Wow, Sally, what a great article and analogy ... waiting for Godot! Yeah, you betcha!

* The American Chickenhawk in its Native Habitat

[...]Randi [Rhodes], well, she don’t play dat. She bites down on a topic & locks her jaw like a pit bull & doesn’t back down. Nowhere is this tactic more in evidence than in this confrontation from Larry King Live where weenie pundit Ben Ferguson attempts to take her down about Iraq & ends up getting his ass handed to him, but not before Ms Rhodes has shredded it, stomped it, backed over it a couple times with the car, & fed it to the pigeons.

Let’s go to the transcript, shall we? In the process of trying to defend his position in the 101st Fighting Keyboarders, Little Ben says, "I have friends in Iraq", as if this makes him an expert in US Mid-East Policy.

But that’s just the opening Randi needs: ...

http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/05/15/late-nite-fdl-the-american-chickenhawk-in-its-native-habitat/

Sally -- How do you do it? That is -- give so much food for thought with each succinct spoonful of astrobites. This is a marvelous parallel theme to contemplate in re: Lucky (Rove) dancing on Pozzo's (Cheney) lease.
Let's signal the troops to come to this thread and continue our celestial deliberations in re the matter of: We The People vs. Bush/Cheney Cabal.
I hope this one doesn't go through twice -- not sure how that happen when I post a reply.

Waiting. What an enigma. Why are we waiting for this malevolent cabal to be suddenly and humanly inspired? Why are we waiting to for the Democrats to jump off the corporate gravy train? Why are we waiting to create affordable, alternative enrgies?

Many have STOPPED WAITING. They are looking at their own respective lives, then ACTING on their talents, helping to shift Human consciousness, contributing personal energy to create a finer world, a saner world, a more loving world. And thankfully for if there is to be a world, we must counter this incredible hatred and disrespect.

This was excellent, Sally.

This is the one of the kernels, Sally. I love this kind of focused writing so much. It's not about them. Maybe about it. I have always been enchanted with the theme of Waiting for Godot and existential philosophy in general. You mentioned this waiting factor in one of your comments a while back and it has stayed with me. We stand right in the spot, where life is really unfolding and we always look someplace else and miss some of where we are.

This is one of the amazing things I find about these discussion rooms newly sprouted in our collective life. It's a place where we can live and breathe while waitng for life to happen. I think our ongoing talks together bring us more into the moment and the seed of joy in experiencing the present. More in touch with ourselves.

Thank you.

I agree with you wholeheartedly, Karen.

Thanks, Sally, it does seem somehow that we are all holding our breaths, or maybe listening out for the other shoes(s) to drop while taking action on our own, as Karen said.

Been thinking about Joanna Oregon and some posts on previous thread re Wicca, etc. I think there is a common universal feeling among all people that there is some old knowledge that is lost - should be revered- is very important-- and it occured to me today that none or few of us remember past lives after the age of 3 in the present life.

So indeed there is this old, important knowledge out there in more ways than one. And maybe just by living in harmony with the Earth, we can tap into it.

Needless to say Sally, I think this is a fantastic piece. You always manage to take the big picture and condense it to its basic elements, thus making it much easier to comprehend.

As for KKK there comes a moment when even dance marathoners have to stop and when they do they are worn out beyond expression. I see Rove as the apex of all the grief and sorrow that has been visited upon this country and the world since he twisted GWB into the presidency. He is the domino that can knock all the others down and them out of our lives.

Claudia Dikinis made a prediction before the 2004 election where she said that B*** would get in but that his administration would begin to unravel like a ball of yarn and he, GWB, would end up as the most reviled president in history. I waited, and now see it happening. The Plame case is part and parcel of that unraveling as it is a metaphor for their tactics, their lies and the wickedness they have wrought. So you are right about the waiting, for I am waiting for that particular domino to fall and begin knocking down their evil empire.

Thanks Sally,

I love literary and cultural references in writing when it's done well. Your insight and intelligence shine for all of us!

I've observed lately that in all this waiting we've been doing we've delved deeply into psychology, spirituality, metaphysics and some serious self examination both as a nation and as individuals. We have learned where we stand on human issues, and social conditions. We have all pretty much come to the conclusion that in some way we are beginning as individuals and in groups to become co-creators of a future. Right now the how is getting worked out, but the why is obvious. What we collectively want is something much much different that what we've had historically. Something new that is essentially about Right Human Relations.

I think waiting for Godot has it definite value. It gives those of us who care to put the mental energy in a chance to think of solutions, to come to terms with the past, to gleen the useful and let go of the harmful and especially to examine ourselves and how we tie into the present situation. Are we part of the problem? Part of the solution? One thing I know is that this forum and others I visit aren't about revenge or just substituting our guys in the halls of power. There's some seriously evolved human beings here who have power and confidence and most importantly the intelligence and empathy to make a difference that truly changes the course of history. I find it a blessing, a profound pleasure and the most hopeful thing in a very long time.

Does anybody remember--who is it in the Bush administration who has dual citizenship: U.S. & Germany?

Is it Rove?

A few dual citizens--------US-Israel.....bjt

Yep, I had forgotten about the US/Israel ones, Betsy. There is also somebody with US/Germany but I can't remember who.

Of course, about all of them are US/Multinational Corporation--US in name only.

Someone sent great line to the local paper recently: Members of Congress should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers so we can see who their corporate sponsors are.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=1053672&mesg_id=1057342

Apparently he does. Does that mean he can leave the U.S. and take shelter there?

Thanks for link, Anon. Yep, that was in the back of my mind. As they often say on Law and Order (my law school) he is a flight risk.

However, the German government is perhaps not too friendly to our present admin and might extradite.

Dual citizenship? That would be Karl Rove, US/Germany, if I remember right. I'll see if I can get the link again.

Karl Rove, George Tenet, Chertoff and Wolfowitz all have duel citizenship. If they would flee to Switzerland they could not be extradited. Karl Rove is the grandson of Karl Heinz Roverer, the man whose company built Birchenau, a concentration camp in Nazi Germany.

JoannaOregon-I love you!! I laughed out loud reading your post. I caught Randi that night and was so proud. Made up for all the times I was reprimanded for being too loud and opinionated "for a girl"
Sally, what a thought provoking article.
Something on Rove and Bush both-the lack of love in their stories. Different stories but both seem to have had to deal with life from a place of not having anyone to trust, no one to turn to. I wonder how much of the human tragedy just comes down to a lack of mother love and maternal power? Not completely thought through but I have always shuddered when reading some of the details such the death of Bush's sister and the betrayal of Rove by his mother and stepfather and then his mother's suicide.
I agree, Goldensilence, that the people who participate in this blog are highly conscious and turned toward the light. We grow impatient with the outrageous paths our leaders have chosen but we don't want vengeance rather a change of paths, a change of pace. Love is what is needed . And will we have enough time to grow the love we need?
I had a hard day at work-people are being pushed harder and harder to produce and what I am seeing is that the majority of coworkers seem to be trying harder and harder to stay in control which is so often turned into cruelty toward our public who are being squeezed so hard by cut after cut in public benefits and there is also cruelty towards each other. UMHHH! I just started praying but I admit to being afraid of the energy and I wonder where this is all heading--waiting for Godot?

Well & there have been literally billions of human becomings without parents that didn't turn into arrogant psychopathic omnicidal pink supremacist killers. Lack of parental love as an excuse doesn't do it for me. Until the advent of anti-biotics in the 40s, a child was lucky to have one parent by the time s/he reach adolescence... orphanages were a norm. ;O)

You're a darlin', clymela.

It just struck me that maybe Godot is a pseudonym for G-d?

Dear Sally, Rove has a had Saturn 180 Mars two times since Scooter's indictment. On Jun 18 2006, Mars Conj Saturn will oppose the Brain's natal Mars. I think our little party's just begun. Starman

Bill, from your lips to the ears of the cosmos. Did you also notice that transiting South Node is on Rove's Saturn. That's usually a karmic loss. It could be something from your past in this life or even something from a past life, but it's a loss and his Saturn squares his Sun, maybe a loss of power or authority or complete respect. Dare we hope it will be a loss of freedom.

Sally...literary astrologly....love it!
As for poor Jason Leopold....he could be getting 'Gary Webb'ed....I worry a lot about that now (Gary Webb if you don't remember was the reporter who broke the story of the CIA seeding cocaine into LA's ghetto areas b. c. 1990, all of which had HUD mortage holders in it....the drug traffic drove the low income HUD people out.....and their properties reverted to HUD, who then could resell again. Gary's story was published, and then the San Jose Mercury News got leaned on and they fired him and repudiated the story. Gary was blackballed (a writer friend of mine knew him) and he ended up doing investigating up in Sacramento...he broke a story on racial profiling done by the CA Hwy Patrol....and he got sweiboated again. It cost him his marriage. In Dec of 2004 he was found dead...suicide by 2 gun shots to the head. Yeh...right...he joined a long line of dead investigative reporters....

Philo...you probably missed my teeth story also...2 broken teeth a month apart, plus cracked ones, old fillings (they only last about 25 years) and I was on my 2nd sets of fillings. And here I am, lost my career again, no money....but found out that I could go to the dental school in SF (University of the Pacific) and do a payment plan (no insurance of any kind)...so my work includes 5 crowns, etc...I ended up doing some of the stuff by being the patient my graduating dentist ( a 26 year old woman) needs to have to do her boards...in the end about $2800 worth of work, which would have been 4 times that much in a regular dental office. If you live in a big enough town, this is a great way to go.

PS...the crowns are $490 for gold...$62 to rebuild the tooth. I have no idea what a crown costs in the real world.

Dear Sally,
Wonderful as usual~I have been traveling a great deal lately and everywhere I go and everyone I speak with seems to feel the same way about Bush~ disgusted!
Do I dare allow myself to dream of a change?

This site gives their take on 50 people in America they consider loathsome ~Here’s two of my favorites to loath~Their take on the other 48 is pretty good too! Check out #1

The 50 Most Loathsome People in America
http://www.buffalobeast.com/91/50.htm

12. BARBARA BUSH
CHARGES: Her polluted womb nurtured the seed of American decadence. The root of America’s decay; the poison tree from whence the fruit loop George W. Bush sprang. This unfeeling, unthinking patrician hag spawned America’s most notorious welfare child, whose every glaring deficiency has been excused or underwritten by undeserved wealth. Chuckling, she remarked of poor people displaced by Hurricane Katrina, "And so many of the people in the arena here, you know, were underprivileged anyway, so this is working very well for them." Of their plans for permanent relocation, she speculated: "What I’m hearing, which is sort of scary, is they all want to stay in Texas." A true aristocrat, she sees poor people as another species.
EXIBIT A: George H.W., George W., Jeb, Neil, Jenna, Barbara, Noelle, succeeding generations.
SENTENCE: Hysterectomy on principle. Bound and thrown into Lake Pontchartrain. If she floats, burned at the stake. If she drowns,~even better.

15. KARL ROVE
CHARGES: A greasy pig whose only distinction in life is his total lack of decency. Rove is decidedly not a genius; he is simply missing the part of his soul that prevents the rest of us from kicking elderly women in the face. His admirers have elevated fanatical, amoral ambition to the status of a virtue, along with lying, cheating, and negligent homicide, all in the name of "values." Quite possibly the worst person in the worst White House in American history.
EXIBIT A: "As people do better, they start voting like Republicans - unless they have too much education and vote Democratic, which proves there can be too much of a good thing."
SENTENCE: Lowered, head first, into oil refinery smokestack.

The noose around bloggers (us) is tightening. Read the 3rd paragraph, there is hardly any hyper-link that cannot be used to link to pornography, including this one.

http://news.com.com/2100-1028_3-6072601.html?part=rss&tag=6072601&subj=news

The play supports the theme of "existentialism", which marks its success. Since the two Vladimir and Estrangen exist, they ve to do something in life and so they are waiting for Godot. They believe that the coming of Godot might change their future.

The Choice For Political Freedom

"The existential conflict in all societies stems from the natural urge of individuals to be free, as the ruling factions seek to limit citizen choices and their inborn drive. The rationale that governments have a legitimate function and role to regulate and enforce civic conduct, so that public order can be maintained, is the universal axiom used for justifying the State. If there is an organic purpose to maintain a civil order, does it automatically follow that the
desired formula for compliance rests within the mechanisms established by government? The posing of this question and familiar popular reaction reflects the intense discomfort most individuals have dealing with innate essentials."

"That final analysis, which was so popular over forty years ago, taught that errors in political policies have momentous consequences. Today the public has even less acumen but far greater absolution for their government. Skepticism is in short supply and constructive cynicism virtually absent. The freedom to resist the dishonesty is essential, while the freedom to accept the treachery is the popular viewpoint. All freedom is not equal, especially when false loyalties leads to and requires the destruction of civic wisdom. Peace is too high a price to pay for the absence of responsible individual freedom. And security of the state is a blight against all civilization. Camus stood for quiet solitary of the individual, while the clones for world democracy demand controlled compliance of the masses."

Politics and existentialism:http://existentialist.blogspot.com/

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article13076.htm

If you missed the pictures, released yesterday,
of the plane crashing into the Pentagon you can
view it here. While I still don't see the plane -
maybe you can. The comments posts are great -
people aren't buying it.

US spells out plan to bomb Iran

By IAN BRUCE, Defence Correspondent

The main plan calls for a rolling, five-day bombing campaign against 400 key targets in Iran, including 24 nuclear-related sites, 14 military airfields and radar installations, and Revolutionary Guard headquarters.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article13066.htm

===
The Real Assault on America

By Paul Craig Roberts

It has become commonplace to hear Americans dismiss the Bush regime's illegal and unconstitutional exercise of power on the grounds that only those implicated in terrorism have anything to fear. These Americans need to ask themselves why, if only evil doers have anything to fear from government, the Founding Fathers bothered to write the Constitution?

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article13070.htm

===
America the Fearful

By Bob Herbert

In the dark days of the Depression, Franklin Roosevelt counseled Americans to avoid fear. George W. Bush is his polar opposite. The public's fear is this president's most potent political asset. Perhaps his only asset.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article13075.htm

Thank you for the political posts WV. I came in late and was multitasking ( preparing dinner) when they showed the Pentagon video clip on CNN. I don't do realplayer on my Mac, so it was good to read the comments of those who did watch.

My fear has turned to white hot fury! I have been trying to tune out the world and create a beautiful serene space while painting this mermaid picture, and enjoying the best season of the year here. I live in an "in-between place" Between dry land & wetland that is covered by water, the requisite number of days per year outlined by the EPA.
Between tides.
And the best time of day is between dawn and sunrise, when the seagulls and the herons fly through the little valley, below eye level, and are glimpsed through the new green leaves not yet unfurled completely.

If you stay away from the TV and the Internet, what could cause such dis-ease? Grocery shopping that's all! Something we all have to do! My Pension was increased by $20.00 this year Meow Mix has increased by $1.50 a bag. There's my raise!!!!!!!!! Never mind that almost every other grocery store item has also increased by .50 - 1.00!
Then there's the fuel! I stopped at the gas station to top my tank and the diesel pump was blocked by a honkin' Ford SUV wuith GOVERNMENT TAGS. I asked the driver what mileage they get. Under 20 mi. per G of course. "Murikans have to give up your addiction to oil " abuses the Commander in Chief!
But we the Govt. will squeeze you to pay thru the nose to run these monstrosities on your tax $.
I can't even aFFORD TO BUY A FEW 6 PACKS OF PETUNIAS FOR MY YARD!
That's it I''v had it!
Sorry for the rant ....I'm tired of waiting for Godot, may go in search of him/her?
PQ

Haven't heard anything in the US media about the Aussie PM JOhn Howard visting Georgie - 10 days at huge Aussie taxpayer expense. Downunder, there has been heaps of clips about a mutual lovefest. Also of disturbing interest, mention was made of the vast amount of raw uranium Australia has to be mined, followed by talks of deals where Aussie supplies uranium to various countries and then later becomes the repository for the 'spent' uranium waste.

As Judi mentioned above, I too am worried about the reporter that published the article saying Rove was indicted on May 13th.

BREAKING | Jason Leopold: Karl Rove Indicted on Charges of Perjury, Lying to Investigators
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/051306W.shtml

.............

A BUZZFLASH EDITORIAL

You can take action to save the Internet by going to this site right now: http://www.savetheinternet.com

Save the Internet.com is a wonderful resource where you can sign a petition (now with over half a million names), take action, learn more about the issues at stake, and forward messages to help fight the big Telecoms who are waging a deceptive and big bucks lobbying and advertising campaign to turn the Internet into a big profit center that would end up taking away America's only open message board.

Where would you be without an Internet that belonged to the American people, not corporate profit centers, today? Think about it. It would be like going back to living in a cave. It would be like living in North Korea, where the only news is the official news.

BuzzFlash wrote an editorial on Monday, May 15, http://www.buzzflash.com/editorial/06/05/edi06033.html, about how disappointed we have been that many of the top bloggers have been running a highly deceptive ad that confuses people about who are the good guys and bad guys in this fight. These are blogs we have always admired. Indeed, we helped nurture many of them by linking to them frequently on BuzzFlash.com. It is part of our mission to help new progressive sites receive attention.

