ya, Miz Morgana, but what if they outlawed all seeds except Monsanto-engineered ones? That situation is leading to suicides among farmers in India:
http://tinyurl.com/6ay8kn

and I think Afghanistan is also under contract to use Monsanto-engineered seeds. 'Course the opium harvests in Afghanistan are booming, I read, so I guess enforcement is selective (or: follow the money).

Sigh.

Shy, I suspect there would be a lot of illegal seeds procured. Thirty farmer suicides a day due to debt, and dead earth ... I smell something else.

We've a long road back to sanity.

Yeh!.
Because of my trip didn't get to buy seeds from the local co-op. ( because they are small, they have limited access.......order by "given date" pick up by "given date" no personnel there at other times. BUT they are collecting only heirloom seeds from local farmers, and or monitoring those from other sources carefully.
My local market sells Burpee seeds........so I looked them up on line. Company started by a Huegonot descendant from New Brunswick in Pa, NJ.Good so far.... I grew up a hoot & hollar from their Fordhook Farm in NJ ( you know "fordhook lima beans" their's!)
I called the customer S to ask and got a rather rude reception....& a "family farm", bla, bla,...speech, when I asked if they had been bought by Monsanto.
SO I Googled Monsanto.sure enough they own Seminis seeds> owns Burpee & JOHNNY"S. SO I called Johnny's and got some straight answers. NOT GM seeds, "I wouldn't be working here if they did. It's a mistake!"
SO I called Burpees again on the paid line got the same woman............. ( sort of a nazi type) "DIdn't I just talk to you I told you .....bla, bla.
SO I am screaming." Monsanto caused 200,000 Indian Farmers to commit suicide! I NEED to know!" At which point she asked me to hold, went & consulted someone & came back & asked for my e-mail so she could send me a WRITTEN statement, of their seeds purity! SO I have that! & after all that drama, I didn't buy any seeds.,they are almost sold out.
Have you noticed since M bought out Seminis, they recall the seeds from the stores in August? God forbid your window sill parsley dies in Dec. You have to wait till spring to plant some more! ( Stockpile)
I noticed on the main M site, a division of catagories. The home gardener (for now) is allowed to plant what they are accustomed to plant. ( Like Demonstrators are allowed to gather in "free speech zones")
The M commercial gardener section might be a whole different story!

We only need a few dozen of you, QOP, and the world would be a much safer and saner place.

On another front: look at what some of our Dem congresscritters done went 'n done:

http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Dems_tell_Justice_Dept._to_examine_0607.html

This could be the start of something big, too!

I believe it's Comment 45 at the end of this article that discusses the implications of that letter from the Dem congresscritters. Fascinating.

http://tinyurl.com/5qc24j

And while you're over there, you might want to check out the latest posting regarding Scott McC.

Sorry to be so "newsy" today and hogging things, but I just caught this one.

http://tinyurl.com/5mue5o

Gotta stop all 'em aborshuns!

This thing, accepted for the Colorado state ballot, would outlaw even terminating ectopic pregnancies. In other words, even in instances where the woman's life is threatened.

Yep, some folks are skeert to death of wimmin. Wanna kill us all.

GOTV, Colorado!

Earthquake hits Greece:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080608/ap_on_re_eu/greece_earthquake

This will make you smile. Felton is in the San Lorenzo Valley, Boulder Creek where I live the water district is publicly owned and we vote for the management. Felton wasn't connected to our water resources. Hip hip hooray for people power!

Small Town Overthrows Corporate Giant for Control of Water

http://www.alternet.org/water/87182/

I think I took up more bandwidth with my one post than you have with several including valuable links, Shy!.....
Funny how they want to keep all the foetuses alive & kill off huge numbers of others!
Link TV had a good documentary on farming/Monsanto, in India last year sometime.

http://www.circleofblue.org/waternews/world/china-tibet-and-the-strategic-power-of-water/

China, Tibet, and the strategic power of water

..........The Tibetan Plateau is an oxygen-scarce landscape of enormous glaciers, huge alpine lakes, and mighty waterfalls – a storehouse of freshwater so bountiful that the region serves as the headwaters for many of Asia’s largest rivers, including the Yellow, Yangtze, Mekong, Brahmaputra, Salween, and Sutlej, among others. According to studies by the United Nations and several prominent global environmental organizations, almost half of the world’s population lives in the watersheds of the rivers whose sources lie on the Tibetan Plateau.......

Sally, had a good birthday, great feast prepared by daughter and son in law, lots of friends, and the damn wind had FINALLY stopped blowing, and it was beautiful..Even went painting in the morning...good first day of my geezerette years...

The funniest moment was when this incredible cake from the place where all the great deserts are made in SF for hotels, cafes and restarurants was brought to the table with one candle (a big zero) on it....my son in law always buys profiterol cake for my daughter, and this time for me....beauty of a cake, filled with profiterols and topped with them, also, with a big oblong of white chocolate draped over the chocolate and fruit top....written in chocholate on the white oblong was:

Happy Birthday Judy
for Mike McAuliffe

See...he had written out the greeting for me on a piece of paper and signed 'for Mike McAuliffe" under it so they'd know which cake to put it on!!!!

We laughed so hard....
-----
Morgana, the evils in the world continue apace....as business people try to corner markets and reduce supplies....riots in Egypt about flour rationing...perhaps because the government made bakeries the 'middleman' in flour distribution in order to drive up prices?

it still makes me think of that which I've been told from several sources...that is, the reduction of the world's population which is the goal.... and in the works. How? reduce the food supplies.

Pretty simple, huh?

Best short story description of Monsanto tactics in this country, Michael Pollan's book The Biology of Desire...the section (1 of 4) on potatoes.

the story of Felton backing down the water lords is very very hopeful...and proves that bullies can be 'had'....

as long as one doesn't back down.

Woot! Woot! If this stands, it will make it harder for them to taser us while we're in Free Speech Zone pens, etc.

http://tinyurl.com/3fexoc

Shy, I'm betting on Wal-Mart itself being dead or close to it on or around 2015. Or at least, so predicts Robert Gover of StarIQ.

--

April 2015 Eclipse

Pluto, in June 2004, was also opposite a point between Wal-Mart’s Venus and Sun-Moon conjunction, while Saturn and Mercury were moving conjunct Wal-Mart’s Sun and Moon, and Wal-Mart’s Saturn was hit by a Neptune conjunction. With all the heavy economic indicators—Saturn, Uranus, Neptune and Pluto—afflicting, the long-range outlook for Wal-Mart’s success is in doubt. This pattern reflects the growing disenchantment with Wal-Mart.

To assess Wal-Mart’s fortunes in the future, I chose the eclipse in April 2015, for that is when the USA’s natal planetary positions are to be hit the hardest and we can expect the most difficult times. A Uranus-Pluto square will form a Grand Cross pattern with the Sun-Saturn square in the US nativity. Given the past history of Uranus-Pluto squares which hit these points, you can bet the farm that the 2000-teens will be volatile. How will Wal-Mart be impacted during this time?

Wal-Mart’s Sun-Moon conjunction in Cancer will be negatively impacted by the Uranus-Pluto grand cross, and also by the Sun-Moon opposition eclipse. It will be a miracle if the world’s largest and most successful retailer survives this period—unless it finds the ways and means to revolutionize its operation and adapt to new circumstances.

Astrologer Manfred Zimmel of Austria, editor of the financial newsletter Amanita, has pointed to this time, the 2000-teens, as the probable end of capitalism as we know it. Wal-Mart epitomizes this dilemma for capitalism—it generates record profits by bringing a cornucopia of products to consumers at rock-bottom prices, yet becomes a drain on these same consumers as taxpayers. This speaks to its Mercury conjunction with the US Mars-square-Neptune. In a society focused on big corporate profits, the costs to society tend to disappear in a Neptunian mist.

What the upcoming Uranus-Pluto square and grand cross promise is a rebalancing of the US and world economy. Wal-Mart could survive this difficult period if it questions its belief in the version of capitalism which has spawned its amazing success. But the chances of that are about the same as the Vatican questioning the Immaculate Conception.

http://www.stariq.com/Main/Articles/P0006293.HTM
--

What's even more interesting is that it seems a significant number of the current retailing behemoths -- Wal-Mart, Target, Best Buy, etc. -- were founded in 1964. Hmm... I wonder what was going on that year? Another eclipse? It seems likely that the age of "Big Box" retailing is at an end.

As for why Americans fear their government, I haven't the slightest idea, but I think it probably has much to do with people taking for face value, too much of what they see and hear from the corporate media. However, I don't think the younger generations (Pluto in Libra, Scorpio and Sagittarius) are necessarily buying into it. I was flipping channels on the radio today and I heard a female right-wing talk show host complaining to a retired Colonel guest about what they can do to restore patriotism and respect for the country among the youth and that an entire generation has already been lost. His response? Bring back THE DRAFT.

They just don't get it. The old ways are dying. In fact, they are already dead, hence the big conservative fuss over trying to revive them. Forcing the young to submit to the fears and cowardice of certain aged individuals will not foster or restore their confidence in what they perceive to be a broken system.