The progressive blogosphere has been vital in bringing the truth to power about the Bush Administration -- and these sites have been an essential part of that process. That is why we are still shocked that most of them are still running the very ad that could lead to a law that would be their death knell. (Many, many of the smaller blogs are active members of the Save the Internet Coalition.)

The ad in question is incisively dissected for its mendacity at: http://savetheinternet.com/=lie in an analysis by the Save the Internet Coalition (to repeat: the real good guys in this pitched battle). Read it, because the goal of the Telecom ad is to create confusion. After you read http://savetheinternet.com/=lie, you'll see just how pernicious they are being. In fact, the backers of this ad and the phony front operation called "Hands Off the Internet" are some of the same phone companies who readily complied with the illegal NSA requests for domestic call records (but that's another story).

We were glad to learn that Alternet, one of the sites who uses the broker for this ad, http://www.blogads.com/advertise/liberal_blog_advertising_network/order , quickly pulled the "trojan horse" Telecom ad off its site. And we believe Daily Kos is not carrying it either. If so, they are to be applauded for not letting dollars get in the way of contributing to the death of an open Internet.

On the other hand, we went to http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com and found the ad at the top of the site, as we did on on http://www.rawstory.com as of 6:45 AM EST on Wednesday, May 17. We also still found the ad on http://atrios.blogspot.com (although it was in the second spot there.) These progressive bloggers -- and others carrying the ad -- are enabling the enemies of the pro-democracy Internet.

Some have argued that liberals don't censor ads. But we beg to differ. One site carrying the Telecom ad even boasted that it would not carry tobacco advertising. But it will carry an ad that promotes a law that could place prohibitive barriers to a free dissemination of information on the Net? Come on now. Would the NAACP carry ads recruiting people for the Ku Klux Klan?

We understand that most sites need advertising to pay their costs and pay their salaries, and BuzzFlash has never before May 15 objected to other sites taking advertising, although we don't. But this ad is different. It's like letting someone pay you to try and persuade the public you should be hung; that is to say, all of us who believe in democracy on the Net. You can accept advertising in general, but you don't have to run every ad.

The irony is that there are many conservative groups who have joined the Save the Internet coalition because they are profoundly worried about having their views heard on the Net, which is what democracy is all about.

These ghastly ads are part of an extremely well-funded effort to seize the Internet so that the carriers can charge enormous fees for web content, although they are denying that at the moment. But all the informed players in the legislative fight know what's at stake.

One prominent blogger who would not remove the ad claims that no one reads the ads anyway. That's just plain ludicrous.

Corporations and lobbying firms did not spent up to an estimated 6.5 billion dollars on Internet ads last year because nobody reads them and they don't influence anybody. They know what they are doing.

The "Hands off the Internet" advertising and public relations campaign is aimed right at the heart of the top progressive blogs, because they want to diffuse the support for "net neutrality" enough to sidebar the issue so that enough progressives will just not make opposing their devastating legislation a priority.

That is why they are advertising on the most-trafficked progressive blogs.

The people who run these blogs are smart enough to know this. It's time they do themselves and the future of democracy on the Internet a favor.

It's time they eat some crow and remove the highly misleading and dangerous "Don't Regulate the Internet"ads.

And then they should start plugging the Save the Internet Coalition instead of the Telecom industry.

A BUZZFLASH EDITORIAL

I would encourage everyone to read the above post that Pat C put up. I would also encourage everyone to be very careful about supporting or trusting or believing one party or the other, one religion or the other, perhaps even one country or the other. It is essential to develop the skills to discriminate for ourselves. We've been saying all along that we live in dangerous times and the times are getting more dangerous and will stretch our skills in weeding our way through these things. For the reasons listed in the above Buzzflash article, it's hard for me to think that politicians would support this unless they plan to have us pay for their use with our taxes and that's a possibility.

Kiwijeanie

He has been visiting Condi and Rusmfeld. Last night there was a State Dinner in the WH. I am
glad I didn't have to sit at that table. They are
both such twits.
Somehow my invitation got lost in the mail.

Kiwijeanie did you hear that Bush said "well he's not the prettiest but you can trust him." What he meant by that no one in the US knows and confirming what WV said above "twits"

* Leopold Responds to Corallo's Denial of Fitzgerald - Luskin Meeting

Last night, I spoke to Jason Leopold on the phone for a half hour or so. Here's what he had to say about Byron York's article stating that Karl Rove's spokesman Mark Corallo told him that Jason's article Sat reporting sources told him Fitzgerald met with Luskin Fri & told him Rove has been indicted is false. ... http://talkleft.com/new_archives/014842.html

Kiwijeanie

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/060517/ids_photos_ts/r2327079915.jpg

The picture to prove it....Murdoch was there too.

A Message from "President" Gore...

http://www.alternet.org/blogs/video/36340

Jenny...Wating for the LOTTERY is also an existential wait....hahahahah

SF Chonicle editorial today on the new internet protocols happening in 2008...will the US lag behind the rest of the world?http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/05/17/EDGDOIJKNP1.DTL&hw=internet+protocols&sn=001&sc=1000

Sometimes something happens that makes me think sanity is beginning to assert itself. Here's a poll that finally makes some sense about how people are really thinking. There's no need to scratch your head and wonder, "What in the world are they thinking!"

[snip]
The survey shows a majority of the public, 56 percent, saying they would prefer to see Democrats in control of Congress after the elections.

The poll offers two cautions for the Democrats, however. One is a growing disaffection with incumbents generally. When asked whether they were inclined to reelect their current representative to Congress or look around for someone new, 55 percent said they were open to someone else, the highest since just before Republicans captured control of Congress in 1994. That suggests that some Democratic incumbents could feel the voters' wrath, although as the party in power Republicans have more at risk.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/16/AR2006051601264.html

another video source for pentagon crash.

http://www.judicialwatch.org/flight77.shtml

you can control the feed with this....very hard to see the plane...news said it was moving 535 mi per/hour and that is the reason....

Hi Judi -- I'm doing catch up w/ office work and will have some free time later in the evening to respond to your and everyones posts. PJK goes back to the Grand Jury today -- \|/

Sally...I heartedly endorse all of the above...good advice.

today I feel anxiety out there....anyone else? Yesterday was my mom's 97th birthday....and she just got a new roomate at the conv. hosp. (which makes 3 in her room)...strangely, several months ago this woman was written up in the SF Chronicle, because she is the oldest woman here in the Bay Area and a survivor of the 1906 earthquake...she will be 110 years old in September. I saw her name plaque and then I knew why she had looked familiar. Still eats like a champ, feeds herself, watches tv and has enought strength to prop herself up (with help)....and her eyes still look cognizant....remarkable. In case anyone is interested in this extraordinary woman's life, this is the story from Dec 2005
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/12/30/BAG0DGEU0820.DTL&hw=Lucille+Meyer&sn=002&sc=590
SAN FRANCISCO
At 109, city resident still going strong
Woman born in 1896 says minding her own business is the secret to her long life

She will be 110 on Dec 30 of 2006....I didn't have the article, but someone at the home told me that, and they were wrong...a New Years Eve baby originally...

speaking of women, two stories which have a weird relationship: but still, women getting shafted (the one on Congress is a good thing, I think....)http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Women_Democrats_fare_poorly_in_Congressional_0517.html

And on this dangerous situation in Turkey

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4989034.stm

well..Sally, and now it begins? Dow/Nasdag negative for the year...
http://www.rawstory.com/showarticle.php?src=http%3A%2F%2Fabcnews.go.com%2FBusiness%2Fprint%3Fid%3D1972992

judiGem,

Planet Waves has an extensive rebuttal of the pentagon film with tons of links to prove it. I looked at all of them and I'm glad I did. It seems like every move the government makes backfires on them. Being forced to release the film has been like stirring an anthill or poking at a bee hive. Lovely!

http://www.planetwaves.net/

/Eric Francis May 17, 2006 | How strange it is... (updated)

GET THIS. The USA govt has released video tape of what it claims is Fl 77 hitting the Pentagon on 9/11/01. As some of our readers know, my own analysis of crime scene photos has determined that there was no jetliner involved in that incident. That is to say, I don't buy the official story that a jetliner hit the military hqt of the free world an astonishing 1 hr after the attacks began at the World Trade Center.

Let's forget--for a moment--that the tapes were released in our Flea Wagging the Daisy Hill Puppy Farm moment, when any distraction from reality counts for extra. Let's forget that the govt claims this is are video of an airplane crash; the fact that [Offense] Dept officials are participating in the discussion just begs the question. Finally.

From what I can see, the tapes are the same as the security camera footage that came out (in the form of 4 or 5 selected frames) shortly after 9/11, showing a small, white projectile flying near the ground, & then apparently (judging from the fireball) hitting the building. But it does not look like the tall, elegant, shiny aluminum tail fin of a jetliner going by. It looks like a little missile. Which would be consistent with something, some kind of conventional (that is, not nuclear) bunker buster warhead, puncturing 3 of the Pentagon's rings. Photos of the puncture holes in brick walls several rings into the Pentagon's structure exist for anyone to see, & they are not in doubt. They are part of the official story. ... http://planetwaves.net/

(ohps! sorry Goldensilence... I see you already posted it)

JoannaOregon,

I knew you would post it but as time passed I figured you were offline.

As you can see form the small number of posts, it's been a very slow day so far.

What's pleasing is that amongst us all, we get it well-covered & global consciousness expands by our own added leavening bits of increased consciousness. No slugs here! ;O)

Apropo of our wonderful last thread where we talked about women's power, here's a living example of demented male fear of women! Like I said, men hate that they're attracted to women because they perceive it as power over them so they oppress them.

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/65604F23-027A-453F-A71E-CB7C33FAFA72.htm

Saudi king calls for female picture ban

Wednesday 17 May 2006, 0:27 Makka Time, 21:27 GMT

King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia has told newspaper editors to stop publishing pictures of women as they could lead young men astray.

After a meeting with editors on Monday, the king was reported in the Saudi media as saying that "one needs to think if he would want his daughter, sister or wife to appear like that. Of course, no one would".

Newspapers have recently broken with tradition and published pictures of women with hair covered but faces showing.

more...

May 15, 2006
psychsound@gmail.com

Fast and loose with the Constitution

The Fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution says: "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

Now compare the text of the Fourth Amendment to what the Bush administration almost put into effect four years ago. The New York Times reported a few days ago that Vice President Cheney wanted the National Security Agency to intercept domestic phone calls without a warrant. "In the weeks after the Sept. 11 attacks, Vice President Dick Cheney and his top legal adviser argued that the National Security Agency should intercept purely domestic telephone calls and e-mail messages without warrants in the hunt for terrorists, according to two senior intelligence officials." Believe it or not, people at the NSA thought this went too far and settled on a program to intercept foreign calls.

http://planetwaves.info/blog2.html

...or the modified female that is themselves. When the "dark powers that be" deliberately made a Cult of the Hypermasculine that had no room whatsoever for the female, actual women would be great "hooks" for his own. Hatred of the one made for misery of the "Other" (including Gaia/flora/fauna) as well as themselves. It's all terribly destructive nonsense & has to go if any Life is to survive. A pox on of it!

The President's goose is cooked.(I didn't know he owned one!)

"what is apparent, is that George Bush has at his disposal none — none — of the tools presidents have used to turn bad situations around: public support, party support or skilled statecraft. He’s a lame duck less than two years in to his second term. You are not being governed."

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/05/17/opinion/meyer/main1623700.shtml

Judi, thank you for the old lady story. I love these as I plan to live a long, long time and hope any decrepit body conditions won't deter me. Every time I hear this, and watch my aunt recover, I know there is something about life we instinctively treasure. Maybe the search for that treasure is what keeps us going. What is so interesting is that these centenarians all have entirely different reasons for their longevity.

My sources say that the stock market goes in about 20 year cycles of bull and bear alternately. According to this we are about 5 years or so into a bear market, where returns are much lower, and only some years will see gains. This is probably easy to verify and also to see what investments are good during these times.

'Da Vinci Code' Misses the Mark for Critics

By DAVID GERMAIN, AP Movie Writer
Tue May 16, 6:52 PM ET

"The Da Vinci Code" drew lukewarm praise, shrugs of indifference, some jeering laughter and a few derisive jabs Tuesday from arguably the world's toughest movie crowd: critics at the Cannes Film Festival.

The year's most anticipated movie, "The Da Vinci Code" was a generally faithful adaptation of Dan Brown's monster best seller, spinning a murder thriller that stems from a cover-up of secrets about Christianity's roots.

While readers worldwide devoured the novel, reaction from Cannes critics ranged from mild endorsement of its potboiler suspense to groans of ridicule over its heavy melodrama.

"It's a movie about whether the greatest story ever told is true or not, and it's not the greatest movie ever screened, is it?" said Baz Bamigboye, a film columnist for London's Daily Mail. "As a thriller, well," he continued, shrugging.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060516/ap_en_mo/film_cannes_da_vinci_code_2&printer=1;_ylt=AhVzvfC9QZWbvDXvjYm117emG78C;_ylu=X3oDMTA3MXN1bHE0BHNlYwN0bWE-

"The White House, in an abrupt reversal, has agreed to let the full Senate and House of Representatives intelligence committees review President George W. Bush's domestic spying program, lawmakers said on Tuesday"

From Reuters.

There's a huge difference between the semetic jews & the anglo supremacist "jew"... one gets scapegoated into the ovens, the other dictates policy & power. From the early biblical days, one was the local peaceable population, & the other was the anglo invader from the extreme north who enslaved them... one of their striking patterns. They're not the same... not even today.

I don't think the reversal is scripted. It's all politics and they have to respond to what is happening. They can't control it. The "secret" part of all of this is such a sham. To me this puts the Great Decider, Bring it On, Stay the Course, resolved king and dictator into the role of the Incredible Shrinking Man. A little Saturn perhaps?

For some reason, I think public pressure is worth continuing. I haven't seen this much unity in society in ages. Way over half the population is disgusted with the government. It used to be that this number didn't care one way or another. There are no guarantees but this sentiment carries potential.

One astute lady's opinion...

"Bottom line in my book is they all know they are facing major lawsuits from private citizens and are trying to squirm and worm their way out of this."

So who's in charge? Who's on first?

So at this point while the enemy is continually weakening, the opposition, while not losing momentum and sight of danger, can turn the potential victory into enthusiasm, which will add might.

I'm with PQ. Might not wait for this chap Godot. Three weeks left of the NN in Aries.

Does anyone want to NOT wait for Godot by donating to John Conyers re-election? He's one of the few we really, really want to keep. He fights for all Americans and all Americans should support him.

http://www.johnconyers.com/

Larry King Tonight -- tv alert
Wed, 17 May 2006 22:45:43 UT
Robert Redford's a Big Dog Greenie and he'll be on Larry King tonight with the CEO of Chevron -- THAT should be a hoot! Will Larry keel over with excitement?? Tune in to see -- particulars below. Also, a little clip to watch on "Kicking the Habit."
Jude
Larry King Live at 9:00 p.m. ET
on Wednesday, May 17, 2006

I think Larry's suspenders might snap. Maybe hit him in the forehead and knock in a third eye.

Read alot of the links from Planet Waves...was struck by the Operation Northwoods page...
http://www.pentagonresearch.com/north.html

I remember so well thinking the world was going to end in Oct 1962....and now it looks as if we actually did come close...no wonder JFK was offed....

PHOENIX FIVE EARTH CHANGES BULLETIN
May 16, 2006 by MW Mandeville (Black Canyon City, Arizona)

NOTICE: Due to Presidential Executive Orders, the National Security Agency may have read this email without warning, warrant, or notice. They may do this without any judicial or legislative oversight. You have no recourse nor protection save to call for the impeachment of the All the Criminals in the White House.

BULLETIN ITEM: Unconvincing

The recently released Pentagon 911 Tapes fail to support the government's case. In fact the whole release and media hoopla about it is lame.

The media keeps saying, See; Jane; see, look at the jet liner. It is smasing into the Pentagon.

Sorry, I still do not see a jetliner nor anything of its scale in size. I do see a very small fuzzy white streak moving horizontal hugging the ground at not more than 50 feet. It is not a descending object. It is not a crashing object. It is an object on a carefully aimed trajectory. I doubt very much that an inexperienced pilot who has never actually flown a jet performed that feat.

I am more persuaded than ever to the Mossad conspiracy theory. I suspect that this will be a widespread reaction.

One of the prime datums in this whole sordid affair is the refusal of the government to provide any plain and simple evidence which proves its assertions and disproves any other. If the story is true, it would be extreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeemely easy to prove it well enough to destroy the other theories. A few g%d##mmed real parts will go a long way. Release of ALL the other videos would probably put it over the top. Failure to do so proves a conspiracy to withhold vital evidence. There is remaining NO valid security issue for doing so, thus the motive for secrecy more probable than not is DARK.

Best Wishes, Michael Wells Mandeville,

I've been lurking for some months as I don't have much to contribute. However, I do so enjoy the articles by Sally, Morgana, et al. The comments are so far above anything I can articulate. May I say something here and if I'm out of line, sorry.

What would you as beings do if you found out something about your birth that shocked you somewhat. OK..I knew that my mother and father did not want girls. (Gra'ma told me, not to mention some offhand comments by Mom). I have had issues with feelings of worthlessness most of my life. Not good enough..too tall...too fat, etc. Moon in Aries, Capricorn rising....Felt like a little dog tied in the backyard. No barking or digging holes allowed. Just give her the minimum attention and food and leave her alone. And, she damn well better not make too much noise!!

Well, I found out that my mother threw a fit when I was born and did not want to take me home from the hospital! My frantic father had to call his cousin to talk Mom in to bringing me home. The nurses advised her that she could not just leave me there. Do you know why she didn't want me? BECAUSE I AM FEMALE and she didn't want any girls. For Goddess sake, I'm taking care of these people. I am so p---'d right now.

It is it Neptune that's bringing this to light?

Good evening.

Patricia

Editorial: New Doctored Video of Pentagon Attack Release - Confirms Boeing Was Not Involved

Joe Quinn
Signs of the Times
17/05/2006

It only took four and a half years, but finally the U.S. government has seen fit to confirm what so many of us have been saying all along - Pentagon security cameras recorded no evidence of a Boeing 757 hitting the Pentagon.
The videos comprise the footage from each of the two security cameras stationed close to each other at one end of the Pentagon. The first video contains nothing new given that it is simply the footage from which 5 stills were taken and released in early 2002 by the Pentagon, the extra footage merely being the scene after the impact. The second video comprises previously unseen footage from the security camera that is slightly closer to the impact point. The Pentagon alleges that in this video the "nose cone" of a plane can be seen in one frame. It should be noted that the security cameras appear to be the standard type installed in train stations and airports around the world. Most people will have seen footage from such cameras showing people walking in "jumps", which is due to the fact that the camera records a still image every 2 seconds or so.

http://signs-of-the-times.org/signs/friendly/signs_20060517_friendly.html

Joanna, in re: your comment on the "Hypermasculine" and gynophobia in general, it's well worth mentioning that this is why male homosexuality is so dangerous for the patriarchal mindset.

I have a running, evolving discussion with various receptive friends that a good portion of our social problems stem from the suppression of sexuality in males. If it were socially acceptable for men to express love toward one another (sexually, emotionally, etc.), maybe we wouldn't have all these damn wars. If boys were encouraged to masturbate and get to know their bodies, maybe we wouldn't have miserable men who can't become emotionally available and physically loving toward others.

IMO, war is male desire for closeness that has been suppressed, misdirected, turned feral, and gone into destructive mode. And we all pay for it many times over.

((((((((((((((Patricia)))))))))))))))
I too am dealing with childhood issues. It must be Neptune! And the scorpio full moon configuration.
My Mother taught me to be myself, then criticised me for not being like her! She a small blonde dimpled Libra sun venus conjunct. It didn't work for this tall brunette taurus sun opposite scorpio moon model bluestocking intellectual type.
Go cut some brush! It worked for me this afternoon!
22 years ago when my engagement didn't work out I had the best groomed yard in NJ!
PQ

Patricia,

Well on this site we ALL LOVE FEMALES! We believe in females, we honor females, and we put our trust in females. We also honor female anger, grief, joy and wisdom. That's what all this higher consciousness is about.

Patricia, deerhearted soul.
Because you see it you will be fine. Your experience is my own mother's, the sixth daughter, born at home so no issue of being left in a hospital. My grandmother was 45 at the time and so there had been a span of years between children, wouldn't you know a son was born 10 months after my mom. Neglected emotionally yes, my grandmother even sent her a 50th bithday card telling her how much she hadn't wanted her and never got over it! Sheesh. I can only tell you that my mother is the most compassionate woman I know, strong beyond belief, an inspiration and i love her dearly. The future is yours may your wisdom carry you into it with grace. i wish you fair wind for your journey.

PQ, hard work, that's my sure cure for what ails me as well. Gardening a passion. how are those tomatoes?

Joe, I am so glad to find you here! Your words mirror many thoughts that have been visiting me of late. Your perspective is valued.

Just checking in -- and catching up with all of the incredible higher intel on this blog. At this point -- I need a bit of reorientation -- direction. Ph

Exactly, Joe... in addition, that supressed kundalini energy has been deliberately long coopted by monsters in all its systems, particularly religious, in which to channel... you guessed it! war & ignorance. The bushadruggie regime is STUFFED with self-hating gay homophobes & transsexuals (e.g. ann coulter)... nothin' meaner... absolutely nothin'.

The neolithic great mother peoples all over the globe had long known about the kundalini & taught people how to use it to balance their energetic systems in these wonderful temples... some of which I visited this past fall in the UK. They had developed the understanding of the chakras & understood that the kundalini was the source energy for health, mental clarity, illumination & self-realization. The invaders grabbed this knowledge to plug it up below the belt in the Peoples... producing extreme irritability, anger, guilt, grief, ad nauseum, that we still see today. This natural "initiation" is the only human inheritance worth anything at all, & it was, of course, the one stolen.

Hey all--re the Pentagon 'video footage' from 9/11, be sure to read what Wayne Madsen says about Cuban and Venezuelan intelligence regarding those events...probably all the more reason Bushit considers them dangerous(it's the first May 17 post here):

http://www.waynemadsenreport.com/

Murtha Renews Call for U.S. Troop Withdrawal from Iraq

By Associated Press

05/17/06 "AP" -- -- - Congressman John Murtha says President Bush has no plan for victory in Iraq, and U.S. troops should leave.

Renewing his call for withdrawal, the Democrat from Pennsylvania says one of his military friends told him "when you open up the strategy for victory there's nothing inside."

At a news conference on Capitol Hill, Murtha said 80 percent of Iraqis want the U-S out of their country and 47 percent say it's O-K to kill Americans.

He says it's time to redeploy and "let the Iraqis settle this themselves." Murtha contends it won't be any better six months from now.

The decorated Vietnam veteran and ranking Democrat on the House Appropriations defense subcommittee says people everywhere he goes tell him they agree with him, and that includes military personnel and mothers with sons in Iraq.

(Copyright 2006 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.)

CounterPunch

November 1, 2002

Exposing Karl Rove
by WAYNE MADSEN
http://www.counterpunch.org/madsen1101.html

Joe,

Also while all normal human emotions and forms of expression (fathers kissing sons, crying, etc.) are harshly suppressed in boys, they are aggressively encouraged to express the one emotion they are allowed to have - anger. This is the exact opposite of what girls are taught. They are harshly discouraged from expressing anger.

So when men can only express anger and women can never express anger then we have a major breakdown in our basic humanity, not to mention some highly confused issues in simple communication.

Patricia -- Is Neptune in your natal 4th house -- or is it transiting your 4th house? I had a similiar (not as extreme as yours) situation w/ parental abandonment at an early age -- yet - I spent 5 years mothering my mother -- who I learned was *thrown aside at birth and left for dead* when the midwife told my grandmother that her daughter (my mother) was a stillborn. It wasn't until my mother's father heard her cry while she was wrapped in a sheet -- that they realized she was a healthy newborn -- and he rescued her -- as they were about to bury her.
My mother had a very difficult time being a mother during her motherhood -- as she abandoned both of her children -- and then became the most astonishing grandmother -- to my children. Part guilt -- but more out of ON TAPPED LOVE -- that she had to repress or did not know how to express in her time. She has Moon and Mars in Scoprio -- T squared to Saturn Neptune Venus in Leo and Uranus in Aquarius.
It was during Neptune's transit thru my 4th house wherein I took care of her -- that I learned the lesson of compassion -- in spite of early childhood abandonment issue -- which sometimes are no ones fault -- other than the conditions of the times.

Joanna O
Hej! Well said!

If one listens to the wind -- feels the earth - knows the way of fire -- flows with water -- we learn in good time that all of our relations have a poignant soul (neptunian) tale to share.

SYLLABICATION: poign·ant
PRONUNCIATION: poinynt
ADJECTIVE: 1a. Physically painful: “Keen, poignant agonies seemed to shoot from his neck downward” (Ambrose Bierce). b. Keenly distressing to the mind or feelings: poignant anxiety. c. Profoundly moving; touching: a poignant memory. See synonyms at moving. 2. Piercing; incisive: poignant criticism. 3a. Neat, skillful, and to the point: poignant illustrations supplementing the text. b. Astute and pertinent; relevant: poignant suggestions. 4. Agreeably intense or stimulating: poignant delight. 5. Archaic a. Sharp or sour to the taste; piquant. b. Sharp or pungent to the smell.
ETYMOLOGY: Middle English poinaunt, from Old French poignant, present participle of poindre, to prick, from Latin pungere. See peuk- in Appendix I.
OTHER FORMS: poignance, poignan·cy —NOUN
poignant·ly —ADVERB

Did anybody see the footage of the jet hitting the pentagon in the last couple of days? The film looked very grainy for a camera meant to watch over the pentagon, and I didn't see the plane...I just saw a huge explosion....

Sally, once again thanks for your wonderful astrology.

Anybody contemplate Al Gore for President in 2008? Cat fight with Hillary, or whoever else choses to run no doubt.

Patricia wrote: "Well, I found out that my mother threw a fit when I was born and did not want to take me home from the hospital! My frantic father had to call his cousin to talk Mom in to bringing me home. The nurses advised her that she could not just leave me there. Do you know why she didn't want me? BECAUSE I AM FEMALE and she didn't want any girls. For Goddess sake, I'm taking care of these people. I am so p---'d right now."

Patricia -- perhaps your mother suffered from postpartum depression -- and has absolutely no recall of her behavior immediately or months after your birth.
http://www.postpartumstress.com/

A little ditty on feminine divinity in the Mideast.....my most favorite lady -- Asherah. PH

Asherah, the Tree of Life and the Menorah : Continuity of a Goddess symbol in Judaism?

The First Sophia Fellowship Feminist Theology Lecture .
The College of St. Mark & St. John. Plymouth. 4th December 1996 .

I am very happy to be here today to give the first Sophia lecture in Feminist Theology, and to have had the most interesting experience this term of living and working among you, taking part in the life of the College. I will express my appreciation and thanks to all who have helped me, later. They have given me the opportunity of taking up research on a theme that has been of interest for a long time; what I present to you tonight is part of work in progress.

That there might be a connection, rooted in the Hebrew bible, between the female figure there named Asherah, the Garden of Eden, the Tree of Life and the Menorah (the seven branched candlestick of Jewish life and ritual) occurred to me when in 1991 I was writing a study of the biblical divine female figure of Wisdom, Hochma in Hebrew, Sophia in Greek. To some extent it appeared that Hochma was the alter ego of God presented in the feminine gender. In doing this work I looked at other female divine figures in the Hebrew bible, of whom Asherah was certainly one of the most prominent. Where Hochma, Wisdom, encapsulated the comprehension of creation and the brilliance of order and the intellect, it seemed that Asherah stood for the concept of life, its physicality, its sacrality, its cyclical renewal within nature and the hope by the human beings who worshipped her that such renewal was some sort of symbol of eternal life.

It seemed of particular interest that this female divine figure was always associated with trees. LXX translated the word Asherah into in Greek as also, grove, or alse, groves, or occasionally by dendra, trees; Vulgate in Latin provided lucus or nemus, a grove or a wood (thus KJV bible uses grove or groves with the consequent loss of Asherah's name and knowledge of her existence to English language readers of the bible over some 400 years).

http://www.asphodel-long.com/html/asherah.html

JoannaO - this is the Mistress of my dream - pictures of living Asheroths --
http://www.asphodel-long.com/html/photo_gallery.html

headline on rawstory.com:
JUDITH MILLER TO CLAIM SHE GOT TIP OFF OF 9/11 ATTACK

I hope this link doesn't rock your boats -- but in fact -- connect you to the sacred feminine -- vis-a-vis tantric sexuality, within -- deep within.
http://www.sacredsource.com/products.asp?dept=116

That's wonderful, Philomena!! Looking at them opened up my crown with a lovely rush of light! Thank you. And here is the site of photos my companions made in Oct while in the UK... you'll see again Stonehenge, & there's Glastonbury Well & Avebury. And at Avebury, there are these old, old beech trees with marvelous serpentine roots that flowed down the bank. The really entwine my mind. ;O)

http://www.flickr.com/photos/joannaoregon

And then there's photos of the great neolithic temple deep in Malta that I found.

http://web.infinito.it/utenti/m/malta_mega_temples/

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/malta.htm

http://www.maltavista.net/en/list/photo/1502.html

And thank you for the Tantric piece... I'll read it tonight... looks delightfully comprehensive.

The play should nt have been a success what i think so. The characters at the end decides to commit suicide if they are unsuccessful in meeting godot the next day. They finally loose hope at the end and this should nt be the moral of the play.

It appears that the anglo invaders most settled in the mid east & what we call India in several different waves. The pattern (one of them) is unmistakable... a hierarchy with themselves at top & the original small dark goddess peoples at the bottom as servants & slaves ("untouchables" in India" & what was left of them) after stealing everything they had. Among the hebrews as they came to be known, they set themselves up as the ruling levites... the "priestly" group "entitled" to be waited on hand/foot & with the major hoarding of material resources. Same-old same-old... ;O)

Sounds like a necrophilic gay playwrite imo, Helena.

If I was Al Gore I wouldn't be waiting for Godot. I'd be hoping 2008 was just around the corner
As a keen observer of the American scene from afar - a Scotsman living in New Zealand
I'm intrigued that Al Gore may try to run again.
In 2000 I wrote a book on the Astro Carto Graphy model and predicted Gore wouldn't win in Florida and consequently not make it to the White House
Dubya has some good stuff thro' Florida. Al has nothing much. Likewise Washington DC
For sure quite flimsy evidence but hey it turned out to be right.
Question(s) to help my research.
When would he have to make a decision to run?
And if he does run where/when the 2008 Democratic National Covention to select the candidate?
As to held I appreciate it may not yet be decided
And by the way I'm also a big fan of Ebertin and if you're still struggling for an astrological explanation of how come he was done out of Florida and the White House. Look no further than that tightish Saturn/Pluto cjn in his chart. To (partially) quote Ebertin.
"A person who is prevented by others from reaping the success due to him or her as the result of hard work."
And Wow! Just run off his chart based on his transits around Nov 01 2008
Transitting Pluto tight cjn radix Jupiter.
Ebertin again. Describes Jupiter/Pluto axis as the success axis
Can this guy win in 2008 - You better believe it.

Remember the phone jaming in NH in 2000 we discussed back a few articles? Raw Story says James Tobin, the RNC officia in charge, got 2 yrs in the slammer....

wv, figured Murdoch would not be far away. Before Faux news there were his Aussie rags. Since the fifties I remember they were always full of drama and half truths. You can bet he helped get Howard into office, much like his organization sold Bush to the US public. Unfortunately here in NZ, he has too much media influence also. He's the only game in town for satelite TV and international links. Otherwise, its rabbit ears reception and 3 channels.

I've made my mind up. Decided. I'm not waiting for Godot. An attack on Iran. A terrorist attack. A man. The fall of the patriarchy. Some jackass to try and tell me a lie or the truth. For things to get better. For things to get worse.

I'm waiting for one thing. To come to my senses and live life to the fullest.

Hoist the mainsail as the North Node of the Moon voyages into Pisces. When everything will come undone and we will have no choice but to engage in song, dance, poetry, stories and myths, and our real dreams. We'll swim with the sea creatures, and you know me. I'll be diving for sunken treasure.

We have so much Uranus/Neptune coming up with the NN, Uranus in Pisces and Neptune in Aquarius in mutual reception. And the Saturn opposition. I think this is important as we prepare for the Plutonian transformation of our government. With this energy, many of us are envisioning the society we want and even learning to get along in new ways with all kinds in Bloghastan. The more this progresses, the more we will probably grasp these ideas from our collective imagination. In the shambles that Pluto leaves behind, this work now will be very very useful. As the aristocracy gasps and pleads for life, the egalitarian strategists will be ready. There is room for everything. Destruction and creation.

The reason I think that the last century was so hard for mankind was the discovery of Pluto, atomic weapons, and the power of human destruction. Pluto can scare the life out of people but as we get accustomed to his presence, I think we might become less afraid. That's why I think this century just might be better. If we come to an agreement with Pluto and harness his power, we can do wonders. It could go either way. He's not against us.

The pluto extremes in Sagittarius have taken us on that bipolar trip of false optimism in the Clinton years to what I think is false pessimism in the Bush years. The "in-between" is the treasure I think Pluto will leave us with as he exits Sagittarius.

"Someone asked Pablo Casals, the great master of the cello, why he continued in his late 80's practicing three hours a day. And he said,'I'm starting to notice some improvement.'"

Goldensilence wrote: "So when men can only express anger and women can never express anger then we have a major breakdown in our basic humanity, not to mention some highly confused issues in simple communication." I think that's one of the ways we are pitted against one another by the powers that be. They have long known that ordinary people are easily distracted from what really matters by things like gender, race, religion, etc.