Conservatives didn't help their own cause any by trashing the very constitutional laws they merely claim to revere and imposing the PATRIOT ACT. Prior to that, they foisted a criminally inept George W. Bush upon the country and had the nerve to expect people to kiss his behind.

Young people are far smarter than many of their elders give them credit. If you don't have respect for something, you can't fear it, and the nation's young haven't had a great deal of respect for the U.S. Government since Bush and Cheney stole the 2000 election. That contempt was then reinforced in 2004. It's been stewing for awhile. I don't think it's necessarily ready to burst out into the open yet. That may be some time yet in the making.

I can say this, however. Many of the young have found something in Obama that resonates within them. Their experience with him, shared through successes and failures will determine whether they seriously get involved to take charge of and change the current system from within, or find outside means of doing so.

I would also warn any of the fearful among the aged that attempts made, either overt or covert at thwarting the ambitions of the young might very well lead them down the path of the French, who do not fear their leaders or their structures of power. Then again, maybe that wouldn't entirely be a bad thing?

This is a good follow up.
Attonement? The least she could do!
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/09/arts/09sand.html?th&emc=th
Former Justice Promotes Web-Based Civics Lessons
Yet there she was, a notable figure in modern history, at once engaging and imposing as she explained why she had embraced the Internet and interactive digital media as an essential tool for preserving American democracy. In cooperation with Georgetown University Law Center and Arizona State University, Justice O’Connor is helping develop a Web site and interactive civics curriculum for seventh-, eighth- and ninth-grade students called Our Courts (www.ourcourts.org). The initial major elements of the site are scheduled to become available this fall. more..........

http://www.motherearthnews.com/Nature-Community/2008-06-01/Discuss-Emergency-Preparedness.aspx?utm_source=iPost&utm_medium=email

News from Mother: Despair? Determination? Delight? — Let’s Discuss

Excellent points, Neo. Their ignorance is perfectly illustrated in the draft reference you made. That they think reinstatement of the draft is the way to go just shows how very far removed they are from reality. If they reimposed the draft, the youth of this country would explode. I have every confidence in that--and in them. And, yes, I think they are fired up about Obama because they are completely turned off by the wretched policies and actions that have culminated in the last seven and a half years. They want no more of that, and they are very aware of the real power (multinationals) manipulating behind the scenes to defeat the human spirit.

Along those lines is this very fitting tribute to one of our Truthspeakers:

http://tinyurl.com/6r7h7g

And here you go, QOP. Sowing the seeds of malnutrition, starvation and death.

http://reclaimdemocracy.org/articles/2008/corporate_institutions_destroy_agriculture.php

That cake sounds fantastic but I don't know if it's fair to describe it to us, for me it's kind of early in the morning to be drooling. "Geezerhood?" No, Gemini's are never old.

Although, speaking of Geezers, Alaska's Ted Stevens is way down in the polls for his return bid to the Senate. Ted with his "internet is just a bunch of tubes and his bridge to nowhere" and pocketing of un-earned funds he and his son drained off Alaska, just may lose. Can't say how happy that makes me, Ted needs to find another career.

Neo, fascinating article and yes, capitalism is beginning to gasp it's last breath in the US and I think rising in other areas such as Mexico, India and China. In fact to all the countries that to whom we've sold the US. People who have been denied entry into the capitalistic society will now begin to benefit as we struggle to find our new path in this country.

I listened to a clip of Obama speaking to his campaign team in Chicago and he said "when we started this I was 30 percent down in the polls and it didn't look as if there was a chance of us winning and if we hadn't won Iowa we would be working now to help all the Democratic candidates win, we would be raising money and speaking on their behalf in strengthening the Democratic principles in this country. But we did win and now we have to work harder because people in this country are burnt out, they see the American Dream falling apart and feel hopeless and discouraged to the point of being immobilized, they are counting on us now to lift this country up. In Iowa we really didn't have to win, but we did and now we've gotta win and take this country back."

That's what the young are resonating to, a hope a belief that life doesn't always have to be the way they've come to see it. Obama has held something up to them that makes them see "change is real and a possibility." The young and the young in heart and spirit will help to make it happen, not Obama. It's because he believes in change and has shown them it could happen, that they believe in him and that is what a visionary leader brings to a business or world. My hope is corruption has had it's run in this country.

There is an opposition between Saturn and Uranus on election day. That is known as the most restrictive of aspects, even cruel. It's also an aspect of challenge between the old and the new. The Democratic candidate represents the new in this case and could tip the see saw in the direction of change, the restrictive piece of this aspect could be our own restrictions upon ourselves. Perhaps we will set our own restrictive boundaries in order to build back what we've lost. The GOP wants to tell us what to do, maybe we will begin governing ourselves and doing what we need to do. That's my hope. It will take more than one generation to hammer out our addiction to fear but this is a start.

This is an article from an interview with Obama in 1995 and details his vision fairly well I think

http://www.chicagoreader.com/features/stories/archive/barackobama/

Letters and calls, they need letters and calls!

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/6/4/141930/1573/364/529511

FISA Fight: Reyes Ready to Capitulate

House Intelligence Chairman Silvestre Reyes says he's "fine" with the Republicans' FISA "compromise" because "We knew we weren't going to get everything, but we need to get this done," according to National Journal's Congress Daily [subscription req.]...

snip

Why the House leadership seems so intent on snatching defeat from the jaws of victory remains even more unclear. Pelosi--you won back in February. And since you won back in February, you've stolen three Republican House seats in special elections. What more indication could you possibly need that there's no percentage in it at all for Democrats to capitulate to the Republicans on this?

Add in the fact that you've got the John McCain tied up in knots over this issue, and you've got to wonder what in the hell House leadership is thinking. Do they not understand politics? Do they not understand that they can give Barack Obama a political edge by NOT passing a bill he has already stated his opposition to?

It is well within Pelosi's power to block legislation. She did it with Colombia free trade, she can do it with the Protect AT&T Act.

Update: Call Pelosi (202-225-4965, Fax: 202-225-8259) and Hoyer (202-225-4131, Fax: 202-225-4300) and tell them the Bond bill is unacceptable. Tell them that, if any action is necessary, it would be better to vote to extend the PAA for a year than to give up everything they gained in the bill they passed in February.

More at the link....

Can't even get through to Pelosi's office, but Hoyer's phone was working. Do call, y'all!

Sally that was a terrific article on Obama. How did you find that? I see it's all the way from 1995. My curiosity about Obama piqued when I read his anti Iraq-war speech (masterful speech), and his 2004 Democratic Convention speech, so I decided to buy his 2 books and read them, and I was sold on him after that. I know he's somebody special.

Sally that was a terrific article on Obama. How did you find that? I see it's all the way from 1995. My curiosity about Obama piqued when I read his anti Iraq-war speech (masterful speech), and his 2004 Democratic Convention speech, so I decided to buy his 2 books and read them, and I was sold on him after that. I know he's somebody special. Just hope he can remain uncorrupted.

The Story of Barack Obama's Mother

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1729524-2,00.html

John McCain: Putin Is The President Of Germany

http://www.oliverwillis.com/index.php/2008/06/09/john-mccain-putin-is-the-president-of-germany

Chicago Trib on Obama's political exprtise...

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chi-070403obama-ballot,0,1843097.story?,page=1

Breaking News:
Articles of Impeachment Being Introduced in Congress Right Now

Right now, Monday night, Rep. Dennis Kucinich is on the floor of the House of Representatives introducing articles of impeachment against George W. Bush. He is presenting a 35 count indictment which is being broadcast on C-Span. We will provide a more detailed update, but wanted to be sure to let everyone know right away.

The intense work of the ImpeachBush.org/VoteToImpeach membership is forcing impeachment on the table. During ImpeachBush.org's National Call In Day for Impeachment held just one week ago, the offices of Rep. John Conyers were flooded with calls demanding impeachment. We have received reports that there were more calls than could even be answered.
Make a donation

Please take a brief moment right now to donate to support the impeachment effort - together we can make impeachment a reality.
ITS ON CSPAN!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3345338

Wow, 3 amazing articles spoke to me, and a great Youtube video

The one on Obama on the verge of running for Senator was very interesting and just affirmed what most of us know but the one on his mother was damn inspiring and moving - now we know where he gets his courage and ability to inspire from.

The Chicago Trib article on the strategies used was a little hard to take - we don't want him to be down & dirty or to win based on less than his merits, but this one seemed to say he is a winner, and he proved that to us. People say it was the DNC who pushed him over the top, the DNC responding to Robert Wexler's arguments maybe? Either way, he's there and I think he will be quite effective "doing the people's business." I actually think he will win, even though I have my moments when I worry about it.

As far as the Dylan piece, Shy, thank you. The images fit the words so well that it brought a double richness to the words (though I really didn't understand them most of the time, at least in a cohesive way). But the images chosen were marvelous and I would say that was Dylan still at his peak. I sure wish he kept writing in that vein, truthful, penetrating observations of our society expressed poetically and with impact. I didn't like the new Dylan with his electric guitar and heavy rock (whatever).