Thank you, Goldensilence, jm, Tseka and JoannaO. for your comments to my comments. Nice to know that the clues and ideas that have been banging around in my head can have some outlet. :o) Most people around me are unready to think more deeply so it's been a long, solitary journey of exploration.

I had been lurking here for maybe 3 months, not saying anything because I know only the basics about astrology. I do know that Scorpio is my natal sign, Moon is in Cap., Gemini is my ascendant, and that Saturn is a *major* player in my chart. In fact, I am told my appearance is "saturnine." :o)

jm-blessings on you this early morning, Keeping you words and thoughts close in my heart as I start the day.
Really to everyone here blessings and love to you.

http://talkleft.com/new_archives/014875.html

Thursday :: May 18, 2006
Another Internet Report of Karl Rove Indictment

Did anyone notice Rove's resemblance to Porky Pig in the picture posted on this link? The look on his face is priceless -- perhaps he was just told by the man behind him that he is about to get BBQued by Fritz!
http://talkleft.com/new_archives/014875.html

JM, what a lovely post, and great quote from P. Casals.

jm -- Ms. Kali goes to Washington ;)

Anyone on this blog proficient in deep space - black hole astrology ? I have learned that the Black Hole named "Kali" is conjunct the Sun - MH - Juno degree in my natal chart @ 28+ Cancer.
http://www.daykeeperjournal.com/aarch03/0311nov/amm-deepspace.shtml

Duly noted that the Solar Eclipse in Aries 8*35' was squared to Roves Rx Uranus Vertex conjunction in 7* 34' Cancer -- and I think will be relevant and lend support to the predictions regarding his imminent indictment. This eclipse contact totally outweighs any support that t. Uranus trine to his and Bush's natal Sun/Moon synastry conjunction in 13* Cancer. Moreover -- the Aries eclipse occurs in Bush's 9th house -- do you hear the sound of executive heads rolling down the lanes of the bowling alleys of the US's 4th house?

Philomena. . .a pitiful astrologer, i can only offer this (from reading the Daykeeper article): the placement of Kali suggests that you expend a great deal of energy and/or resources attempting to develop a meaningful career (perhaps one that is unusual) and because of it you receive inspiration. . .not necessarily what you want, but want you need.

And to Patricia: I would guess that many women born during the forties and fifties were unwanted, or that parents were disappointed that they didn't produce a son. It's a common theme, or at least one i've discovered upon sharing my own story which is similar to yours. I firmly believe we taught our parents something they needed to learn about equality. I believe our children are teaching us something about balance.

It's wonderful to see so many new posters!!!!

You've got to love Molly Ivins

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/05/16/ivins.border/index.html

Molly Ivins: Bordering on lunacy

A MUST WATCH...911 Loose Change

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8260059923762628848

FYI - Californians on this blog -- you have a great guy here running for Congress (Bob McCloskey) -- he is calling for Bush & Co. impeachment -- on the first egregious act of lying to Congress and the American people to invade Iraq -- it all began with lying about Iraq's WMD -- and the war ambitions of this WH along with the commission of unspeakable war crimes against humanity may soon supercede the combined atrocities committed by Stalin - Hitler - Sharon - Pol Pot et al. The criminal heads on this DC monster must be decapitated -- Go McCloskey!!! California can lead the way -- just get rid of those two Zionist whores - Feinstein & Pelosi -- and the way will be clear for impeachment proceedings
http://www.usalone.com/mccloskey/pnum300.php

Interesting thing in the paper today which made me wonder....the House Ethics Panel is moving forward at last...because the dem from WVA (Mollohan) who headed it is NOW under investigation...and now Nancy Pelosi and a dem from Noth Hollywood Howard Berman are heading the panel and getting it moving: (my thought being, did the dems out him inorder to change leadership of the ethicis panel? its a thought)
-------http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/05/18/MNGGDITSTM1.DTL&hw=Nancy+Pelosi&sn=003&sc=656

After 16 months of inactivity and partisan infighting, the House ethics committee launched investigations Wednesday night into bribery allegations against Reps. Robert Ney, R-Ohio, and William Jefferson, D-La., and a separate inquiry into the widening scandal surrounding former Rep.
Randy "Duke" Cunningham, R-Del Mar (San Diego County).

--------

Hey...it might be true re the discussion Patricia brought up on boy/girl births and the 1940/50 generation of girls. I was supposed to be a boy ...my parents didn't even have a gir's name picked out....and my drama (having nearly killed my mom with breech birth and C section) was that neither one of my parents wanted children in the first place....

I actually think the C section stuff was more important...I did Extacy with a therapist more than once...and it all came down to my being 'stuck in a box and unable to get out on my own" and reexperiencing that emotional trauma...it was HUMILIATING!!!!! I needed help just to get born. OOOPS that kind of describes being breech for sure. And Saturn conj. the Sun. And Scorpio rising. And born in the middle of the Pacific in the middle of a world war in the middle of a blackout/food rationing time...to add insult to injury, nearly starved to death when my mom was unable to nurse....and they didn't know it until I lost too much weight.

Not exactly a WELCOME mat, you know???

i just re-read this quite amazing astro-analysis of Patrick Fitzgerald. The author makes fascinating connections between Fitzgerald's chart and his Catholic training, jesuit retreats and Opus Dei. Also included is a look at Fitz's public support of the Patriot Act (Makes one wonder if Fitz is "our" hero or??). If indeed tomorrow, 19 May, is used for indictment of Rove it is a date that has been chosen in the past by Catholic church to intitiate a plan of power/ destruction. It will give me pause to consider the implicatioons of that...
http://www.starpathvisions.com/Fitzgeralbirthchart.html

Help!! I am trying to identify the asteroids and the transneptunian planets in my chart and cannot for the life of me connect the *Tp 5 Leo 27* to an asteroid or transneptunian. My curiosity is killing me -- because prog. Mars in my chart is now in the 5th degree of Leo -- as is transiting Saturn. Please help my lame astro brain out -- somehow -- this intuitively feels important to me to solve this mysterious Tp placement in my chart.
Jul 21, 1949
01:07:00 PM EDT
Wilmington,DE
075W33'00" 39N45'00"

Mo 07̊Ge25' PF 03̊Vi03'
Su 28̊Ca34' Ch 03̊Sg00'R
Me 22̊Ca33' Ce 13̊Vi32'
Ve 24̊Le00' Pa 21̊Le39'
Ma 28̊Ge58' Jn 28̊Ca21'
Ju 27̊Cp05'R Vs 14̊Sg05'R
Sa 04̊Vi24' *Tp 05̊Le27'*
Ur 02̊Ca26' Cu 22̊Vi06'
Ne 12̊Li36' Ha 28̊Ar44'
Pl 15̊Le38' Ze 23̊Le32'
No 20̊Ar46'R Kr 23̊Ta27'
Mc 28̊Ca14' Ap 18̊Vi22'
As 24̊Li13' Ad 21̊Ar03'R
Vx 28̊Ta11' Vu 23̊Ge17'
Eq 02̊Sc32' Po 08̊Li51'

Porphyry Houses:
1st 24̊Li13' 7th 24̊Ar13'
2nd 25̊Sc33' 8th 25̊Ta33'
3rd 26̊Sg53' 9th 26̊Ge53'
4th 28̊Cp14' 10th 28̊Ca14'
5th 26̊Aq53' 11th 26̊Le53'
6th 25̊Pi33' 12th 25̊Vi33'

Judi: Perhaps the overwhelming desire for a male child in the 40's & 50's was due to the massive losses of male children in WW1 & 2.

I have Moon in Gemini in the 8th house and was a difficult birth for my mother -- who was in labor for 3 days before the doctor requested a C-Section. My mother's system turned toxic during the labor -- and the doctor's recommendation for a C-Section was to save the child (me)as he was certain my mother would die during surgery. In those days -- an emergency C-Section could only be authorized by either the mother before hand -- or the father. My mother was virtually incapacitated and the doctor told my father that he could either let my mother and I die -- or he would have to perform a C-Section to save me.

Everytime I see the Sun or Moon in the 8th house of a natal chart -- I inquire as to the nature of their childbirth -- and have learned that a high percentage claimed it was "traumatic" -- warranting an emergency C- Section to either unwrap the cord strangling the child -- or a breech birth -- etc. Or as in my case -- to get me out of a toxic womb -- asap.

Curiously - my natal Pluto in Leo eactly squares my Mother's Mars in Scorpio in her fifth house. Every year on my birthday -- she always recounts how I almost killed her -- I have since forgiven her for abandoning me for 7 years and love her very much -- as I came to understand her chart and that her own birth was far more traumatic than mine -- and she always carried an unconscious feeling of rejection by her mother all of her life. One cannot move on -- until one makes peace with one's mother -- no matter how difficult the bridge is to cross. The more we forgive our mothers -- the more we will receive wisdom and *inner illumination* of the meaning of the Great Mother's agonies and ecstasies.

Tseka, Wayne Madsen's posting for 5/17 late edition says 5/19 will be the date of the Rove indictment...and after reading your link, I'm inclined to agree with you.....

Garry: I setup the US's natal /prog chart for tomorrow @ noon -- where Moon in Aquarius is applying to a conjunction to Neptune in Aquarius that will be applying to a trine to the US's natal Mars in Gemini -- ruler of the US's 4th house Aries cusp -- and is the house of the people in oppostion to the current administration in power. Transiting Pluto in the US 1st house is square to US's prog. Neptune in the 26th degree Virgo in the US 9th house. Will the Rove indictment -- clarify the issue of ordered the outing of Plame -- or will it create more confusion in prosecuting this complex yet very narrow legal issue pursuant to the Federal Statute? Will we the people finally bag Rove and Cheney this time around -- or will we have to wait on this Neptunian Godot to enter the 21st degree of Aquarius where it will then begin a two year trine to our Mars in the 21st degree of Gemini? Will tomorrow shed some concrete Saturnian light with Saturn in Leo conjunct to the US's No. Node -- sextile to our natal and prog. Uranus in Gemini? Not very dramatic aspects for tomorrow -- but then again Fritzgerald is not a "drama queen" special prosecutor -- but a very sober, meticulous and measured legal actor whose role is about to dominate on the world stage...can you imagine the global domino effect of his announcement of a Rove indictment tomorrow? US's progressed Moon is now in Leo -- and coincidently a degree behind Cheney's progressed Moon in Leo -- and both will be squared to the US's progressed Saturn in Scorpio. There in lies the key --- Moon square Saturn by progression from the 8th to the 11th house -- looks like this is a tramatic rebirthing process for American democracy -- treasonous parents give birth to a child they never wanted -- rule of law and democracy. This is looking like there is a very long and painful process ahead for both the Bush*theads and we the people.

Patricia and for all of us who had miserable childhoods and parental issues, It's been my experience that our mothers were of a generation that truly hated being female because of the roles they were forced into. My mother was rejected by her mother who in her childhood was from a family that was so poor that they put her in an orphanage where she grew up. Rejection seems to be an underlying theme here.

Our mothers are the generation that Betty Friedan (The Feminine Mystic) came from. This was also the deluded "Golden Age" that the Conservative Republicans and Fundamental Christians yearn for down to their wiggling fat little toes. "Those were the days!", they'll tell you "when women knew their place". Phyllis Shlafly (yes, she is still around and still quite active and venerated in her tight assed circles) is also a product of that generation.

In a way they are the last generation that grew to hate being women without any real recourses to do anything about it. To compound the issue they experience a taste of self-worth during WWII when they successfully took over the jobs that men had while men went to war. Only they lost it ALL when the men returned. From getting a taste of Jupiterian expansion in their roles and the feeling of meaningful community and camaradery they were then basically 'thrown away' again because they were women, forced to take the secondary and limited supportive role of 'housewife'. The very term housewife sounds like the house is your master.

On an aside here, black men had a similar ego destroying experience of being in the army and fighting for their country heroically only to return to diminished status as third class citizens (just below white women but above black women and native Americans). It's not surprising that the civil rights movement for all races and genders burst on the scene within a generation.

My point is that they were the last generation that would suffer because of their gender and who would hate themselves at the behest of the white male dominated society. In many ways their hatred of themselves left its mark on their daughters (us). I distinctly remember experiencing my mother as a profoundly unhappy woman because she was an intellectual in a world made for men. She was always painfully, depressingly aware that had she been a man her family and her society and her country would have showered her with rewards. She fought every inch of the way, but never learned to accept her gender or love herself as a female. To this day we barely touch each other or even have woman to woman talks although we have always taken care of each other. Her generation didn't have the rebirth of the Goddess culture to embrace the way we have. They still had that Angry Old White Man, God, Who Hates Everything Not White and Male. I have been a feminist since the start of the last wave in the 60s as a direct result of making myself a solemn and binding promise that I would not accept the kind of life that she was forced to endure. Thinking back on it now I think that feeling of mine was when I tapped into the Universalness of humanity. It was when I sub-consciously stepped on the Path, because years later I would consciously step on the Path only to realize I had already been on it for a long time. Actually maybe that was when I stopped waiting for Godot.

Miller Attacks Libby in Latest Court Filing, Other Media Responses Now Filed
http://talkleft.com/new_archives/014786.html

Former New York Times reporter Judith Miller filed this response (pdf) yesterday in her attempt to quash the supboena for her notes issued by Team Libby.

"Mr. Libby further maintains he will use such information "to contend that, contrary to the allegations in the indictment, it was Ms. Miller who raised this topic in her discussions with Mr. Libby -if the topic was raised at all."

....He also makes the startlingly baseless claim that it may have been Ms. Miller who mentioned Ms. Plame to him."

LOL! Sensenbrenner whines and sulks in self-pity about Bush and Rove (about his Immigration Bill vs. Bush's speech).

[snip]

"I was very disappointed in the president's speech," Sensenbrenner said. "I think he doesn't get it."

Asked if Bush mollified conservatives in the speech by calling for sending National Guard troops to states along the Mexican border, Sensenbrenner said, "He failed in that completely."

And despite Bush's insistence that he was not calling for amnesty, Sensenbrenner said, "Well it is an amnesty, because it allows people who have broken the law to stay in the country."

"The president has repeatedly and forcefully rejected amnesty," Conant said. "Under his plan, you're going to have to pay stiff fines, follow the law, stay employed, learn English and — after achieving all those things — go to the back of the line."

Sensenbrenner did not attend a closed-door meeting between Bush political adviser Karl Rove and House Republicans, but said that some members complained to him that Rove didn't stay around for many questions or hear what lawmakers had to say.

"The overwhelming majority of those that I talked to who were at the conference believe that he dissed the House Republicans," Sensenbrenner said.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060517/ap_on_go_co/sensenbrenner_immigration;_ylt=AofhIraE4kFFfvn03hadm9yyFz4D;_ylu=X3oDMTA5aHJvMDdwBHNlYwN5bmNhdA--

GoldenSilence, what you wrote at 7:11 is 100% right on for me too. I was born in 55 and was a 3rd girl who wasn't wanted either. My younger sister and I started examining the family dynamics and extremely sexist attitudes after our first Saturn return and we have shared insights ever since. She's a Sag with an Aries Mars and rebelled against expectations. Being a Taurus/Aqua, I have found understanding from reading about their emotionally crippled generation.

Joe, you don't go far enough. I think the genital mutalation of boys (circumcision) is the cruelest thing to do to a baby. And it wasn't until recently that they would even give pain killer to the infant before they cut his foreskin! Can you see how the psyche of an infant would interpert such a brutal act? Is it a wonder that so many males in this country grow up angry and sexually/sensually messed up? [Especially in comparison to European (intact) men!]

Sally, what if Beckett was into "wordplay" with the word Godot and it was his way of saying we are all waiting to go "to God".

Marines Killed Civilians "In Cold Blood"

Michael Scherer and Mark Benjamin
Spiegel
May 18 2006

Senior House Democrat Jack Murtha warns that the details of a reported massacre in Iraq last year will prove "a very bad thing" for the US.

A senior House Democrat with close ties to the military claimed Wednesday that U.S. Marines wantonly killed innocent Iraqi civilians, including women and children, in an early morning raid last November, buttressing a March report by Time.

"Our troops overreacted because of the pressure on them, and they killed innocent civilians in cold blood," said Jack Murtha of Pennsylvania, a decorated Marine Corps veteran who served in Vietnam and is among the most influential Democratic voices on military matters. "This is going to be a very, very bad thing for the United States."

Asked about his sources during a midday briefing on Iraq policy in the Capitol, Murtha confidently replied, "All the information I get, it comes from the commanders, it comes from people who know what they are talk ing about." Although Murtha said that he had not read any investigative reports by the military on the incident, he stressed, "It's much worse than reported in Time magazine."

For those interested...

from RAW STORY-SENATOR CLINTON TO CO-SPONSOR DORGON/SNOWE NET NEUTRALITY LAW.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

STATEMENT OF SENATOR HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON ON NET NEUTRALITY

Washington, DC – “I support net neutrality. The open architecture of the Internet has been the critical element that has made it the most revolutionary communications medium since the advent of the television.

Each day on the Internet views are discussed and debated in an open forum without fear of censorship or reprisal. The Internet as we know it does not discriminate among its users. It does not decide who can enter its marketplace and it does not pick which views can be heard and which ones silenced. It is the embodiment of the fundamental democratic principles upon which our nation has thrived for hundreds of years.

I have always, and will continue to strongly and unequivocally support these principles. As I have worked throughout my Senate career to make broadband access readily available throughout New York State and our nation, I believe that maintaining an open Internet coupled with more broadband access is necessary if we are to meet the promise and the potential of the Internet to disseminate ideas and information, enhance learning, education and business opportunities for all Americans and improve and uplift our citizenry.

We must embrace an open and non-discriminatory framework for the Internet of the 21st century. Therefore, it is my intention to be an original cosponsor of the Dorgan and Snowe net neutrality legislation to ensure that open, unimpaired and unencumbered Internet access for both its users and content providers is preserved as Congress debates the overhaul of our nation’s telecommunications laws. Any effort to fundamentally alter the inherently democratic structure of the Internet must be rejected."

...or the modified female that is themselves. When the "dark powers that be" deliberately made a Cult of the Hypermasculine that had no room whatsoever for the female, actual women would be great "hooks" for his own. Hatred of the one made for misery of the "Other" (including Gaia/flora/fauna) as well as themselves. It's all terribly destructive nonsense & has to go if any Life is to survive. A pox on of it!

Philomena, yes...and I have Sun/Sat and Uranus in the 8th house. I really didn't understand my parents either...except psychics kept saying they weren't compatible. I took such a long time and the astrology and some things revealed later to realize that we all do the best we can with our own baggage. One psychic even told me my mother was angry with me (and my mother has an Aries moon conj. Sat) because I had come here to save him and I hadn't...he died on 9/11/1960 when I was just 17....that really blew me away, but in a way it made sense.

Since that point (first week of my senior year of highschool, I look back and say...but he or she didn't have the advantage of this knowledge (take your pick...medical, spiritual, etc.) which I have. When my dad died they didn't have radiation, or chemo! The whole hippie spiritual newage stuff...still a decade a way then....but my mother still survives, but the saturn/moon conjunction rules her, and as Dylan said, destiny probably fooled her. You shouldn't marry on the rebound, I'd say, as they DID....and probably WERE incompatible. But didn't 'move on' which people do now.

And TP is probably TransPluto...a very important little asteroid.

Golden Silence, my mother is/was brilliant also...a Canadian, she went thru college in 3 years...good at everything she did, but hey...my dad wouldn't let her work! Nope...women in the home, and all that...luckily for her he did die young enought that she worked witnin months of his death until she retired ...15 years. And loved it...This is why, I think, so many of my genertion broke all the molds and why I refused to marry to have a baby...screw the uptight people of both sexes who pointed fingers, and screw the relatives who stopped speaking or inviting my mom and her sister to family functions because of me. My mom and aunt then had to choose me and my child over their dessicated (spiritually) relatives...well, 2 of them continued to phone my mom....but she was nevr invited back to the family gatherings. THAT is what I rebelled against...the hypocrisy of that social society norm that was in actuallity, anti life.

HALLELUJAH JILL!!!!!!

I feel a personal pain and guilt for every infant boy in this world who is circumcised. I don't know who started it, or even if its good or not, it's just a helluva way to start life. I'll not only tip my hat, I will take it off for any man who can love this organ, the giver of life.

Philomena! Not another Cancer? My Sun is at 25. Your analysis of the indictment was wonderful. This last Full Moon on that P.Saturn square the Moon really tells a story. I distinctly felt the death of this administration and now the dissolving and carrying away of the remains is ahead.

Joe. One of my most loved people in the world is my sister who has a Scorp Sun and Cap Moon, Sag rising. She gets it. Although she calls me up and begins most conversations with, "we're doomed". But we always end up laughing. I was wondering what was behind your depth and now I know. The Gemini Asc. is fantastic (you'll be right at home here) as it mixes your profound search for answers with Gemini's flexible mind, and ability to see so many facets.
Quite a journey.

Robertson: God Says Tsunami Possible For U.S.

POSTED: 9:19 pm EDT May 17, 2006
UPDATED: 5:14 am EDT May 18, 2006

VIRGINIA BEACH, Va. -- The Rev. Pat Robertson says God has told him that storms and possibly a tsunami will hit America's coastline this year.

The founder of the Christian Broadcasting Network has told viewers of "The 700 Club" that the revelations came to him during his annual personal prayer retreat in January.

"If I heard the Lord right about 2006, the coasts of America will be lashed by storms," Robertson said May 8.

He added specifics in Wednesday's show.

"There well may be something as bad as a tsunami in the Pacific Northwest," he said.

Robertson has come under intense criticism in recent months for suggesting that U.S. agents should assassinate Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez and that Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's stroke was divine retribution for Israel's pullout from the Gaza Strip.

Copyright 2006 by The Associated Press. All rights reserved.

You bet these people will support neutrality. The fund raising potential is phenomenal. Now the battle of the purse strings begins.
This is interesting as it was her husband who helped monopolize communications. Hopefully she will help destroy his legacy with her Scorpio self. She follows the money.

That was in refence to Jaycee's Interenet post.

That was in refence to Jaycee's Internet post.

That was in reference to Jaycee's Internet post.

Please forgive me.

jm...my Jupiter is 25 Cancer...

but semi squar my Sun/Saturn...! 'almost but not quite' is what I call it...

Tseka, I finally decided to print out the pages on Patrick Fitz.....36 pages for both articles, with 10 pt type! Would have been reading forever if I hadn't...and it is really an entertaining read, with vast quantities of info offered....

Just to be fair, it was Clinton and Gore who facilitated the internet and the widespread use of it through initiatives and programs designed to enable every single college age student to acquire a personal computer. The use of computers and the intenet exploded in the 90s both in business and for private consumption as a direct result of the Clinton administration. That's what Gore meant when he said created initiatives for the internet. He started doing it in the 80s as scientists came to him about a new way they communicated with each other in the pursuit of their research. Gore envisioned the widespread use of the internet then and started writing legislation and creating initiatives so the US would lead the world in the new computer age.

I would like to say one thing about this beloved invention we are so enjoying. Bloghastan is free now because it is not greatly funded by advertising. We get our information not on glossy pages filled with commodities or made up mannequins lying straight-faces with products constantly being hurled at us. I think the biggest threat is not the government but from within. The threat of falling prey to big money as it moves in to advertise and control content might be the challenge ahead. This will be the people's choice. We'll see if the usual greed takes over or not.
The Plutonian power of the masses is involved. T.Pluto opposite USA Mars in Gemini brought it to this level. They are up against a lot. A powerful desire.

Judi! My Cancer Sun thanks you heartily! All that Jupiterian wisdom and protection smack dab in the middle of my solar system. Lucky gal, I am.

Philomena, I think you mean Pete McCloskey, not Bob. Pete was a moderate Republican (remember those?) who served in congress for San Mateo County back in the late 60s/early 70s. My mom ran the SM County Republican HQ during those years, so I met him a number of times at party functions, voter registration booths, etc. He was one of those who supported the Nixon impeachment, who worked to get us out of Vietnam, and was generally what would be viewed today as a progressive Democrat.

At any rate, if anyone wants to support Pete in any way (he's running for the seat currently held by "never-met-a-corporation-I-didn't-bend-over-for" Pombo; that would be the idiot who's all for drilling in Alaska and Cataline, opening up the national parks for clear-cutting, and other mainstays of the greedheads), please do so - while he IS still a Republican, he is an honest man and can look you (and himself) in the eye.

However, there is also a Democrat who's declared for the seat - Danville ex-Navy dude and pilot Steve Filson. I have no personal experience of the man, but I know that CA-11 is the most conservative of SF Bay Area counties, and voters there might be more likely to stick with their party affiliation vs. going "radical" - which in the teensy little minds of the conservative zombies would mean anyone outside the party. Almost anyone other than Pombo would be good news for California.

Thank you folks for the feedback. I have to say I'm somewhat embarassed as I don't usually let my childhood travails bother me. I guess it was something my mother said that set me off that day. Don't usually have a self-pity party. As far as postpartum depression, my mother was 27 years old when I was born. My brother was 26 months older than me. The fact of the matter is she did not want any girls. Simple truth. Thought I had worked through that. Guess I haven't. By the way, I have suffered from depression a great deal of my life so I know how you "are" with it. So low, so down. Capricorn rising may have something to do with this. I had postpartum depression for about a month when my daughter was born so I know what that's like. Not the screaming and hollering that my mother did about bringing me home. And, if you think it got better when she finally took me home...NOPE. I kinda raised myself. It made me strong. So no more pity party for Trish, get over it and go on.

I do love astrology and my forte' if you will, is gardening by the signs. It's kind of funny as I threw a "Trish fit" this evening as my mother asked my brother to plant some beans (Heirloom and rare to boot!!) Not only did he plant them in one of the worst signs.. Saggitarius (sp) for god's sake, he planted them next to the onions. SCREAM... "They'll come up allright" said the old mule woman.

Good night and thanks for the feedback.

Patricia....your original post mentioned the Capricorn rising sign, which I took note of, because my almost 5 yr old granddaughter not only has Cap rising w/south node conjunct the rising and opposing her Cancer Moon, but Sun conj Saturn just as I have ...

And for some reason I ALWAYS remembered what Linda Goodman said back in the 1970's about Capricorns...

They are so capable that they could be left under a toadstool and raise themselves.

There you go!

WV I saw that Robertson thing earlier today...gee, doesn't he live at Virginia Beach? gosh...tsunamis on the east coast....that's never happened, has it?

Baraka, I remember Pete McCloskey since I live in San Mateo County....yes, one of the good moderate repubs...I hope the dem makes it there, but McCloskey is a good choice....and Pombo is a dirtbag.

Thanks wv for the loose change url:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8260059923762628848

We all need to see this video

Charles

Just to show how heartless these rightwing rethugs are:
May 18, 2006

Have A Heart

This has to be just about the nastiest piece of direct mail we've ever seen.

A candidate for State Assembly in the central valley region of CA, Bill Conrad (R) is apparently running on the platform that his opponent won't survive his term because he had a heart transplant.

Attack line: 'Tom Berryhill doesn't have the HEART for State Assembly'

this is this guys ad:
http://www.rawstory.com/showoutarticle.php?src=http%3A%2F%2Fhotlineblog.nationaljournal.com%2Farchives%2F2006%2F05%2Fhave_a_heart.html

and here
http://www.rawstory.com/showoutarticle.php?src=http%3A%2F%2Fhotlineblog.nationaljournal.com%2Farchives%2F2006%2F05%2Fhave_a_heart.html

ought to be interesting to see how the voters there take this....

That's tragic judi. How I detest personal attacks. This is what it leads to. The best thing we can do is learn to stop the game by not responding in like ways. I don't think the voters will like this at all. Pluto in Sag and the ruthlessness of advertising.

Funny, one of the things predicted for this period of time was the amount of 'connect the dots" which would happen. This story ran in the paper today here....generally about how USA has been funding the Sudanese rebels secretly....and this one too:

According to South African sources, recently fired National Intelligence Agency chief Billy Masetlha has charged that South African intelligence, military, and law enforcement agencies are working closely with the CIA, MI6, and the private U.S. security firm Kroll. Informed South African observers claim that elements of the ruling African National Congress and the neo-con Democratic Alliance opposition are in lock step with neo-con operatives in the United States, Israel, and Britain. http://www.waynemadsenreport.com/

Tseka...http://www.starpathvisions.com/FitzDeep4.7html.html

the second part of the Fitz analysis...it is hot!

Philomena, re your 6:59 reply to my email, I can only say God bless you,I hope you're right and from your lips to God's ears, etc. I LOVE your posts. Many thanks to all the other new posters and first-timers as well,I love those posts too. Keep 'em coming folks!!!

Ja, indeed Judi. I thought so. re your post 12:17

wv and Charles,

I don't want you to think no one is paying attention. I've seen the latest version of the loose change video. Very compelling isn't it? The people who have looked into the 9/11 issue have had 5 years to dig for facts and documentation and present a highly convincing little documentary. Just looking at it has to raise questions for the viewer.

Well, I remembered today that the Dr. diagnosed me as a venerial disease, instead of a pregnancy, and treated my Mother accordingly! No clue as to the lasting effects of that.
Fortunately my parents were very Aquarian in their outlook, so I was encouraged toward feminism. So after muffling myself for 16years trying to be Earth Mother, we divorced & I had a nice run as a business woman, sales appeal; my complete independance, painting murals as performance art for bored housewives. That dynamic changed, with Poppy;s, recession/depression, and the women hit the workforce.

Also have a friend with a large head. In his 70's with his Mother in her 90's, it was still mentioned in polite company on occassion! I guess it never goes away!
PQ

the state of mind so presciently expressed by one of America's finest Gnostic authors, the late Philip K. Dick, who
explained the situation this way back in 1974:

"The Constitutional guarantees of our country have been suspended for some time now, and an assault has begun on the checks and balances structure of the government.
The Republic is in peril; the Republic has been in peril for several years and is now cut away almost to a shadow of itself, barely functioning. I think they are carving it up
in their minds, deciding who sits where forever and ever, now. In the face of this no one notices that virtually everything we believed in is dead. This is because the people
who would have pointed this out are dead: mysteriously killed. It's best not to talk about this. I've tried to list the safe things to talk about, but so far I can't find any. I'm
trying to learn what the Lie is or what the Lies are, but I can't even discern that any more. Perhaps I sense the Lie gone from the world because evil is so strong now
that it can step forth as it is without deception. The masks are off."
P.K. Dick; Selections From The Exegesis, quoted from
In Pursuit Of Valis, pg.263; Lawrence Sutin, ed.
Underwood-Miller 1991.

Hahaa PQ, you crack me up, i worked in Gyn at a free womens clinic and saw some rare and unusual but nothing like the Queen of Pentacles!

You are just the kind of infection we need on this planet!

Judi G powerful truth, an awesome voice P.K Dick, thanks for sharing.

A little more insight into our murderous Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld~Every last one of Bush’s nasty group of evil ghouls should be rounded up and sent to a deserted island where they could be left to feed upon themselves

DONALD RUMSFELD MEETS THE GHOST OF FREDERICK DOUGLASS
By Gregory Wallance

The New-York Historical Society's current exhibition, "Slavery in New York," has such shocking scenes of slavery that the society warns on its Web site that the exhibits might be "painful." Nonetheless, the society adds, the message is "ultimately uplifting, even inspiring" because slavery has important "spiritual, moral and political lessons." Those lessons should be taught not only by institutions like the Historical Society, but by our nation's leaders. And yet, one prominent leader, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, is sending out quite a different message by maintaining a weekend home on Chesapeake Bay that was originally built and lived in by a singularly notorious slave owner, Edward Covey. The defense secretary's house, a former bed and breakfast, is known locally as “Mount Misery”

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ideas_opinions/story/381121p-323624c.html

Snip~
Had Mount Misery been turned into a museum, it would fulfill the New-York Historical Society's goal to use slavery to teach "spiritual, moral and political lessons," through the triumph of Douglass' spirit.
Instead, we are left with the image of the defense secretary sitting in a lounge chair, surrounded by the ghosts of brutally tormented slaves and their vicious master, savoring a drink and enjoying a sunset over the bay.

To anon at 2:54, im thinking property seizure.. under the new imminent domain which the justices recently decided could serve....

Dear Hearts, I love you so. Coming home rereading some of what I read this morning and then the new ones and I am glowing, swirling, full of golden light and love and hope. I assent to every moment in this life, all of it. Oh, that I can carry you and your words and thoughts with me to light and guide, to remind me of the truth of us even when I am hip deep in Mordor and thinking/feeling very dark things

What a lot of great comments lately! I'm too tired to say much tonight except one thing:

Jill G, you're absolutely right, I didn't go far enough. You nailed it-- "Can you see how the psyche of an infant would interpert such a brutal act? (i.e., circumcision)"

But that doesn't account for European male warmongers and dictators. The circumcision issue *is* a major player in the West, but IMO and IME, it still has more to do with cutting males off from their natural, normal, healthy desires for connection and love.

Perhaps that "snip" at birth is the first among many cuts that are made to control the hapless male child until he becomes defensive, aggressive and hostile. And then he gets thrown into prison or medicated.

Death (of the psyche) by a thousand cuts, that's what it is.

Judi -- Your exalted Jupiter in Cancer conjuncts your Vertex 25* Cancer -- this is probably the *open channel* .........have you ever thought about inking political cartoons?

Patricia: " As far as postpartum depression, my mother was 27 years old when I was born. My brother was 26 months older than me. The fact of the matter is she did not want any girls. Simple truth. Thought I had worked through that. Guess I haven't. By the way, I have suffered from depression a great deal of my life so I know how you "are" with it. So low, so down. Capricorn rising may have something to do with this. I had postpartum depression for about a month when my daughter was born so I know what that's like. Not the screaming and hollering that my mother did about bringing me home. And, if you think it got better when she finally took me home...NOPE. I kinda raised myself. It made me strong. So no more pity party for Trish, get over it and go on."

We are all VUNERABLE --- MAN - WOMAN - CHILD.