Oooooo! Article 33 of the Articles of Impeachment is an ass kicker!

Do tell us more, Pat C.

Link?

Has anyone else started to notice that the media itself is getting some much needed scrutiny lately? It may be another of the karmic fallout results of the media going so overboard with their Bush flattery and obfuscation and with their Hillary bashing (Dowd and Olberman for example). People in the media as well as others are coming forward and speaking out about what most of us saw and knew was going on.

Here's an article by Vincent Bugliosi, the prosecutor who put Manson in jail, in which he goes after the media...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/vincent-bugliosi/the-prosecution-of-george_b_102427.html

The Prosecution of George W. Bush for Murder

[snip]
Perhaps the most amazing thing to me about the belief of many that George Bush lied to the American public in starting his war with Iraq is that the liberal columnists who have accused him of doing this merely make this point, and then go on to the next paragraph in their columns. Only very infrequently does a columnist add that because of it Bush should be impeached. If the charges are true, of course Bush should have been impeached, convicted, and removed from office. That's almost too self-evident to state. But he deserves much more than impeachment. I mean, in America, we apparently impeach presidents for having consensual sex outside of marriage and trying to cover it up. If we impeach presidents for that, then if the president takes the country to war on a lie where thousands of American soldiers die horrible, violent deaths and over 100,000 innocent Iraqi civilians, including women and children, even babies are killed, the punishment obviously has to be much, much more severe. That's just common sense. If Bush were impeached, convicted in the Senate, and removed from office, he'd still be a free man, still be able to wake up in the morning with his cup of coffee and freshly squeezed orange juice and read the morning paper, still travel widely and lead a life of privilege, still belong to his country club and get standing ovations whenever he chose to speak to the Republican faithful. This, for being responsible for over 100,000 horrible deaths?* For anyone interested in true justice, impeachment alone would be a joke for what Bush did.

Let's look at the way some of the leading liberal lights (and, of course, the rest of the entire nation with the exception of those few recommending impeachment) have treated the issue of punishment for Bush's cardinal sins. New York Times columnist Paul Krugman wrote about "the false selling of the Iraq War. We were railroaded into an unnecessary war." Fine, I agree. Now what? Krugman just goes on to the next paragraph. But if Bush falsely railroaded the nation into a war where over 100,000 people died, including 4,000 American soldiers, how can you go on to the next paragraph as if you had been writing that Bush spent the weekend at Camp David with his wife? For doing what Krugman believes Bush did, doesn't Bush have to be punished commensurately in some way? Are there no consequences for committing a crime of colossal proportions?

more...

If anyone thinks this is just a coincidence or that it isn't due to more severe weather due to global warming then when was the last time we heard of a dam breaking in the US?

http://feeds.bignewsnetwork.com/index.php?sid=368997

US dam bursts open after heavy flooding
Monday 9th June, 2008

A dam in Wisconsin, in the mid-west US, has split open, washing away some homes.

The dam, in Wisconsin Dells, a family holdiday area which is sometimes known as “the waterpark capital of the world,” has been subject to torrential rains.

No deaths or injuries were reported, although residents were urged to evacuate before the dam burst.

The area which is famous for its scenic lakes and resorts, was one of the areas threatened by a series of drenching mid-west storms in recent weeks.

The failure of the Delton Dam on Lake Delton caused mudslides that swept away a few homes.

The water has now formed a new tributary to the Wisconsin River, which eventually empties into the Mississippi River.

The southern half of Wisconsin has now been declared a disaster area.

Similar disaster areas have also been declared in recent days in Iowa and Indiana, with flooding also affecting parts of Illinois, Michigan and Minnesota.

end of article...

Oh, this is wrong. This is just so wrong!

http://tinyurl.com/673axq

shy, here are a couple.

http://kucinich.house.gov/spotlightissues/documents.htm

http://www.atlargely.com/

Of course on MSM, they are talking about tomatoes.

MCaine is speaking at the Small Biz council in DC .He is being heckled badly.
DO I recognize the voices of the Code Pink crowd!

Some kind of destruction going on in the Mid-West with those floods. Don't know if anyone saw those spectacular pictures of the 3 homes that fell into the river in Wisconsin, and these were not flimsy buildings. They looked like well constructed almost new, sizeable homes. The raging waters split them in half before pulling them down into the river. They looked just like doll-houses. I heard a guy on the news yesterday remark that water was the most powerful of the 4 elements. Don't know if that is a fact, but it looked plenty powerful in those camera shots yesterday.

Crystal, I was searching the Chicago papers for any old articles on Obama to see what there might be regarding his past associations, all the articles were positive about what was then a very young man trying to get something done. This article I thought was the best because it was an interview and you could see his ground up vision for communities and I think that's what he is trying to do as a President. It would be very ambitious but maybe people are ready to step into a different way of being as we moved toward a shift in consciousness. Obama is not the second coming or even close but I do think he is a beginning to the change we've been seeking. While the US might fall as a consummer nation, we could rise in other areas.

PatC, of course they are talking about Tomatoes (the MSM) not impeachment, move on here, let go of that kind of thinking. Why what on earth have these people done (this administration) to be so attacked and even want to impeach them. Yea to DK for having the courage to stand up there and read the articles of impeachment and once again the power of the internet just could "foil" this administration and the MSM. I doubt if George will be impeached and my concern with all the candidates from the beginning is there isn't one of them who will go through with this and make this administration accountable for what they've done. At least the articles have been drawn up and read into the record and I hope enough people know about it to pound this congress with demands to bring it to the floor, but it won't go anywhere on that I would bet and I am sure Obama won't press it if he gets in and McCain sure won't, however none of them would have done it, none of the Dem or GOP candidates except DK.

Ok, I'm confused. One the one hand the US, and Bush are arming Israel to protect itself against attacks from the Arab world and on the other Bush, and by default, the US, is giving the Saudi's nuclear wherewithall?!

Oh silly us! Trying to use reason and logic here! We must get a grip. Nothing to see here.... move along...

http://www.buzzflash.com/articles/alerts/357

U.S. quits as observer at UN Human Rights Council under war-crimes accusations

The White House quietly pulled out of the UN Human Rights Council as the Bush Administration came under fire by the House of Representatives for possible war crimes violations. Separately, Guantanamo Bay prosecutors prepare for their own war-crimes tribunals and secret negotiations continue over the role of the U.S. in Iraq.

In his daily briefing Friday, State Department spokesman Sean McCormack answered questions about the U.S. relinquishing its observer status in the international council. He criticized the institution as "pathetic," and "almost solely focused on bashing Israel." Though McCormack said the U.S. intends to "take a more reserved approach" in its participation, Reuters reported rumors that the U.S. will soon "disengage totally" from the council.

The 47-member council addresses human rights violations worldwide. It was created in 2006 to replace the UN Commission on Human Rights, which had been criticized for granting membership to countries with poor human rights records, such as China and Sudan. The U.S. voted against its creation and has since refused to become a seated member, though it remained an involved observer until the announcement this weekend.

More at the link....

http://carolynbaker.net/site/content/view/527/

THE NEARLY UNFATHOMABLE DEPTHS OF PENTAGON CORRUPTION, Part II, By Bob Chapman

Amazing, isn't it, Luna? I keep wondering if the whole bunch in this administration has a penchant for bending over and spreading 'em. Can't help but think they're all marionettes for far more powerful interests.

REading about the new river created -- Wisconsin Dells to the Missipppi -- i couldn't help think about Casey's prediction of the Great Lakes dumping into the Missippi. Interesting. A convergence of natural and political events are heralding in the advent of 2012.

Now back to Scotty. . .and a question to you Sally, though you may have already answered it and i'm in an oldtimers frame of mind. . .

I'm guessing that Scotty's book will spur an avalanche of others coming out of the Bush closet, those fired state workers (who dared to question), etc.???? And, because the media is tied to closely to perpetuating the debacle of Iraq, perhaps we'll see greater admissions of fraud, of wittingly playing a part in this charade?????

Here's the entire list of Articles of Impeachment for Junya that Kucinich read yesterday:

http://tinyurl.com/5od3sb

NOLA Sharon, you wrote

The Chicago Trib article on the strategies used was a little hard to take - we don't want him to be down & dirty or to win based on less than his merits, but this one seemed to say he is a winner, and he proved that to us. People say it was the DNC who pushed him over the top, the DNC responding to Robert Wexler's arguments maybe? Either way, he's there and I think he will be quite effective "doing the people's business." I actually think he will win, even though I have my moments when I worry about it.
-----
Well, I would also be sure to point out that he is no saint, Obama, and people need to educate themselves about how he has operated. I found that story appalling, and that the Trib writer kind of made it look better than it was...what he did to Alice Palmer. I think it is a caveat people should take note of ....and stop the annointing of him as the second coming.