Should you have a moment to reflect -- (especailly after the bean - onion fiasco) -- give yourself a moment to a be child of the universe -- no past -- no future -- JUST HERE IN THE NOW.
Each and everyone of us is a thread in the taspestry of life --- the taspestry will hang for a while -- and then as is the fate of all organic material -- it will disintergrate.

Hold on to your soul -- that is connected to our sweet earth -- so that when it is your time to remember the best of life -- it will be the sweet scent of early spring wild onions.

vulnerable -- please forgive the mis spell.

JudiG, it has been postulated more than once that Beckett was giving us a play on words and "Godot" was God, he actually denied that in the 60's. Also in the play there was a boy who showed up to tell the two men waiting that Godot was not coming and that boy did not speak highly of Godot, in fact let them know that Godot was a very unpleasant person. I don't think "Godot" was God, but the beauty of the play is you can make him anyone, the key to the play is the "waiting" for something. Maybe a Savior, don't we always wait for a Savior? Not necessarily Jesus Christ, but someone or something to finally come and lift us out of our bad marriage, boring, low waged job, our kids to grow up, grandkids to come, as I said the list goes on. Becket himself stated it might have come from the french word godillot, meaning "the boot" so is that what they were waiting for "the boot our of life" maybe.

Another way to look at the end of the play is whatever reason they were waiting for
Godot, he wasn't coming and they would have to find a way to fulfill that need within themselves, and that is where existentialism begins.

Just one word
"SATIRE"

In a way, looking outside of your life for salvation is a death in itself. So the symbolism makes sense. It's ironic that the search for the eternal guarantees a death of the present.

I like many ideas out of existentialism..the idea that we are trapped and when we realize it and accept it and see life just for the value of existence, we can start to build what we want. I think the only escape from the trap is to stay in it willingly and consciously. This is such a good thought for now. This waiting for a savior. Obviously this entity is eluding us. What a great article Sally and led to such a luscious fruity thread.

A lot of existential books might not be to people's liking but one movie descibes the philosophy with beauty, poetry, and simplicity. It's called Woman in the Dunes and it is wonderful. It is an odd film, also not to everybody's liking, but I highly recommend it. It's an artistic masterpiece.

And Sally

In a few paragraphs you exposed the whole folly of waiting for one small man to get indicted and bring a miracle to the country.
Thank you so very very much. There is always something to be gained. The conversation here bordered on the miraculous.

http://www.buzzflash.com/index.php?story=Quote

Sometimes, You've Received So Much Accolade For Being A Good Guy, You Don't Realize It When You've Become A Bad One. Let's Hope It's Only A Momentary Lapse.

Since we began posting editorials about how many of the large progressive blogs are running a fraudulent Telecom ad aimed at undermining the pro-democracy Internet, none of those blogs running the ad -- to our knowledge -- have taken it down. (See http://www.buzzflash.com/editorial/06/05/edi06036.html, which has embedded links to all the editorials.) They appear to have decided -- alone or together -- to take a stand to defend the right of Telecom companies to undermine the freedom of the Internet through deception.

One of the leading blogs, Eschaton (AKA, Atrios, edited by Duncan Black), wrote a note earlier in the week on why it wouldn't take the ad down at that time. In his justification for running the deceptive Telecom ad, Atrios claims: "My ad policy is, roughly, accept any ad that is work safe (both the ad and whatever page it links to) and isn't at a glance advertising something obviously fraudulent (the blogads version of a Nigerian email scam)."

Yet, as we have pointed out again and again, the real "Save the Internet" site features the very ad in question as their "Big Lie of the Week." Now we may not be from Philadelphia, like Atrios is, but in Chicago "fraudulent" and "Big Lie of the Week" are synonymous. So, excuse us if we are a bit confused, particularly considering the stakes of bringing down the Internet as we know it.

More....

JudiG,
( isn't the world a better place for our survival of the birth & pre-birth difficulties?)
Re: reading PK Dick. makes me more than ever sure that the horrendous event ( Godot) we are waiting for.......will be the exposure of the truth about 9/11. That will hit people a lot harder than another terror attack.

Having wrestled with Demons from the past, &unconscious; opposed to the most beautiful, magical spring in recent memory, and the joy of working on this painting commission..........all week, ( and managing to balance it pretty well by the way.) I can project that examining their interior will be veeeeerrrrrry difficult for most!
BTW; I have a deadline reprieve...my client is stuck in flooded N H till the weekend! So extra time to make up worktime lost while wrestling with disruptive forces.
Thanks for the laughter Tseka! The dysfunctions of my family were salved by wit and humor, My friends on the ground here are wonerfull people, kind and caring but,
not particulalry witty, it's nice to be appreciated on that level.
Last but not least.........Rumsfeld should stay right there with the ghosts of Mt Misery. That's a more fitting punishment than eminent domain!

And......I had serious empathy problems, with my son's circumcision, but was too young, unformed and burdened with developing problems to go against tradition and oppose the procedure.
My Father was not circumcised and he was a non-violent, gentle gentlemanly person, who preferred music and theater to contact sports.

PQ

Another take on Godot and the perils of expecting someone from outside ourselves to lead us is if we stand around waiting for someone to direct our lives we end up with willing 'leaders' like Bush ever ready to step in and take over.

My view is the leaders we choose are the ones who represent our own shadow side in the sense that we project our secret side on them. Unwilling to rise above or even face our own passive/aggressive tendencies we choose the person who embodies our aggression while we act out our passiveness. Our leaders become the 'Hero' we wish we were. That says a lot about what hidden desires lurk in the hearts of the people who voted for Bush. And that's one reason he still has a base. While we on the progressive and liberal sites recoil in horror at what Bush shows us about the dark side of human nature there are those who admire and even secretly envy it. They can condone murder and killing and the power to make war because that's what they wish they could do.

To understand this is essential because that's what leads us to higher consciousness, to the way of life where we become accountable. To become accountable for everything we do and think and feel is to stop expecting to be led from outside ourselves. It also enables us to pick the leaders that embody the parts of ourselves we wish to manifest into the world, like those who incarnate progressive ideals that join humanity rather than tear it apart and who preserve the planet rather than destroy it.

Comment
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Israel should face sanctions
The Palestine crisis is now more dramatic even than apartheid, but it is the victims who are punished

Ronnie Kasrils and Victoria Brittain
Friday May 19, 2006

Guardian

Western leaders are frustrating democratic elections in Palestine by withholding aid, and using collective punishment, an economic siege and starvation as political weapons in their efforts to get the Hamas government to accept their terms of business with Israel.
Never in the long struggle for freedom in apartheid South Africa was there a situation as dramatic as in Palestine today: even though children were killed for resisting a second-class education; the liberation movement's leaders were locked up for decades on Robben Island; new leaders were assassinated; church leaders were poisoned; house demolitions and forced removals were frequent; and western governments told South Africans who their leaders should be, and what their policies should be.

The African National Congress confronted the military, economic and social power of white rule with a small guerrilla army, the mass support of the people and a moral authority that won it a following among millions around the world. Many now forget that the abhorrent apartheid system was treated as normal in the powerhouses of the world: entrenched interests meant the western media produced a sanitised version of its suffering and injustice.

Today western moral authority in the Middle East is gone, as much because of years of double standards in Palestine as because of the current disastrous war on Iraq. There is no excuse for not knowing the truth about what is now happening to the Palestinians. And the most recent diplomatic moves by the Quartet - the US, the EU, the UN and Russia - to alleviate suffering, while keeping up the ban on dealing with the Palestinians' elected leaders, are totally inadequate.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/print/0,,329484397-103677,00.html

Goldensilence, IMO, you have hit on a concept absolutely essential to creating a better life for ourselves!! Can't help but feel we who come to this space & others like it are in the process of creating a new collective that's life affirming. Fits with my thinking about how important we crones are to what's coming. We will not be blue-haired ladies going to play cards at the local senior center by a long shot!!

IT'S GAINING MOMENTUM- FULL PUBLIC FUNDING OF FEDERAL ELECTIONS FOR JUST $6 PER PERSON.
CHECK OUT THEIR WEBSITE.

http://www.just6dollars.org/

"Congress would only have to spend $6 per citizen per year to publicly fund each and every election for the House, the Senate and the White House. When you consider that "pork barrel" projects cost every one of us more than $200 last year alone, it’s no contest.

Think of it. With public funding, wealthy special interests and their hired lobbyists would no longer have a commanding influence over our politics and government. Instead of begging for campaign donations, candidates would spend their time communicating with voters. Once elected, our leaders would be free to focus on our nation's challenges rather than having to worry about financing their next campaign. And there's no doubt that more of our most able leaders would run for federal office when the ability to finance a campaign isn't such a daunting obstacle..."

MORE . . .

AND THEIR NY TIMES AD

http://www.just6dollars.org/nytad

The Tortured-Birth Of American Empire
Flashpoints
Jim Kirwan
5-19-6
The Pentagon's security videotapes impel us to take another look at what took place. Lately there have many questions and theories as to 'how' what the public saw could have happened. This has led to widely varied speculation about the planes and the towers to the crash in Pennsylvania and of course to what hit the Pentagon. The fact of how many people died or disappeared is still cloudy but the towers went down and there is a 10 by 20 foot hole in Pennsylvania; and there was a sixteen foot hole in the Pentagon. The evidence has been widely discussed, but its collection was a government job and so is suspect. What should also be discussed is the entire responsibility chain that enabled what happened on 911: because what comes through this rear-view mirror of wounded-history ­ is catastrophically clear in far too many ways!

The public has been chewing on inconsistencies in the official stories of 911 since the day it happened. 911 was the "Big Bang Theory" behind hundreds of thousands of threads of inquiry about everything from conspiracies to psychiatric studies on what makes America tick: yet what all that these stories really did, was to provide cover for those major crimes that sponsored the relevant but tangential discussions. Buried under the wider circle of investigative and social discourse, were those topics of pivotal importance that will burn throughout history in this American Crime against itself. The amazing thing is that the answers that we're all looking for have been out there all along...

Government in all its forms has been hard at work since 911 trying to prevent any real evaluations from ever becoming part of the public's dialogue. Largely then one would have to say that by misdirection, obfuscation, and literally hundreds of tons of lies and distortions ­ they have so far ­ succeeded! But consider the following before.....to read full article go to :
http://www.kirwanesque.com/politics/articles/2004/art28.htm
kirwanstudios@sbcglobal.net

NBC Audio: David Gregory Asks Bush If He Should Quit
From Thomas Buyea News Service
5-19-6

Click Here For Audio (wav) File
http://www.rense.com/1.imagesH/recording.wav

Here is the actual NBC audio of David Gregory asking Bush if he should step down...

" Do You think it is possible like Nixon and Watergate, that the American People have rendered a final judgement of disapproval on You and Your War in Iraq ?? "

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Karen -- Thank you for posting your thoughts on BLack Hole Kali conjunct my Sun/MH/Juno. In retrospect -- I can see how Kali on my MH is responsible for the major shift from practicing Western traditional astrology to my special brand of Shamanic Astrology -- wherein I integrate herbalism - sacred art and totems /guardians -- and shamanic journeying while deliberating a way to get around an obstacle or impasse in ones' life path. I also do soul retrieval vis a vis the natal chart in an attempt to help another reintegrate a traumatic or life altering experience -- This intepretive shift to an alternative state of consciousness was the result of two NDEs I experienced btw 1984 and 1993.

Karen -- Thank you for posting your thoughts on BLack Hole Kali conjunct my Sun/MH/Juno. In retrospect -- I can see how Kali on my MH is responsible for the major shift from practicing Western traditional astrology to my special brand of Shamanic Astrology -- wherein I integrate herbalism - sacred art and totems /guardians -- and shamanic journeying while deliberating a way to get around an obstacle or impasse in ones' life path. I also do soul retrieval vis a vis the natal chart in an attempt to help another reintegrate a traumatic or life altering experience -- This intepretive shift to an alternative state of consciousness was the result of two NDEs I experienced btw 1984 and 1993.

GoldenSilence: I agree w/ Neith's comment in re: your extrodinair insight into avoiding the *trap* of Godot. Your insight here is absolutely brilliant -- the clarity you blend with the material we post is of exceptional quality - would you mind telling me where your Mercury / Uranus /Jupiter reside in your chart? What's your celestial secret? ;)
"Another take on Godot and the perils of expecting someone from outside ourselves to lead us is if we stand around waiting for someone to direct our lives we end up with willing 'leaders' like Bush ever ready to step in and take over. "

Philomena,

My Mercury is in my fourth house in Virgo. Mercury is the ruler of my chart because I have Gemini rising with Uranus in Gemini in the first House. Jupiter is opposite my AS on the 7th House cusp in Sagittarius.

My Mercury is also trine my North Node which is in the 11th House.

If you want to know more you are welcome to look at my chart.

Born 8/20/1948
San Francisco, CA
1:13 am

GoldenSilence: I look forward to adding your chart to my celestial friends database -- you are most definitely very wise between the ears. ;)

Judi & Celestial Friends -- I am exploring/examining the transneptunians and now transpluto point in my chart. I stumbled upon this excellent link for *Tp* - http://www.astralis.it/tp.htm

It is very exciting when an old dog astrologer like myself learns new celestial tricks -- and I am now enjoying my journey into deep space astrology.

Philomena, please keep us apprised of your deep space astrology insights and observations. I am fascinated by it too, on metaphysical levels as well.

GS -- Is this the accurate Asc for your natal chart - 19 Gemini 26? I never know w/ this program -- as it has calculated the wrong Moon degree for my chart -- when I set up it up a second time -- the first time I set my chart up in the program it correctly calculated the Moon -- but the 2nd and 3rd time it was off by a degree. I do not know what is causing this computer glitch -- so every time I do a chart -- I need verification from another program to check and see if it calculated the planetary positions accurately.
Golden Silence
Aug 20, 1948
01:13:00 AM PDT
San Francisco,CA
122W25'00" 37N34'50*

Mo 03°Pi41' PF 12°Sg57'
Su 27°Le12' Ch 19°Sc19'
Me 05°Vi39' Ce 19°Ca56'
Ve 12°Ca11' Pa 01°Ge31'
Ma 20°Li47' Jn 13°Ar49'
Ju 19°Sg08' Vs 12°Vi03'
Sa 26°Le17' Tp 05°Le23'
Ur 29°Ge39' Cu 21°Vi23'
Ne 11°Li08' Ha 27°Ar39'R
Pl 14°Le58' Ze 23°Le16'
No 07°Ta29'R Kr 22°Ta53'
Mc 27°Aq12' Ap 18°Vi08'
As 19°Ge26' Ad 20°Ar21'R
Vx 11°Sc11' Vu 23°Ge02'
Eq 01°Ge31' Po 08°Li36'

Regiomontanus Houses:
1st 19°Ge26' 7th 19°Sg26'
2nd 14°Ca21' 8th 14°Cp21'
3rd 04°Le43' 9th 04°Aq43'
4th 27°Le12' 10th 27°Aq12'
5th 29°Vi13' 11th 29°Pi13'
6th 12°Sc36' 12th 12°Ta36'

Philomena,

I have my AS at 19 Gemini 34 and I use Io astrology because I have a Mac.

Joe and Jm
There's no telling how far back such a horrible practice goes. Probably brought to the world by the Northern warrior invaders of Europe. [The Macho initiation would be a bloody one, yes. The "magic" of what women could do; where you bleed but don't die??] The point is that there isn't a medical need for it so why does the medical community push the procedure? It sure isn't helping undo thousands of years of male-dominator indoctrination. Keep the males angry and they can be more easily manipulated. Hmmm, that and making money, guess I answered my question.

To the best of my recall - circumcision originated during the time of Abraham -- as a convenant w/ GOD... but more likely it was practiced for hygenic reasons -- since desert dwellers did not have daily access to water to bath or keep the genitalia of their males clean. I have personally opposed the barbaric ritual of male circumcision -- and my son, who is now 29 -- was not circumcized at birth for all of the reasons discussed here.
http://www.free-minds.org/circumcision.htm

That is fantastic, celestial shamanka...and welcome aboard this buzzing ship. I know so few who made the decision you did. I was always wondering how boys like this dealt with being different, in such a sensitive place, from the rest.

Yes, I think this is so. The hygenic reasons. So they no longer apply. It is fascinating how we continue barbaric rituals, that once might have had a purpose, for thousands of years without thinking. But it is complicated. The Mayans had unbelivable rituals around the phallus, and they lived in a moist jungle. Shame and guilt at being human sem to be universal and we haven't figured that one out yet.
It takes one brave advanced person like you and the rest will eventually catch up.

Goldensilence. How eloquently put, your analysis of Godot. I agree about our shadow leadership and have always thought that leaders are created out of the collective need of the time. We have to bear them as they are essential mirrors in our self understanding. The fact that this country is parting ways with this one is a good sign. This is better than his removal at the moment. Only problem, they will be searching for the next Godot as a group. Oh well.

If we keep this up, maybe one by one people will see the value of individualism, and thus, freedom, which existentialism prizes so much.

Uranus rules the electrical impulses that drive perceptions though the brain to form ideas and then articulation. The in between synapses being especially important. Uranus in Gemini takes the multi facted Gemini thinking process and sends it up to lightening speed taking tangential thoughts all in at once. So the Uranian mind sees things in an original way and is able to process it so fast it looks like genius. I think it is.
The opposition to Jupiter expands the whole thing and the ability to see the big picture. And adds an element of joy and confidence
Add the analysis of Virgo, and you have a great thinker. The kind I like to hang out with.

jm: I'm Philomena and celestial shamanka. Sorry about the confusion. I am curious jm -- are you male or female Cancerian?

Is anyone getting the feeling that there is a strange calm over DC in re: Rove and Cheney GJ announcement? As in the calm before the "media storm" -- perhaps our Capricorn SP Fritz is "timing" his announcement so that it will not be drowned out by the Hayden confirmation and the Immigration issues now dominating MSM. The upcoming NM in Gemini will be very close to the US's n. & prog. Uranus in Gemini -- there may be a karmic connection with the Solar Eclipse in 2003 @ 8 Gemini -- and on May 30th -- the Sun will trigger this degree again -- which is also the same degree of US Uranus -- it was during this Solar Eclipse in Gemini back in '03 when Wilson wrote his article for NY Times -- that triggered the WH group to conspire to out his wife, Val Plame. Also on the 30th -- Mercury will conjunct the US's Mars in Gemini -- t. Mars in Cancer will be in opposition to US's n. Pluto - 27 Capricorn. Jupiter in Scorpio will conjunct Fitz's Neptune in Scorpio -- and Saturn in Leo will begin a two week transit to Rove and Cheney's charts -- forming an opposition to Rove's Mars in Aquarius (arresting the group point man) and squaring Cheney's Saturn - Uranus Taurus conjunction. The FM in Sag will trigger Bush's Uranus in Gemini -- North/South Node in Sag @ 20 degrees -- if this doesn't bring the appropriate karmic political quakes inside the beltway -- nothing will!

A couple more tiny thoughts.
No matter what bodies we're housed in, we all have male and female in the psyche, and our gender struggle, I believe, is an attempt to get this in balance in our own selves.

The female is taught to hide her light and absorb life, refecting the Sun's greatness. So she is encouraged to diminsh her blatant expression of ego, I think, cultivating sympathy, bonding, etc. She can continue to blame circumstance, the world, men, the government, etc., or not wait forever and take it upon herself to let her ego go out of its encasement and into the world at large, if she has this desire. Men are admired for their pride in themselves, building their grat phallic monuments. Women can partake of this pride, too, and hopefully build more naturally and closer to the ground. However it plays, ego and self love can be quite enjoyable.

Saturn is transiting the NN in Leo in the USA chart. I think this is why we are questioning our leadership, realizing we want better, and connecting with our egos and selves as a place to look for this leadership.

I CAN'T BELIEVE IT!

Philo, what you asked! This is one of my favorite topics. The gender identification in the psyche.

I have a well developed 4th house Cancer Sun and Merc, my femininity is intact, but the rest is male. So I am a women developing male characteristics this time around with the exceptionally male Aries rising. I'm learning dynamism, creativity, thrust, projection, and the skill of mounting life and riding it. The skill of putting it out before it comes in. To penetrate and put myself into life.
I think this might relate to a weakness in the male line on my mother's side which almost led to the demise of the line. I came in as a warrior and survivor. And a developing man, with the sensitivity and gentleness of my femininity.
So for me, I admire men because they are my teachers this lifetime. I pick and choose carefully, but I spend a lot of time with them. They do not oppress me. They love and encourage me. They are amused by me.

With so many Cancer planets, I think this country is confused about military warfare, as the last years have revealed. Cancer nourishes and protects life, taking in the hungry and orphaned, so I think there is a great conflict within right now. War makes sense as self defense but as conquest, I'm not so sure the country is comfortable with this. We'll see as the Mars progression goes retrograde.

Thanks guys! I feel the same about everyone on this site. You are the largest bunch of genius ladies and gents I've ever encountered! What a find!

Another generation speaks. How refreshing!

~snip~

What began as mild rumblings of disapproval before McCain's speech soon exploded into boos, catcalls and turned backs.

~snip
http://www.thenation.com/blogs/notion?bid=15&pid=85098

jm -- you are a gender-bender -- LOL. I might add -- your intelligence is superior -- and Mercury is androgeneous -- where is Mercury in your chart? If you have a moment -- and feel inclined -- I would love to hear your sharp/analytical perceptions of some of the dynamics in my natal chart.
7/21/49 @ 1:07PM EDT - Wilmington, Delaware.

Wholeness is all about balancing one's yin and yang. My S/O is very yang -- but he is a *nuturer* -- loves to cook and shop for food -- will do anything I need done around the house to keep it running smooth -- has a great relationship with parents -- especially his mother -- yet he is one hellava business man when it comes to cutting a deal or driving a bargain.
So I take it jm -- you are a human being, first and foremost -- with a soul that is now in between -- gender shifts -- preparing for your next incarnation.

There is no one that makes me more sickening yellow green nauseous that John McCain. But something's very wrong with him.
This is excellent news. No way ever ever ever can he be president of this country. Ever.

Phil, I'll look at the charts tonite with great pleasure.
Yes, I feel I am shifting genders but with awareness as I don't abandon my femininity. Next incarnation should be a winner.

I also feel that the USA might be moving from feminine with Sag rising, NN in Leo and so much air. The NN in Leo makes me think we have yet to come into our leadership talent. It is innate but I think we are afraid of our own power, believe it or not. Cancer can be like this. I am waiting for our first woman president as I think she will be different from the norm and will embody masculine traits in a refreshing way. Hillary is so far from the advanced female leader I think we will produce, and this woman is worth waiting for.

Morgana,

The McCain story made me feel proud for the students but sorry for McCain. It's very sad to know someone has been deflated in public that way, yet I cheer the students, especially the jazz singer student for speaking out. It was inevitable though. It's still better to get a verbal lashing than what they do to our boys and girls. They send them to their death in totally fabricated wars.

Jill, jm and whoever else is interested:
Forgive my lack of sources for the following, as it's from memory.

There was a time when the Hebrew tribe was struggling to differentiate itself from the pagan Canaanites in whose land they lived for a time. It's possible that circumcision was invented by the Hebrew priests, or it may have been introduced by earlier cultures with whom the Hebrews encountered in their wanderings.

At any rate, circumcision was ritualized by the Israelite rabbis. Under Hebrew law, only a circumcised male could either be a rabbi or hold property, as I recall. It had two purposes: (1) because it marked a Hebrew male as an Israelite, different from the pagans around them; and (2) because women, not having penises which would be circumcised, were thus deprived of rights and privileges afforded to the circumcised male.

Devilishly simple, eh?

BTW, I have a feeling this crowd will really enjoy "The Alphabet Versus the Goddess" by Leonard Shlain.

I don't feel sorry for John Mccain, although he is pitiful. He allowed his wife and child to be chopped up and fed to the buzzards by these people and now he is in their royal bed. It's awful.

Unbelievable Joe! This is one of Sally's absolute favorites. She often advises the reading of The Alphabet Versus the Goddess.

One more thing before I go to my job of scooping my neighbor's cat's crap(you can tell I'm putting it off!).

I think the notion of an almighty USA empire is false in keeping with my "theory" that the USA hasn't learned power yet. The Moon in Aquarius and the South Node there, plus the Saturn in Libra, lead me to think that she has been dominated by the royals and old money houses around the world, not fully being herself and taking charge. Even the original settlement was an experiment by these people. Maybe the Aquarian South has been too egalitarian with the wrong types. The democratic ideals were there from the beginning but I think they were swallowed long ago and we will have to put our foot down and be our authentic selves if we want to fulfill our potential. Then maybe the true leadership capability will emerge.

jm, thanks for your honesty and forthrightness with gender-bending. :o) I hesitated to ask bluntly what my intuition was telling me, as questions are not always welcome in that department. Fortunately for us, Philomena hadn't any such qualms. :o)

Goldensilence, most eloquent words from you about leadership. I plan to save that comment for more thought, because according to Bill Herbst who read my chart last summer before he moved to Washington state, my main purpose for being here in this lifetime is to examine how power is used, and misused-- by those who have it, and by those who don't. I'm certainly finding that to be true.

Oops, that was me. :o/

It seems like one can become so enamored with the gender they're not, that they miss out on the gender they are. ;O)

Hey Joanna!

It seems like one can become so obsessed and enraged with the gender they're not, they miss out on the gender they are.

Can't win for losing, can we?

Well, I found it's been a good idea to look at actual behaviors to get an idea of a truth. Words are okay, but they come out of a Mind, & if the Mind is not rooted in natural law & hangs out in abstract space, it means mucho trouble... it's a psychosis. I'd feel the same had it been a hoard of "black" women who for centuries dominated, killed & raped (probably by instrumentation such as flashlights)... or american indian men, or a gaggle of asians, who, while being a minority, insisted on being very childish "rulers." ;O)

* Scalia Tells Congress to Mind Its Own Business

Justice Antonin Scalia rebuked fellow cons on Capitol Hill yesterday, saying they have gone too far in trying to prevent the USSC from using foreign law in its constitutional rulings. Scalia dissented vigorously from the court's recent decisions that invoked foreign law to help strike down the death penalty for juveniles & laws against consensual homosexual conduct. In Congress, con Republicans responded angrily to the rulings & introduced bills that would either condemn or ban the court's use of foreign legal authorities.

But in his speech to a Natl Italian American Foundation luncheon attended by several House members, Scalia said, in effect, that he does not need any help. "It's none of your business," he said, referring to Congress. "No one is more opposed to the use of foreign law than I am, but I'm darned if I think it's up to Congress to direct the court how to make its decisions."

The proposed lege "is like telling us not to use certain principles of logic," he said, adding: "Let us make our mistakes just as we let you make yours." ... http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/18/AR2006051801961_pf.html

And on a slightly different subject:

Would anyone care to make any guesses about the upcoming mayoral election in New Orleans? Here are the players (oops, I mean the candidates):

Ray Nagin, incumbent, born June 11, 1956 in New Orleans, time unknown. (I believe Claudia Dinkins did his chart right after Katrina hit.)

Lt. Gov. Mitch Landrieu, challenger, August 16, 1960, also New Orleans, time unknown.

Polls open 5/20/06, at 6 am CST. Sun in Taurus, moon in Pisces.

I would love to hear all your insights, if any of this would interest you.

Judi -- Your exalted Jupiter in Cancer conjuncts your Vertex 25* Cancer -- this is probably the *open channel* .........have you ever thought about inking political cartoons? Philomena

No...actually, Phio, I never thought much about anything except maybe sex. Typical Gemini of course. Seriously, no....political cartooning...seen any WOMEN doing that? I actually believe doing that job is a true integration of both art and literature. And a great sense of humor. I've got some ability in all of it, but not enough drive to put them all together. I was funnier when I was younger, and I am less so now...more serious...a buzz buster, I think when it comes to being around other people.

jm...I am wondering if you have made a decision about the maleness within your female self...which might not be really applicable in that it can't really be proved. It is an act of faith. But there actually is another psychological (if that is what we are talking about) answer....which I do know about from a personal level, having been diagnosed with it years ago. It is called a male-female split. My therapist said she was treating 6 other women with this (I never really was interested to find out about it) and I was the ONLY one who was able to fully function with it. Hmmmm...maybe because I could function with it, I wasn't interested in it? But it tends to be what I call being a twin...(oooohhh...gemini again)...
both male psychological functioning...and female. I was always attracted to men...and never women other than as friends. But I could always (to my detriment) meet men on their level and not play female games. Confused the hell out of them....

Mitchel...Godot and satire...

.today I was watching Johnny Neutron (the kids show on in the afternoon on the Cartoon Network right after Sponge Bob...which I also could watch for hours on end) wtith my 5 year old granddaughter. Boy, that show is satire and subversive of 'conventional values'! I just kept laughing outloud...these kids watching it are not going to grow up anything but liberal as hell....doubt they'll ever even try for conventional...some real subversive writers on this show....

Isn't it amazing, re the John McCain article, that Bob Kerrey was also in Vietnam, and gave as much as McCain did in that service...in this case, his leg. But he became very liberal...and McCain became ...what...? a sad party sell out? Played the game (and in AZ republican was the only game then)....etc. What different men...and of course, Kerrey is now the educator....and McCain the party hack.

I have a freind who says that if McCain's dad hadn't of been an Admiral, we never would have heard about McCain again....

Philo...re the Vertex/Jupiter again....this being in the 9th house, the Moon becomes the spiritual guide for me....my teacher, Stuart Walker in SF taught about this, and I would have thought it was Merc since Gemini is the cusp ruler of the 9th, and it has some bearing, but Cancer is intercepted in this house...so it is 'hidden' but also something very 'known' to me. I suspect that you are right about this being my 'channel' as it dovetails with what I was taught.

(The ruler of the 9th, the sign and planets contained in the 9th house are your spiritual guides.)

Judi, that "male-female split," while unfortunately a psychologist's way of pathologizing an invisible, intangible state of being, it *is* another brick in my theory that "two-spirit" is a reality. :o)

It can't be a coincidence that just last week, a Native American encountered my partner at a conference in northern Minnesota, near the White Earth reservation. Without ever having met my partner before, this Native man stated very matter of factly, "You have a partner, don't you? You both have two spirits. You're very powerful when you work together." My partner about fell out of his chair, he said, but I'm not the least bit surprised.

That's interesting, judi... the ruler of my 9th is mercury/scorpio/1st hse. And planets placed in the 9th is moon/cancer & uranus/gemini. I'll go for the idea that the packet is spiritual guides. Why not... sounds about correct... astrologically speaking. Hahahahaaa....

There you go, Joe... you're always able to be at a party! Sounds like fun in a working sort of way.

Speaking of young people & the hack mccain, judi...

* McCain at New School: Honeymoon is Over

"I haven't heard anyone aroused about me speaking at the New School," John McCain said in April, defending his decision to address Jerry Falwell's Liberty U. Nobody at all, except for virtually the entire crowd at the New School's Madison Sq Garden grad ceremony in NYC. At the beginning of the event, New School Pres, & former Sen, Bob Kerrey predicted a raucous affair. "Our founding purpose is proudly liberal," he said. "We began as an act of protest."

The school's tradition of dissent carried on today. Scores of New School students held orange signs, & a few banners, reading "McCain Does Not Speak For Me," & "Our Commencement Is Not Your Platform." What began as mild rumblings of disapproval before McCain's speech soon exploded into boos, catcalls & turned backs. ... http://www.thenation.com/blogs/notion?bid=15&pid=85098

* Bob Cesca: Fox News Trying To “Literally Encourage White Power”... http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bob-cesca/fox-news-presents-the-w_b_21195.html

My case isn't a split. The feminine qualities I'm very confident of and don't work with. It's a journy into new terrain with the feminine along. And the excitement of discovery...undeveloped parts of the self. I need my female part for the music and I treasure it.

I know we all have them. The chart will tell you. For example I have a Sun in Cancer and a Mars /Neptune in Libra. My male image is one of gentleness, poetry, and imagination. Wouldn't you know it? I get a pisces father with a Moon in Cancer and a Sun/Neptune/Moon libra brother. We attract men who fit this image and provide a mirror for these selves. The Aries is the odd man out in my case.

I don't at all think gender amalgamation is pathological. Quite the opposite. Very healthy. The more we integrate them in ourselves, the more our societies will reflect it. We certainly have to separate to procreate, but that's about it. The rest is up for grabs.

The reason I am cultivating my maleness is because of my desire to be a dynamic practicing artist in the world, solo, and meeting the male dominated society in a way that I don't have to compromise too much. So the female is for the grace and beauty, and the male for the assertive success in the marketplace without using sex for money. A forward thrust is essential. And to keep it up. Many women, almost all of our movie stars and such, use sex for money, but in history, many have not...writers, educators, artists, etc. I feel that the ones who do this successfully have owned some of their masculine traits and are comfortable with them.

I first met my "alter" as a pre-adolescent. His name switched back/forth, Michael/Diamond. Anyway, he was beautiful (not what one could call "handsome"), had a large phallus, & was a victim/martyr/savior "for the people" (I think I was swamped with too many xian stories perhaps). The story line, which I turned into neighborhood plays with my mates, was that he had to give up his life so that the People would give up their ammunitions for pity's sake. Now where a child got an idea of "ammunitions" must've been too much WWII/Korean Assault talk among the elders imo. ;O) "Michael/Diamond" is still there... he just ain't a martyr no mo'...

Joanna. That is fascinating.

Thanks, jm... I mildly think so, too, for the Jungian-type value. He was/is a Dionysian figure for sure & "he" actually ran my life well into adulthood... I certainly had to deal with "his" alcoholism/drugs years ago, but I love "his" love for music, art, poetry, kundalini... now I get in touch with "his" energies thru healthy meditation et al. We see how the fe/male energies blend... I don't have to hold to one & askew the "other." But I am female "this incarnation" so that my Mind doesn't wander out of natural law... like it used to.