Winning at any cost, including torpedoing opponents as he did, is evidently his political expertise. Yes...he is winning the contests at least 50% of the time....but at what cost? Or are we all so jaded at this point that winning is all that counts? Perhaps because winning at all costs is all that works in politics, we have adopted the same credo as 'inevitable'? Maybe....perhaps that is why Kucinich seems like the real deal to me, not 'more of the same.' Kucinich is a person who seems to be playing by the politicall book I like reading. And many posters on this board used to agree with that, too!

Fairly harrowing Senate hearing on torture has been going on all morning and is scheduled to continue this afternoon. There are currently two parts of live-blogging the hearing over at firedoglake.

Want to know where $23B of our tax dollars went? The BBC has figured it out:
http://tinyurl.com/5zpma4

For those of you (like me) who are wondering what the Bilderburg group is about, here's an introduction:

http://www.slate.com/id/2193220/

You are right Karen, Scotty's book will spur more of the troops to come forward. In Australia the past Bush lacky Prime Minister, Howard, is being sued by a group of doctors for war crimes. In England the call for Blair to be tried for war crimes is being pushed by their justice department, now we at least have someone reading the articles of impeachment for the record. People fearful of a "war crime" frenzy will be coming out with their stories first before they have to stand before a court. I forget which European country it is, but Rumsfeld cannot go there because he will be arrested for war crimes. Slowly the pot is heating up and frankly the gas prices world wide isn't helping these people. Today Spain truckers are staging a strike, all of Europe is furious at the gas prices. Not good at all for Texas oil people or Opec. Bush and others have let these obscenely greedy oil companies balloon their personal and company profits, countries will soon be forced into taking a look at the corruption and it isn't pretty. So yes, people will be jumping ship with the hope of saving themselves.

Some analysis on the Wisconsin flooding - probably what happens when people build homes too close to water, and may have to abandon this practice altogether.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080610/ap_on_re_us/ap_severe_weather

Rep Wexler (Dem-FL) just signed on to co-sponsor Kucinich's Bill.

Ooops. So excited I forgot the link:
http://tinyurl.com/6onzqj

OMG, Shy! That IS exciting!

And, here's a concise breakdown of all the articles of impeachment. And get this. . .all from a Belfast newspaper.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article20061.htm

Unrelenting bad news for the flood states... And farmland is being flooded too. That means higher food prices for all of us.

All I can believe is that the confluence of destructive energies assailing the planet from every quarter must have spiritual significance. It's as if it's fated to happen, even from ancient prophecies.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25020185

Well, lunaoscura, maybe Garry will chime in with the AARP perspective, too. (We haven't heard from him in ages. Hint hint)

LOL. That's HAARP. HAARP.

Dear Friend:

Under circumstances that can best be described as "suspicious," the http://www.kucinich.us website was crippled early this morning a few hours after Congressman Dennis Kucinich introduced 35 extensively documented Articles of Impeachment against President George W. Bush.

Until we can restore the website and implement additional security measures, you can find the full list and detailed Articles at

http://www.democrats.com/files/amomentoftruth.pdf and http://chun.afterdowningstreet.org/amomentoftruth.pdf

If you would like to show your support for the Congressman's efforts, please go to http://myinfo.kucinich.us to offer your comments and provide us with contact information so that we can continue to keep you informed.

Thank you
Committee to Re-Elect Congressman Kucinich

Sally, regarding Rumsfeld, I think it's Germany.

And for this reason, I don't believe the NeoCons will be doing very much in the way of international travel after Bush's White House stay hopefully ends on or before (nod to Kucinich) January 2009.

I say that of course, wondering even now if either Bush or Cheney will go on and try, say something on the scale of 9/11 and link it to Iran to justify an extended stay in power. I could see them trying to do this just to stave off what appears to be the emerging, serious worldwide movement to put them on trial where the sorry US Congress has failed, for charges of War Crimes and Crimes Against Humanity. They surely must know now, if they were foolish enough not to realize it before, that this is exactly what they face, if not from the very nation they have so corrupted, then from the rest of the world that they could not corrupt.

Then again, Cheney I believe would drop a nuke on Iran just to spite us all if he could, because he is so full of fear and hatred for anyone who doesn't subscribe to his very narrow and ugly world view, and believes US all to be the traitors.

However, despite whatever "martial law" freak-out might take place if Bush and Cheney do make a last ditch effort to seize total control over the country, the US as of now, thanks to them, is so poorly organized and mired so deep in bankruptcy of all sorts that there is no way that the long and much feared "police state" could even be efficient, much less sustainable. Our military is totally spent and decimated, and any attempted draft of the emerging generations that have already given Bush and the NeoCon/GOP establishment the middle finger would prove fruitless, if it didn't add enough spark to the fire to cause a full-scale revolt against the stubbornly existing yet dying order.

I've even seen the conspiracies that say the old order is trying to pull a fast one and combine the US, Canada and Mexico together into the North American version of the European Union. To that I say, with what army? And with what and whose oil?

The NeoCons, including Bush and Cheney have earned every bit of the animosity they have received and will continue to receive. There will eventually be trials and a total repudiation of their bankrupt methodology. And when that is cleared away, hopefully something new and better can emerge.

I think it is Germany AND France. He had a narrow escape at a meeting recently in France where he had to duck out the back door. ( Rumsfeld I think)
Happening Now,
John Perkins ( Confessions of an Economic Hit Man) beginning a book tour at Marlboro College on Link TV.
KO is mentioning Kucinich's impeachment bill!

Wasn't the latest snatch catch of ole Rummy in Scotland? Just missed him.

Must have happened while I was on the road!

Here's part of the international Rumsfeld Hunt, Miz Morgana & QOP:

http://www.alternet.org/story/66425/

Here's an earlier one:

http://www.apfn.net/messageboard/01-22-05/discussion.cgi.19.html

89% of over a half million people think Junya should be impeached:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10562904

Wow.

Judy, the Alice Palmer deal seemed to not be totally his fault. She told him to run & when she lost her bid for the House, she turned around & decided to run against him after he had geared up a campaign. Still, I see your point. I was a little surprised at some of his other tactics. Even so, he has garnered a tremendous following on his own merits. A Garrison Keiler article was posted on DU where Keiler said that Obama's ability to communicate with grace, etc., is an important part of the job he is "applying" for. The president needs to be a great communicator. I guess only time will tell if BO is for real.

MORE than 1 MILLION people have joined together in support of the impeachment movement launched by Ramsey Clark at ImpeachBush.org. From collecting signatures in towns and cities across the land to letter writing campaigns to direct congressional visits volunteers have forced impeachment "on the table."
Message from Ramsey Clark

Impeachment is not a political question. Impeachment is a constitutional duty. It is the one power and highest duty the Constitution rests in the Congress to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States when the President, Vice President, and other civil officers of the United States commit treason, bribery, or other High Crimes and Misdemeanors.
Donations may be mailed to:
VoteToImpeach, c/o
5505 Connecticut Ave. NW, # 299
Washington, DC 20015-2601

I guess we have Dem. Nominees for Senator Thomas Allen & Representative Chellie Pingaree ( Mentor Paul Wellstone) here in Maine today.
They had outdistanced their rivals when I went to bed. Of course Tom still has to win over Sen Collins in Nov. Sho-in for Chellie!

Caller from OK REPUG, used to CAP OIL WELLS in OK!
Carter Admin.
He says it was cheaper to import at the time. Now time to UNCAP! & he fgavors impeachment
cspan

Nice catch, QOP. Over the last couple of weeks or so, I've seen/heard a couple of claims like that. Wonder if anyone has done a good survey of the situation. Hmmm.

KO's segment on Kucinich's Impeachment articles, and interview with Professor Turley, is here.

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/06/10/countdown-the-impeachment-of-george-w-bush/

Funny you should mention OK in relation to oil production QOP. I was thinking about that just last night. When I had newly arrived in New York, I was sitting next to a lady at work, who came from OK, and she had commented on the fact that the American gov't had thrown the native Indians on some arid land which they had designated an Indian reservation. It turned out that the Indians struck black gold on their land(Divine justice in operation), and became rich! Soon they were driving big motor cars, and living high on the hog; so last night I was wondering what became of them and their oil.

I think the British pound is the strongest currency against the American dollar so far. The Euro is $1.55 to $1 Amer., but the Br. pound is $1.95. My sister has been making out like a bandit when she visits here. I've also noticed an influx of residents from the UK, here in FL. They don't seem to mind the heat and humidity in the summer, not to mention the bugs, but they just love the sunshine and the beaches.

Emptywheel:

The FISA Fix and Obama’s Profile In Courage Leadership Moment

The desperate push on FISA by the Bush Administration, complicit and subservient Republican Congressional leaders, and their telco partners is about to explode onto the forefront again. You are already starting to see the advance seeding by proponents seeking to seed the public with fear and alarm that if we don't get on board with the whims and desires of the Bush Administration we will be exposed to terrorism and all die. In direct response, Professor Martin Lederman performs a beautiful technical dissection of this fraudulent scare tactic in full detail here.

No, the FISA fix is not about "listenin to al-Qaida to protect America from terrists" as George Bush et al. would have you believe. We have been doing that, and are going to continue to do that; and there is no disagreement whatsoever on that point. Rather, how we resolve FISA is what the disagreement is about, and it is a glaring symbol of what we are, and are going to be, as a country. We are either a nation of laws that protects citizens and their right to seek redress for being wronged by their government and it's agents, or we are a nation of self serving men like George Bush and Dick Cheney that can, and do, get away with whatever illegal and immoral acts they desire.

Two men that have recognized that fact and stood resolutely and heroically from the outset are Senators Chris Dodd and Russell Feingold. Today, they remind us of what leadership truly is by way of a joint letter to the Democratic Leadership currently controlling the shape of the FISA fix process coming to a head.

snip

Barack Obama has fought long, hard and well to win the chance and right to lead both the Democratic Party and the nation as a whole. It is time for him to so lead, and his leadership will make the difference in this fight if he is willing to take the mantle.

snip

The time is now Mr. Obama, and you are the man. Even the Kennedys have put Mr. Obama up as a John F. Kennedyesque figure. Well, it is time for a Profile In Courage. And not just by Mr. Obama, but by all of the Democratic Leadership. The cause is just; the time is now. Limber you fingers. Oil your fax machines. Let Mr. Obama know that when he leads on this critical issue that we will not only follow, but will have his back. This is who we are; this is what we stand for. Let him know. NOW!

More at the link....

The Hill:

http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/lawmakers-see-progress-on-fisa-talks-2008-06-10.html

Lawmakers see progress on FISA talks

Congressional Republicans are reviewing a Democratic proposal to break the logjam on electronic-surveillance legislation by allowing federal district courts to determine whether telephone companies seeking legal immunity received orders from the Bush administration to wiretap people’s phones.
more

Bmaz comments on this development:
UPDATE II: The ground is shifting already.

snip

The Democratic Leadership takes us for fools, and treats us accordingly. They have taken the Republican/Bush-Cheney White House dream plan and substituted the words "District Court" for "FISA Court" and run it up the flag pole to see if we will salute.

snip

This willingness of the Democratic Leadership to belligerently betray the trust and best interests of their constituents, party and country is simply stunning. This is weak, shameless and traitorous leadership at it's craven worst.

More at the link....

3:08 pm EDT Washington, DC

House vote on Kucinich's Articles of Impeachment to go to the Judiciary Committee

Yay 251 Nay 166

24 Republicans voted Yay

Randi Rhodes:

"No member of congress will be interested in impeachment or criticism of Bush because they all had the torture/eavesdropping information years ago and had approved.

Pelosi is protecting Pelosi."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/06/11/watch-opec-chief-there-is_n_106438.html

OPEC takes another swipe at speculators blaming them for driving oil prices to record highs.

Speaking at the Reuters Energy Summit, the oil cartel's Secretary General Abdullah al-Badri says there is no need to raise production stressing global supply levels are more than adequate.

He's been speaking with Reuters reporter Darcy Lambton.

All these Repugs want to go back in the past! If only we had drilled in Anwar 10 years ago we'd be fine now!
BUT IT"S BILL CLINTON"S FAULT. HE VETOED IT.
they are a very monotonous one trick pony! THEY STAND UP THERE AND READ THE LETTERS FROM DESPERATE constituants.And then say "SO we have to dril in this country", BUT if you won't play the game our way....we won't play!
So the revolution wasn't televised? I've been switching back & forth on cspan 1 &2 WAITING TO WATCH THE VOTE.

Go here & read Randi Rhodes re Kucinich today:

http://forums.therandirhodesshow.com/index.php?showtopic=2497

Why do YOU think Democrats don’t support IMPEACHMENT?

I think it’s because Democrats were briefed on torture including waterboarding, black site prison renditions, and warrantless wiretapping of Americans. Democratic Leadership were taken on “virtual tours” of overseas detention sites and shown the harsh techniques interrogators had devised. The full Intelligence Committees were briefed in 2006. Democratic Leadership were also briefed on warrantless wiretapping.

On Iraq: Hardly any members of Congress bothered to read the NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE ESTIMATE before voting for the war.

Who was briefed on torture and rendition black site prisons?

Who was briefed on Warrantless Wiretapping?

WATER BOARDING AND BLACK SITE PRISONS

2002

The lawmakers who held oversight roles during the period included Pelosi and Rep. Jane Harman (D-Calif.) and Sens. Bob Graham (D-Fla.) and John D. Rockefeller IV (D-W.Va.), as well as Rep. Porter J. Goss (R-Fla.) and Sen. Pat Roberts (R-Kan).

With one known exception, no formal objections were raised by the lawmakers briefed about the harsh methods during the two years in which water boarding was employed, from 2002 to 2003, said Democrats and Republicans with direct knowledge of the matter. The lawmakers who held oversight roles during the period included Pelosi and Rep. Jane Harman (D-Calif.) and Sens. Bob Graham (D-Fla.) and John D. Rockefeller IV (D-W.Va.), as well as Rep. Porter J. Goss (R-Fla.) and Sen. Pat Roberts (R-Kan).

MORE

First Katrina. Second, Junya eating cake and playing the guitar. Third, the famous FEMA "response." And now this:

http://tinyurl.com/6ehuqn

Why do they hate the people NOLA?

You think it can't possibly get any worse, and yet there's always another more reprehensible specimen at the bottom of that very foul barrel of theirs:

http://tinyurl.com/55y2dq

Oh, and Dick "Dick"'s still determined to bomb Iran. And he's winning. (talkingpointsmemo.com)

Shy, the government's treatment of the people of NOLA was, and still is atrocious. People who have called it home for generations, and lost their homes, now have nowhere to turn. There is so much gentrification going on there now, that only the rich can afford to buy or rent a home, as the prices have soared, so that's basically what's happening - it's being turned into a resort type city for the wealthy, and the poor have now been shunted to the fringes. That's what's happening all over America now - more and more people are becoming homeless, because they are being priced out of their homes. It has reached epidemic proportions, and no one in the government seems to be interested in solving the problem. Surprised?

Hey AW folks, the latest fire in the Santa Cruz Mountains, Bonny Doon Fire is blowing toward the ocean and away from us. Though there are a lot of people in harms way. UC Santa Cruz is 12 miles away from it. Completely out of control, we've seen the air support and helicopters flying over.

Hi Morgana,
Didn't even know that there was another fire burning up there. Guess news of the floods in the mid-west must have eclipsed that bit of news.

Pluto's fate:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/space/20080611/sc_space/plutonowcalledaplutoid

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/6/11/163046/692/769/534167

Let’s Impeach the President for Lying
by One Pissed Off Liberal

I'm so sorry Morgana. There are no words I can think of except that. May everyone be protected.

.......

http://www.tristateobserver.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=10121

AAM Concerned with CCC Inventories

WASHINGTON - Larry Matlack, President of the American Agriculture Movement (AAM), has raised concerns over the issue of U.S. grain reserves after it was announced that the sale of 18.37 million bushels of wheat from USDA’s Commodity Credit Corporation (CCC) Bill Emerson Humanitarian Trust.

“According to the May 1, 2008 CCC inventory report there are o nly 24.1 million bushels of wheat in inventory, so after this sale there will be o nly 2.7 million bushels of wheat left the entire CCC inventory,” warned Matlack. “Our concern is not that we are using the remainder of our strategic grain reserves for humanitarian relief. AAM fully supports the action and all humanitarian food relief. Our concern is that the U.S. has nothing else in our emergency food pantry. There is no cheese, no butter, no dry milk powder, no grains or anything else left in reserve. The o nly thing left in the entire CCC inventory will be 2.7 million bushels of wheat which is about enough wheat to make ½ of a loaf of bread for each of the 300 million people in America.”

The CCC is a federal government-owned and operated entity that was created to stabilize, support, and protect farm income and prices. CCC is also supposed to maintain balanced and adequate supplies of agricultural commodities and aids in their orderly distribution.

“This lack of emergency preparedness is the fault of the 1996 farm bill which eliminated the government’s grain reserves as well as the Farmer Owned Reserve (FOR),” explained Matlack. “We had hoped to reinstate the FOR and a Strategic Energy Grain Reserve in the new farm bill, but the politics of food defeated our efforts. As farmers it is our calling and purpose in life to feed our families, our communities, our nation and a good part of the world, but we need better planning and coordination if we are to meet that purpose. AAM pledges to continue our work for better farm policy which includes an FOR and a Strategic Energy Grain Reserve.”

More at the link....

Morgana, I didn't know about the new fire either, but was wondering why my eyes were bothering me....I don't watch tv or listen to news, etc., this is really too difficult to deal with over and over again....I did happen to see the fire which happened in the Hayward hills by Hayward State U yesterday.....I wonder if there were sparks carried your way from that one?

I was painting two weekends ago in the Palo Alto Baylands Preserve when I noticed that there was this beautiful pink cloud layer suspended in the sky (it was gray, cold/windy, overcast). It was so unusual, over the east bay....I showed the painting (which sucked except for the clouds) to my teacher and pointed out the clouds, and he said that same phenomenon was taking place from southern CA all the way north to WA....ash from the Santa Cruz fire, distributed up there in the clouds.

Take care and be safe, Morgana.

With regards to Bush's Impeachment passing on to judiciary, Kucinich made a promise to John Conyers: "If There Is No Further Action-We'll Come Back With 60 Articles Not 35"

--

"Leadership wants to bury it, but this is one resolution that will be coming back from the dead," Kucinich told Capitol Briefing. "Thirty days from now, if there is no action, I will be bringing the resolution up again, and I won't be the only one reading it."

Judiciary Chairman John Conyers (D-Mich.) has not commented on whether he plans to hold hearings, and Kucinich said he would meet with Conyers this week to present him with documentation for his charges against Bush. But if there is no further action, Kucinich said, "We'll come back and many of us will be reading this (on the House floor), and we'll come back with 60 articles, not 35."

http://www.reachm.com/amstreet/archives/2008/06/11/impeachment-bill-passes-with-an-additional-promise

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/capitol-briefing/2008/06/kucinich_vows_to_keep_up_impea.html

Gotta love that man. Sally, I wonder if Kucinich being on the rise these next few years has something to do with this? Even if Impeachment goes nowhere now, he is laying down a lot of the important groundwork that Bush's opponents here and elsewhere around the world can use to eventually bring him and the NeoCons to trial.

What did Gandhi say? “First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.”

The world seems more and more like it's a schizophrenic split personality place where one reality is that Bush is the most Catastrophic success ever, meaning he's done even more than what he set out to do and ruined more than anyone has ever ruined and on the other the media acts as if he's a standup regular drinking buddy. And what's with the photo? Does Merkel live for this man groping her in public?! He can't seem to keep his bloody hands off her!

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/06/11/bush.europe/?iref=hpmostpop

Bush: No regrets over Iraq invasion

MESEBERG, Germany (CNN) -- U.S. President Bush claimed Wednesday that he had no regrets about the decision to invade Iraq and topple Saddam Hussein in 2003 and reiterated his determination to force Iran to halt its nuclear program.

U.S. President Bush and German Chancellor Angela Merkel walk in the garden at Schloss Meseberg Palace.

Bush, making the final official visit to Europe of his presidency, spoke at a news conference in Germany after talks with Chancellor Angela Merkel.

He said he had told Merkel that diplomacy remained his preferred choice for dealing with Iran. But he added that "all options are on the table" and said Tehran needed to "verifiably suspend" its uranium enrichment program. Iran maintains that its nuclear ambitions are peaceful.

"The message to the Iranian government is very clear: that there's a better way forward than isolation and that is for you to verifiably suspend your enrichment program and the choice is theirs to make," Bush said.

On Tuesday, the U.S. and the European Union issued a joint declaration urging tougher action against Iran over its nuclear program.

It said the U.S. and EU would implement previously passed Security Council resolutions on Iran and stood "ready to supplement those sanctions with additional measures."

Sanctions in place should be enforced, Bush said, and allies should work together for additional sanctions if Iran "ignores the demands of the free world."
Don't Miss

more...

Kucinich will fight on!

Good website about Dennis Kucinich.

Please take a look and send it forward.

http://impeachment.kucinich.us

http://tinyurl.com/3kyvo5

Kucinich Vows New Round Of Impeachment Articles Against Bush If Measure Dies - By Jason Leopold

Morgana, I heard on the AM news that the fire was worse, are you still ok? Good grief between that and the floods and storms in the midwest I have friends and family in danger across this country.

You take care.

Agreed Luna, what's with him (Bush?) and his statements. I heard that the conservatives are furious with him for making apologies for anything. It feels like there is a perfect point of explosion coming to a head for these people. There are the strikes in Europe over gas prices, trucks coming to a standstill, sky rocketing benefits for oil companies, the new information coming out of the CIA and the corruption of this administration confirm everything we've seen, I expect it extends into Congress. http://www.counterpunch.org/lendman06112008.html

I don't know if this will keep growing after Mercury goes direct but all seems to be exploding now.

No link yet, but the Supreme Court has reversed the Bush administration saying that prisoners at Gitmo have the right of Habeas Corpus in US Courts.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080612/ap_on_go_su_co/scotus_guantanamo_2

WASHINGTON - The Supreme Court says foreign terrorism suspects held at Guantanamo Bay have rights under the Constitution to challenge their detention in U.S. civilian courts.

The Obama campaign released his birth certificate!

Here's the link

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/6/12/11012/6168/320/534616

Here's the image

http://images.dailykos.com/images/user/3/BO_Birth_Certificate.jpg

Hour of birth, 7:24 PM.

Thank you PatC!!!

Bush’s conservative judges in action. So I wonder how may still think there’s no misogyny backlash going on in this country?

http://www.kansascity.com/105/story/654147.html

Judge’s ban on the use of the word ‘rape’ at trial reflects trend
By TONY RIZZO

It’s the only way Tory Bowen knows to honestly describe what happened to her.
She was raped.
But a judge prohibited her from uttering the word “rape” in front of a jury. The term “sexual assault” also was taboo, and Bowen could not refer to herself as a victim or use the word “assailant” to describe the man who allegedly raped her.
The defendant’s presumption of innocence and right to a fair trial trumps Bowen’s right of free speech, said the Lincoln, Neb., judge who issued the order.
“It shouldn’t be up to a judge to tell me whether or not I was raped,” Bowen said. “I should be able to tell the jury in my own words what happened to me.”
Bowen’s case is part of what some prosecutors and victim advocates see as a national trend in sexual assault cases.
“It’s a topic that’s coming up more and more,” said Joshua Marquis, an Oregon prosecutor and a vice president of the National District Attorneys Association. “You’re moving away from what a criminal trial is really about.”

more...

Thanks PatC and thanks to the GOP and right wing talk show hosts who have been demanding his Birthcertificate so they could be sure he was born in the US and that his middle name was Hussain. We owe them a debt of gratitude.

Sally, I think Obama should be proud of his middle name, and should embrace, and use it. I'm sure it has some good meaning to it. Too bad it's used as an excuse to villify him.

LOL Sally! Indeed we do! The bastards.

You're welcome Morgana! Stay safe, you hear me?

Hey AW folks, we're safe and sound. The fire is south west of us, blowing away from us toward the ocean. Another 1000 homes and businesses are in harms way and only 5% contained.

Our thoughts and good vibes are going out to all those displaced by fire, flood and wind.

Ack back to work for me. Oh and if any of you folks have a myspace account my son created one for me morganaseawalker come visit and add me to your friends list. Yup pictures even.

A majority--imagine!--a majority of the current Supreme Court has restored habeas corpus!!!

http://tinyurl.com/5mrca8

Down in the "Comments" you'll see what Chief Justice (or, in this case, Just-Ice) things in his dissenting opinion.

As everyone has been desperate for Obama's birth time and accurate chart, it was fantastic to get it today. I had five different charts with five different birthtimes and it was great to delete all of them, I think Morgana had more.

While he doesn't have a strong chart (except he is a Leo) to be President, he does have a strong chart to be a leader and to win in November on election day. His Sun in the sixth house in a separating square to Neptune (and separating is not as strong as if applying) he has ideals around serving others, ideals he will devote most of his time and energy to succeeding. I looked and found a winning signature for November but need to look more closely at some other charts. His Midheaven is 28 Scorpio in a square to his NN, not the best aspect for fame but not the worst either. The "Chaldean" ruler of that would be Mars at 22 Virgo in a trine to Saturn in Capricorn discipline and a better signal aspect for a win this November. I just don't know if he will be running against who he thinks he will. McCain has some serious problems right now, that become more evident through the summer and fall.

More later

Levee breaks in Cedar Rapids. Oh, this is awful:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25020185

Sally, you know the same thing crossed my mind. I have a feeling that McCain will have to be replaced, so that Obama will be up against someone else. I believe that is why the GOP is taking so long to name a VP candidate.

Thanks so much for checking in, Miz Morgana.

And while I do not think highly of Chief Just-Ice Roberts, I meant to ue the word 'think' up above and not 'thing.'

Hah, Alito, Scalia, Thomas and Roberts need to be impeached as soon as their goons are out of office. I'll hold my tongue now.

Here's some photos sent in by people on the flooding of Des Moines.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25061400/

What kind of problems, Sally, does McCain have coming, do you think? I have so much disdain for McCain, he is so 'typical' of everything I dislike about politics, power, etc...(of course, I also believe the meek will inherit the earth!)....and Arizona, for that is where I lived for 9 years, so this is really somewhat personal. He sure doesn't look healthy, melanoma is not something to toss off ..... or could it be his past is catching up with him? Could FEAR be catching up with him?

btw, always thought Obama had to be an Aquarius rising, nothing else fit with his tall, thin, cool and dry appearance...especially Scorpio rising, there is not a clue I could find to make me thing he was that. But 9 Aquarius looks pretty accurate.

Current watches and warnings of severe weather all over the US. It includes fires and fire warnings.

http://weather.wbztv.com/auto/wbz4V3/severe.asp

From the same site I posted above about severe weather, if you click on California this is what it tells you:

California - Fire Weather Warning , Record Report , Public Information Statement

Fire Weather Warning - Carquinez Strait and Delta, Central Sacramento Valley, Clear Lake/Southern Lake County, Motherlode, Mountains Southwestern Shasta County to Northern Lake County, Northeast Foothills/Sacramento Valley, Northern Sacramento Valley, Northern San Joaquin Valley, Shasta Lake Area / Northern Shasta County, Southern Sacramento Valley, West Slope Northern Sierra Nevada

Luna, that is the SICKEST article I've ever read about rape trials...OMG, how horrifying....is there anyone who doesn't believe that women are being raped in so many ways MORE now than 8 years ago? And this post by AKA really is a kind of symptom of the same...

And here is an inspiring post which does tell a story of activism out of Chicago, but warning, it isn't pretty when it comes to Obama supporters. Posted by AKA at nancy's

http://www.hillbuzz.blogspot.com/

All of this is made much, much harder by the guys in my office, Obama fans all, who have spent this entire week ridiculing Hillary Clinton and celebrating her defeat, like a frat party that has, as of Wednesday, not ended yet. You need to know how bad these guys are because, from everything I have personally seen, they are par for the course with Obama supporters. When I came into work on Monday, there was a cartoon on my desk that was clipped out of the newspaper, of Clinton as the Wicked Witch of the East, with a house dropped on her. Someone wrote on it: “You’re girl’s not getting back up this time!” (sic). Whoever it was actually misspelled “your”, and, of course, didn’t leave his name. I then had to endure a parade of these 27-35 year old guys, all from top schools in the east, who stopped by my office to gloat, but they could have just unzipped and pissed all over my door to achieve the same result. I can’t explain it, but there was a primal nature to this, like animals marking territory, or barbarians moving across a battlefield jamming spears into fallen enemies to make sure they were really dead. The hatred these guys felt for Clinton was not about Clinton — and I am going out on a limb saying this because I don’t know what’s inside these guys’ heads, but working with them every day gives me insights — it was about beating down “the bitch”. It was a “take that” moment, the same kind of moment these guys all had when a female VP was sacked at our firm last year because of budget cuts. These guys all went out drinking after that, to celebrate, and they all went out together on Monday night too. On the way out the door, as I still worked in my office, they walked by singing “Ding dong the witch is dead. Which old witch? That Clinton witch!”.

I’m a 32 year old man who probably hasn’t cried since my mom died 5 years ago. I have to be honest and say I came pretty damn close to loosing it on Monday night.

And, it’s not because Hillary Clinton won’t be the nominee, as big of a supporter of hers as I am. It’s because it’s the year 2008, and not only was this treatment of Clinton ALLOWED by the Obama campaign, the DNC, the mainstream media, and the public at large, but it was ENCOURAGED by most, if not all, of the above. At no time did Obama, the DNC, or the execs at the networks rein in the likes of Chris Matthews, Tim Russert, Keith Olbermann, or any of the other vile misogynists on the air. The Obama camp never reined in its bloggers, either. I grew up in a pretty bad part of Pittsburgh, so I’ve seen and heard a lot of foul stuff, but a lot of what I read about Hillary Clinton, a United States Senator and former First Lady, on Obama-supporting blogs made me cringe. It was hate speech, directed at her because of her gender, which would have never been tolerated if it was aimed at Obama in racial terms.

much more at link

Morgana, second you on the so called 'justices'...puke.

This was posted over on SN.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-lutin/hillary-and-barack-wake-u_b_105101.html

Hillary and Barack: Wake Up and Start Dreaming

http://www.tomdispatch.com/post/174943/michael_klare_the_pentagon_as_energy_insecurity_inc_

Tomgram: Michael Klare, The Pentagon as Energy Insecurity Inc.

If you thought things were bad, with a barrel of crude oil at $136 and the oil heartlands of our planet verging on chaos, don't be surprised, but you may still have something to look forward to. Alexei Miller, chairman of Russia's vast state-owned energy monopoly, Gazprom, just suggested that, within 18 months, that same barrel could be selling for a nifty $250. Put that in your tank and… well, don't drive it. It will be far too valuable.

Think of Miller's sobering prediction as, at least in part, a result of the Bush administration's attempt to "secure" the Middle East and the oil-rich Caspian basin by force in two failing wars (and occupations). Now, imagine for a moment, what his price scenario might be if, as journalist Jim Lobe -- never one to leap from rumors to sensational conclusions -- recently suggested, forces in the Bush administration (and in Israel) in favor of launching an air campaign against Iran are gaining strength. Just the suggestion last week by Shaul Mofaz, an Israeli deputy prime minister, that an attack on Iran is "unavoidable" if that country doesn't halt its nuclear program -- "If Iran continues with its program for developing nuclear weapons, we will attack it. The sanctions are ineffective." -- helped send the price of crude oil soaring. Imagine what an actual air attack might do.

You know that old joke: military justice is to justice as military music is to music; well, someday, not so far into the future, a similar, though far grimmer joke, is likely to be made about Washington's attempts to secure the U.S. oil supply by military means. In the meantime, Michael Klare, author most recently of Rising Powers, Shrinking Planet: The New Geopolitics of Energy, considers the madness of Washington's long-term militarization of oil delivery and the devastating oil wars that have resulted. (His previous book, Blood and Oil, by the way, has recently been turned into a documentary film. Check it out.) Tom

Garrisoning the Global Gas Station
Challenging the Militarization of U.S. Energy Policy
By Michael T. Klare

American policymakers have long viewed the protection of overseas oil supplies as an essential matter of "national security," requiring the threat of -- and sometimes the use of -- military force. This is now an unquestioned part of American foreign policy.

More at the link...

The truth is that Hillary Clinton ran a divisive and gender polarizing campaign, and we are now seeing the backlash. I can see why there is the perception out there, that she wants to destroy Obama, so that he loses in 2008, and she gets to run in 2012. After all I've seen of her campaign, it wouldn't surprise me.

Not surprised at the content of that post from AKA, coming as it does from the website hillbuzzblogspot. Doesn't lend much credence to it, but this is what Hillary has inspired.

OK, Judi, so I get it, it's like whoever said, "I have nothing against Jesus, it's his fan club I can't stand!"

It's terrible that people can be so hateful to women, and that it played out so awfully in this year's primary. I wish also that Keith Olbermann, in particular, could have toned down on his attacks on Hillary Clinton (his tone in the special comment on Hillary's remarks on RFK sounded misogynistic to me, too).

Still, I don't regret for one minute voting for Obama in my state's primary. I had problems with Hillary voting for the authorization to go to war, and her with health care plan. I could go on, but I'd rather put whatever energy I have to getting behind Obama, because with the nomination chart he's going to have to work with, he's going to need all the help he can get. Believe me, I'd feel the same way if Hillary had pulled it off and it was Obama giving the concession speech the other day.

Misogyny ain't going away anytime soon. Now I hear that the right is attacking Michelle Obama. If she becomes First Lady, they'll attack her like they attacked Hillary, and like they attacked Eleanor Roosevelt. It's not all Obama supporters, or even most of them. At least I sure hope not.

I've seen other nasty stuff on hillbuzzblog Crystal. It's all those snotty little Young Repug interns working for the likes of Ted Stevens & Mitch McConell in DC!
They all have the hots for Coulter!

http://www.buzzflash.com/store/reviews/1148

The Family: The Secret Fundamentalism at the Heart of American Power

http://www.rinf.com/columnists/news/expose-the-christian-mafia-parts-1-2
Time for a re-read! I got it here several years ago! ( 2003-04)

Gina, I thought it was inspiring because the young man who wrote the blog changed his way of living because HE was inspired by Clinton....and there were a number of stories like that coming out of the campaign. But the behavior of the yahoos in that piece is quite typical of that generation, and I am seeing it in my life also. Any excuse in the book to revile others for whatever reason, not just mysogynistic reasons, either. And I am equally certain that there are those who are inspired by Obama and may have changed their life's path because of it ..... but no where have I seen groups of young men do to Obama what they did to Hillary. Even they seem to know you can't say the N word anymore, while it is ok to use bitch...

Two elderly white women have done the same egregious behavior...one in NYC the day of the rules committee meeting which sealed Hillary's fate...when the woman called Obama an inadequate black man and the other from the Bill Moyers special from last Dec when a wealthy looking McCain supporter asked him "what about the bitch?"

Pat C...from Lutin's article....the end:
Prediction: Between the fall of 2010 and the spring of 2011, this revolutionary confrontation between individual liberty and strict control will let itself be seen everywhere.

Now there 's the subject of some threads for astrology.

Pat QOP what was snotty about the piece I posted from Hill Buzz? I am really confused....

JudiGem,
YOU weren't snotty to post it. I went to the link and read comments ( I think?)some of which were kind of snotty!
The PREVIOUS SNOTTY POSTS I referred to ( from the Young Repugs ) were from The Hill blog. The Capital Newsletter.
Mis match! Sorry.I'm battling terrible weeds today. In 2003
I had such a beautiful garden that people stopped and commented on it. Then I got involved in the campaign, Eric came to stay and got sick ....... I also had 3 grants for work on the house/sewer, which basically took me back to square one!
Trying to plant up the front so I can open the Gallery as well as grow veggies in the v-back so I can eat.
Did you see Bush on TV today standing by his torture platform even tho the SCOTUS voted for the return of habeous corpus ( to be used at Guantanimo)
AND: ROn Paul has suspended his campaign and will support the Libertarian Candidate.
This morning he was planning an alternative Repug convention parallel to the official one.
Wonder WHo? How? they got him to back down?

I've been pretty neutral about the candidates but the misogyny got me. And the story about the judge saying a raped woman couldn't use the words 'rape', 'sexual assault', or make references to herself as the victim of rape is a sure sign that if you say nothing it just gets worse. Ignoring the sexist comments before seemed OK because it the people saying such things were too stupid to argue with. It was mostly a waste of time and many of them learned that speaking in public will cause them to be confronted.

So if they're now speaking out this much it must mean they feel they won't be confronted. So in my opinion this is now the time to confront sexism and racism or any other ism that's offensive to any group. I think we need to defend Michelle Obama because she isn't the candidate and because of their daughters. Those girls should grow up in a world where being black and female doesn't make any difference. And we're not going to get to that kind of world if we women don't take a stand AGAIN, just like we did before and our mothers and grandmothers and great grandmothers did. Men are always welcome if they feel it's the right thing to do, of course. But it's us women who have to stand up to the growing and blatant misogyny that's growing right now.

Why I'm voting Republican:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FiQJ9Xp0xxU

This is what I'm talking about. McCain is a misogynist.

http://progressohio.org/page/s/mccainwaronwomen

McCain's War on Women
John McCain is often painted as a moderate.

But where does he really stand on issues that affect women?

McCain's Senate record may surprise you. From equal pay to domestic violence programs, from sex education to the fundamental question of what conversations a woman may or may not have with her doctor, McCain is no moderate.

more...

Luna, remember how Chelsea was torn apart? Hillary? it hasn't changed, if anything it is worse...there is a sense of entitlement because there are no consequences. but I'm still inraged about the rape trial...it is time to speak out.

Pat, you must have meant Capital Hill Blue? but gee, snotty comments are ' normal ' behavior now.....

Reason enough to speak out.

Judigem,

Women aren't falling for McCain and it's women who are setting the record straight. It makes me proud and it's inspiring to think that we can come together and fight this creepy and creeping assault on women.

http://www.thenation.com/blogs/notion/328690

Key Women Clinton Supporters: McCain Won't Get Our Vote

John McCain has made it clear that his campaign intends to aggressively court supporters of Hillary Clinton, include her major base of women voters.

Now top women Clinton supporters have a message for McCain: not so fast.

"The McCain campaign has been talking about the mythology of trying to pick up HRC supporters," says Ellen Malcolm, president of EMILY'S List. "This is a pipe dream, because he's out of touch with their lives and the issues they care about."

"We are here to sound the alarm bell," said Congresswoman Debbie Wasserman-Schultz of South Florida on a conference call today. "We are going to work hard to make sure that John McCain is not allowed to pull the wool over womens' eyes one more day."

Wasserman-Schultz pointed to McCain's opposition to universal healthcare, universal pre-K, the Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act and raising the minimum wage as some of the many reasons women voters will rally around Barack Obama come November. "As a young woman in America who is a mom with three young kids, there is a real fear that John McCain will be dangerous for women," Wasserman-Schultz said. "He will impede our progress."

more...

Oh the myths, the myths about McCain supporting women...amazing, huh? (and ironic that it his wife's money doing the supporting of his candicacy way back when he started)... thanks for the good news about supporting women coming from the Clinton camp, because this has unleashed or opened a pandora's box, and this time the powers that be will really be pounding hard (I mean, the spiritual forces of evil, as it were, and the folks acting them out) to get them (us) back into the box.

And it isn't all men doing the pounding either. And I am not talking about having differing opinions on issues or even candidates, I would hope that would be permitted...but my god, the vitriol against people who should be given a modicum of respect for being PEOPLE in the first place represents a real 'dis-ease'...

It's got to stop....

Wonderful article on the restoration of habeas (with great historical underpinnings highlighted, etc.):

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2008/06/12/boumediene/

Judi G. McCain's problems is Uranus conj. his Saturn in the 6th house, opposing his Venus in his 12th house and square Chiron, Saturn is coming to a conj. to his Sun and in the fall Saturn will conj his Neptune, and his progressed chart is a mess

Lynda Hill, the fabulous Sabian Symbol astrologer sent this to me. Very nice.

"One of the squares to his Moon is from Virgo 4: Black and White Children Playing Happily Together… he’s had that his entire life… it’s such a big degree at the moment both in our solar system AND the fact that it’s basically the secondary progressed full moon of the 4th July 1776 5.10pm chart.."

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/06/12/countdown-special-comment-the-unimportance-of-being-john-mccain/

Countdown Special Comment: The Unimportance of Being John McCain

So in essence, Sally, McCain has this Tsquare which will then be set off by T. Saturn conj. his sun....then later, Neptune. AND his progressed chart is a mess? LOL

I have to look at when Uranus by transit crossed my Sun Saturn square and try some interpretations...hmmm..well, T. Uranus did that number on me when I was 3 years old...my mother took me to the east coast of Canada from Maui, Hawaii and we were gone 6 months, and my dad had a nervous breakdown during the time we were gone, AND an affair, plus there was street fighting from the ILWU (Longshoremen) who were striking on Maui at that time, and trying to unionize. (Hmmm...not much going on there.) A number of pictures of me exist, all of them CRYING. Sure was a breakup of the existing structures....I have a semisquare to MC/Venus so that was being activated....but my sun/sat and Uranus are in the 8th house, and not the 6th....

I wonder if McCain will be the 'figurehead' for the death of the neocons.

Ooooo, the post on the Sabian Smybol is Obama's chart with the new birth time. I should have made that clear.

((((((((((((((((((Judi)))))))))))))))))

This article sets a nice tone!
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/frank-schaeffer/a-warning-to-my-old-repub_b_106676.html
A Warning to My Old Republican Friends:
Screw Up The Obama Moment and You're History -- Literally

What ever happened to Vicky Iseman????
If she were a Democrat ( & Mccaine also ) the name of her firm would be used against her on Fox.
Alcalde & Fay = "al Quida "
http://baltimorechronicle.com/2008/061208Parry.shtml

PUNDITS' FAWNING OF MCCAIN'S "STRAIGHT-TALK" WAS WRONG:
McCain Makes Stuff Up
by Robert Parry

June 11, 2008—For years now, the U.S. political press corps has traveled with John McCain on his “Straight Talk Express,” buying into his image as a paragon of truth-telling. But the real truth is that McCain routinely makes stuff up, as he did on June 11 in lying about Barack Obama’s “bitter” comment.

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSCOL33273620080613
AMMAN (Reuters) - Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki said on Friday talks with the United States on a new long-term security pact had reached a "dead end" because of U.S. demands that infringed Iraq's sovereignty.

"We have reached a dead end, because when we started the talks, we found that the U.S. demands hugely infringe on the sovereignty of Iraq, and this we can never accept," Maliki told journalists during a visit to neighboring Jordan..............

Whatever happened to Vicky Iseman? I've wondered about that too, QOP. Perhaps she's refreshing her wardrobe:

http://tinyurl.com/2llvtj

At long last someone nails Condaleeza Rice to the wall and excoriates her for the liar and enabler she is. Thank you Walter C. Uhler!

http://www.walter-c-uhler.com/Reviews/malig.html

Addressing America's "Deeper Malignancies"
Posted 12 June 2008

If you want to know what's wrong with the foreign policy establishment in the United States, look no further than Condoleezza Rice's article, "The New American Realism," published in the July/August 2008 issue of Foreign Affairs." Not only has the Council on Foreign Relations spread its pages wide open for an infamous interventionist -- a lying and deceitful enabler of the Bush administration's illegal, immoral unprovoked invasion of Iraq - it also readmitted Ms. Rice without requiring anything resembling a mea culpa for the crimes against humanity that have lowered her, the Bush administration and the United States to the depths of moral disrepute around the world.

Why publish the words of a liar and alleged war criminal? Who takes her seriously? Was her article accepted for publication because of her high position in the thoroughly discredited and morally bankrupt Bush administration? Or was publication a "no brainer," simply because the foreign policy elite at the Council on Foreign Relations actually shares Ms. Rice's smug interventionist conceit?

Whatever the excuse, it doesn't pass the smell test. Why? Because Rice's unimaginative, evasive and euphemism-riddled whitewash of Bush's disastrous "Time of Troubles" would barely merit a grade of "C" in any freshman course devoted to U.S. foreign policy.

Ms. Rice's case is not a matter of affirmative action encountering