I think everyone meets their alters at pre- or during the adolescent stage. It takes remembering intent for some I 'spose, but they're right there, & so here. ;O)

Joe....I like your way of saying it....and it is true, the 'pathology' thing is strong and as much as I have been interested in that discipline, I wasn't in it when it was MY diagnosis! I'm kinda glad I just didn't get wrapped up in it like a cloak or something. I just kind of thought it was cool I could be a 'whole' person. And Joe, 4 is more powerful than 2, so you two can really make waves...

As a matter of fact, Joanna, my ' spirit ' guide who came thru is Michaela. Introduced her spirit with "I am she who is a visitor from the velocity of light, the kingdom of God." But there are many others who have identified...right down to the mischevious buzzing little gaggle of pixies.

I am trying to transcribe my notes from 1991 when the bulk of this happened...and Michaela was identified as an angel of Thrones. For this little non believer and unbaptized brat, I had no idea about angels (sniff, the brat said, that is so Catholic, angels and stuff!)....

Well, jm, I hope you're able to synthisize all the various elements into a huge success....I really do see it more like Joe described...we can choose to express both male and female elements and one day all humans may be doing just that.

It is kind of interesting what makes a person reside in the consciousness of other people...artist(s) of all kinds are remembered because they were able to make concrete gift or bring to life something which is very universal to so many people....often, have you noticed, many moviestars have Mars conj. Venus...which I think would also lead to both sexes being able to identify with them.

jm...never saw Women in the Dunes, but I sure remember it....it was a favorite of my Ex....he was a UCLA film major...

Joanna, you have had a rich and complex life...if Michael/Diamond is any standard!

I actually asked 'Michaela' why I was so sure my partner in life was not IN this life....and I was then introduced to this entiy named Xerxes...who proceeded to explain that, indeed, many thousands of years ago, we had been the Jim and Tammy Fay Bakers of a place in Assyria....full description followed. I asked why I had kept coming back and he hadn't...

The reply was that he had heard the voice of God....

and I hadn't.

And whomever or whatever that voice was, I knew he was the one. And that I had never heard that voice in this life. (Not to say I didn't look...I looked plenty. )

Miss Judi... you're a scream!!! If you were funnier earlier & more serious now, no comedienne could compete. I do believe you're projecting a "rich & complex" life onto others. TaHA!!

We're all talking about the natural... natural as breathing, you know. What makes these experiencs shaky & taboo-feeling are the "little mimes/mines" placed in our consciousness very, very early by a "cultural dominator, particuarly religous, & we're afraid these "mines" will blow up & "take us out"! Mebbe the "dominator" is a rogue ET group that met up with a rogue earthling group... no matter ultimately--our inheritance is OUR inheritance & that is ALL of ourselves as we truly are. Eh, jm?!? ;O)

Yes'm.

I have all the fleshy protuberances in the right places, and...hmmmmm... in the key of G....

"I enjoy being a girl!!!!!!!"

got an email from a politcal worker in Seattle...he was writting to someone else and copied me...he is not American born, but he is very passionate about politics, but very formal in a sweet way....he wrote

At Seatac this morning I ran into Governor Locke who's standing behind me at security gate and asked him if he aware of Bill Clinton event next month, he said yes he only knew from the media but never get invitation from Cantwell campaign (?) He seems eager to attend this event and promised him will talk to Cantwell people as soon as I am back to Seattle next week, he said you guys has his email address.

Could you or Matt make sure he gets the invitation by next week ? Appreciate for your follow up.Philly is great but people not as nice as Seattle people, Senate race is getting heat up, the good news is Rick "evil" Santorum is double digit behind Bob Casey. It really make me more than excited!!! Bush poll keep low in this State and people see Santorum as Bush's licker. You know how ambitious I am want to see D's take over control in Congress in the next 5,5 month ?

On musing further, I remember one of the first things I did for "spiritual growth" was throw the nasty egoic voices out of my head... you know the ones: "You're so ugly" "You're so stupid" "You don't deserve to live" "Nobody could love you" "Can't you do anything right?" "Hell you're sick!" ... It didn't take ages to do either! I came across the startling idea that I certainly wouldn't invite or put up with such a destructive bully in my physical space, why the hell should I put up with one in my consciousness space?!? That right there improved the quality of my life immensely... & greatly reduced the anger decible. Anybody else do that?

judi... your ley lines are incredible!

ahaa Jo, see ....I still talk to myself not too nice...but it took getting smacked around by a couple of the dudes to come to my senses. I see it as people throwing poo on your shoes....you can wipe it off or you can let it mess up your shine. I just never knew I had a choice in it. I told you I was pretty unconscious for a long time.

Joanna, I was always able to make people laugh by being a total 'straightman' (in comedy parlance that is).

I lived with a Jewish theater (NY & LA) family, and no one was funnier than their Nana, who at about 4ft10 used to make these professional actors and comedians fall down laughing. I could do it too....dry and wry.

Just not enough people left in my life who know the score...

Joanna, remember Steve Martin's riff on how they divorced in 'his' country (meaning some obscure middle eastern place which his accent in character came from)...as he said, "In my country when the man wants to divorce his wife, he throws dog poop on their shoes and turns them around 3 times and says, 'I divorce thee, I divorce thee, I divorce thee.' I'm sure he was talking about Hollywood....hahahahah

The destructive "voices" could be called Head Freepers.

I've always like Karen... she's soothing. http://www.whatsuponplanetearth.com/latest.htm

from Karen ...on whats up with planet earth...all I can say is, I sure hope so!

If you are wondering if you now have to go out and get a “job” when you haven't had one for awhile, or if you are wondering if you have to “go back” to the life you had before your ascension experience, I very much doubt that this is so.

Thank you JudiGem for the P K Dick. I have always thought that if one was going to accept a sci-fi author for one's personal saviour, Phil would be it. I've been thinking about reading Radio Free Albemuth again lately, but every time I pick it up to read it, I get overwhelmed and have to set it aside. Even tho the end is hopeful, Dick's vision of the fascist dictatorship of Ferris F Freemont (who basically got into the presidency by killing everyone who stood in his way) cuts a little too close to home to be lightly entertaining. However, I do want to be soothed by Phil's gentle voice and his saggittarian optimism that this all will work out.
I am, as my 'name' suggests, female in this life and quite comfortable with myself, but over the years, I have had many dreams of my former lives; I've been mostly male, mostly soldiers, mostly dying in violent ways. I think I am so pacifist in this life as a reaction to all of it. I can understand someone being a little confused by feeling one gender and being another physically, but I suspect that it doesn't become an issue unless the person is not allowed to act that side out and integrate it with the body- the two sexes become mutually exclusive in one's mind and the belief arises that one needs must be a particular sex to act a certain way. Dunno if that's how it works, but it makes sense to me.
Thanks to all who post here, old and new. I love our conversations.
KING FELIX!!! Juno

I ve gone through the play and could not resist mocking at the two characters. But what i found most interesting was that they did nt left hopes till the end. They are waiting and waiting and waiting!!!!!! and ll do the same the very next day until they meet godot, whom they think might change their future.

The play actually deserves a success with its central theme around the importance of existentialism.

Yea, verily, judi... Karen has been right-on so many times at what's manifested in my personal life, she's taken my breath away.

Anyhoo, I think there might have been some misunderstanding. I am a very feminine heterosexual female who prefers rewiring the lights in the house to cooking. I love my tool belt as much as my brassiere. Simple as that.

Are they still waiting for Godot/Rove out there?

Just found this.....

"The House rejected an attempt late Thursday to end a quarter-century ban on oil and natural gas drilling in 85% of the country's coastal waters."
Thank you, House of Representatives.

Hey Joanna - I did that! Kicked the "nasty voices" out of my head, and, through focused effort, got the "revenge" voices out too. Still have to watch the "revenge" voices, since I have mars/mercury/ASC conjunct in Scorpio widely squared pluto. My "nice" Libra sun/moon just had to get over it! It's an ongoing process as is always the case in this life . . .

jm: when I first read your comments, I thought you were male. I'll have ponder a bit more to figure out why.

Someone posted this on Salon today.

Hayden

http://salon.com/opinion/conason/2006/05/19/hayden_cia/story.jpg

Himmler

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/e8/Himmler45.jpg/443px-Himmler45.jpg

Hayden is just a little puffier and more bulbous.

It seems as if the congressional cowards are ratcheting up the assault on EVERYTHING, have you noticed? and it is getting crazier and crazier...at least this off shore drilling crap got turned down.

Joanna...yes...Karen is reading the same energies I have (and you have too), and I recognize it when she writes it...but I don't have the channel tuned to 'share with others' as she does.

jm...I can relate, although I don't actually HAVE a tool belt. You are high in the 'mechanics' part of those high school tests which declare what you are and aren't good at. I was in the 99th percentile on Mechanics...and minus zero in nursing/social care. It is a wonder my mother survived her sojourn with me over 8 years, or that my daughter achieved a normal adulthood.

Jemica....I, too, like Sam Beckett's plays....and Godot I've seen performed many times...the last time at the Magic Theater in SF...my favorite existentialist reading though was Sartre's Nausea, which I suppose every college student read in the era I came from anyway...and get over eventually.

Juno J....you know, PK Dick just blew me away (I was a Sci Fi buff from early teens) and I, too, sometimes cannot bear his pain (as he couldn't either...)if you haven't read about his life...welll....do). It does take your breath away....I am glad to know that others feel that way too, I don't feel quite so whimpy and alone! He was channeling something extremely serious....which I think Orwell and Huxely were doing too.

Neith....I have Scorpio rising also....squaring
Leo Pluto/Venus and Midheaven....revenge...boy, I had no idea that I was capable of some ot the things I did in relationships....! talk about revenge....until pushed so far I really snapped. Right when Pluto was by transit on my Scorpio rising sign. Got fired from my job, too, had a psychotic break....and the relationship started beating on me....the only thing that bothered me (the firings and beatings and turning 40) was that my dog died too ...

jm...I knew what you were talking about, I knew you were female....but with a good analysing mind and memory. I was referring in my posts to a psychological state, and Joe and Joanna were equating that to a spiritual/natural state. Never thought you were male...just pretty smart. I never saw this as 'changing sexes from one life to another'....I see it as part of America (paternalisim) not allowing females to be smart. The most serious depression I ever encountered was at Art Center in LA when I realized it was all a male world and I couldn't play( like females going to West Point...the ration of men to women there was 7:1 in art school)....further enhanced by going to work and finding that it was TRUE....the only play I could have was being someone's arm squeeze. Like the bosses I worked for, for instance...and got fired by when I wouldn't.

Juno Jones, do you have Mars in Aries Libra or Capricorn? What about the rest here who feel this sort of dual role?

I've had psychics tell me that I died in many wars, (I have Mars in Aries) the last WWII (could be, but I was born in 1943, so it was a quick turnaround...and she said it was an assault on an island in the Pacific held by Japan...and I'm not sure that there were any such assaults in the Pacific in or before June of 1943). But I have remained good if distant friends with a writer friend whom I met at art school..she is Aries, b. April 1943...and I have been told we were good buddies as soldiers in many wars....so it is very possible that a great many women are struggling with this identity crisis....or is it a lack of confirmation that we do live many lives?

I had a friend when I worked at Mervyn's ad dept who was about 6 years older. He (was gay) said that he could remember the concentration camps...his memories were hearing German spoken and bodies 'slapping' down around him in mass graves. I had heard long ago from actor George Maharis that the thinking was that the people killed in WWII incarnated again right away and didn't have time to process the experiences....leading to the generation of people who fought in Vietnam AND the protesting.

I am wondering if Neptune in Libra generation (which I am not a part of as it was retro in Virgo for part of 1943) has something to do with the peace movement which happened with Neptune in Libra....make love, not war!

"Connecticut Democrats Endorse Lieberman"
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060520/ap_on_el_se/connecticut_senate;_ylt=A9G_RwsgNm9E4l8AkRKs0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3OXIzMDMzBHNlYwM3MDM-

Pat Sharp: Thank you for the gardening websites; I love the info; very, very helpful.

RE: DREAMS: Can somebody please tell me what this dream means? Last week, I dreamt that I was in a beach that looked like the Thai beach in the Bridget Jones movie, then suddenly I got caught up in a tsunami and it seemed that that was going to be it; lights out. Then suddenly the gigantic tidal wave simply vanished and I ran towards the hotel soaking wet. Then lots of people came marching from the beach towards the hotel, looking traumatized. They were going home (end of dream).

It turns out that the Asian tour I may be taking soon includes Thailand on the last days of the trip. I had the dream before I was aware of this fact. I really wasn't interested in going there at all, but the tour includes it. Then I read Astropro's forecast for 2006 and it is pretty scary for the summer. There's always something bad happening in SE Asia (typhoons, earthquakes, volcanoes, tsunamis). I hope the dream was just a case of anxiety, not my future. All I wanted was to visit China and Japan before the economy/dollar collapses, and before WWIII begins. My husband doesn't believe in astrology or dreams so he's not going to cancel the trip. I do have some brutal transits coming up. Goodbye cruel world.

Little Moon....you came out of it.....that is good news. since the dream came before you actually knew you would be on the tour there, perhaps it is warning you that you are going to be filled with a tsunami of fear....

PS...on activisim at a local level...people are dropping their phone companies who gave info (even if it is only general info, or so they say) to the bushies...and moving to Working for Change...

here is an article on this...
http://www.workingforchange.com/article.cfm?itemid=20790

I am going to dump my cell and my landline, despite the problems inherint in this....like my checks having the wrong phone, and lots of other stuff....because Working Assets also donates to progressive causes.

Change is good.

JudiGem: Thank you for responding. You're right. I did survive the dream tsunami, so that's hopeful. But I don't look forward to a tsunami of fear at all.
What kind of chart do you have??? Beatings, lecherous bosses. And you've survived it all! I hope that life is treating you better now.

PS...the phone service Working Assets did NOT turn records over to the administration. AND if you do switch land line (cell phone is available too), you get a free George W. Bush DOORMAT. How can anyone resist?

Neith

This is so incredibly fascinating and what a golden opportunity for all of us. I wonder, wonder, wonder what it is that made you think I was a man.
What is so incredible is this new way of communicating where we express ourselves and are perceived in unusual ways without the visuals, smells, etc. So maybe hidden personas emerge or strengths become apparent that aren't usually so forthright. We all are perceived subjectively, and it is so interesting how many people we really are. Neith, you aren't the only one who gets the male in me, so there is some common factor with you and the others that single this out. I wonder if people in the blogosphere see us differently from our other friends. I think this all enhances personality development.

This is the skinny. Aries is about as male as you can get. Like Michael Lutin says, Aries is a single guy, no matter what the actual gender. Our Ascendant is our whole persona and the role we play in life and is of utmost importance. I think we come into its realization as we progress in life, since we are behind it and not of it at first. Our mask. Through our experience we get feedback from others as to what we are projecting through this ASC and eventually we get to know it, incarnate fully, and thus know ourselves. I think we all have this destiny. We can sculpt our own selves through trial and error at this point of the chart.

So an Aries rising is projecting male characteristics and operates successfully in her environment with these traits. It is not receptive and absorbing. It is dynamic, assertive, and creative. I am a Cancer, exactly square this Aries, with a Moon/Jupiter conjunction so I am as nurturing and receptive as a person can be. I know this well and don't need to further cultivate it. It operates automatically.
It's not the paternal society that thwarts my expression of intelligence, as you say Judi, but my own Cancer timidity and fear of being such a powerful male type Aries persona. The Aries frightens the Cancer and the battle goes on, Cancer holds it back, Aries defies the hold and pushes out. Since I am older now, my Aries is getting more play. But the Cancer always operates too.

All women with strong Aries have this somewhat. The answer to the frustration is not in the society or others, but in releasing one's self from one's fears and letting this amazing dynamic, sometimes abrasive energy, out. Otherwise internal tensions and sickness will eventually arise. Potential will not be fulfilled. And eventually we get accustomed to the consequences and learn to love our hot highly charged exciting Aries energy. The female in us can plug into our own male, and there you are. Energy!

From Truth Out:

“TruthOut will post a far more comprehensive update on the Rove indictment tomorrow, Sunday, at noon pacific standard time.

jm: Fascinating insights all! You really are good at presenting your information in a clear, concise & highly readable way. And when we are communicating solely through written words, there is lots of room for assumptions . . . you choose to use your initials rather than a name which would have given us a gender clue, and you often prefer to stay with ideas rather bringing in personal, emotional issues. These must be things I associate with the masculine polarity. I happen to enjoy Aries energy a lot!! My husband is Aries sun/moon/mercury/jupiter/ASC all opposed by saturn in Libra. I have two Aries nieces that are my "children" - my sister left them with while she partied from the time they were littles. An aside: i just discovered I have Hades in my 5th house - could explain all the miscarriages & the only time it felt solid, i had an abortion @ 27yrs old. Thus, no children of my body, only my spirit.

JudiGem, Joanna, jm et all: It's a blessing from the Goddess we survived ourselves to grow into the fine beings we are today . . . Here's to contrarians everywhere!!

jm, I thought you were a man too, but I think it was because your initials look like 'jim'. I don't get any underlying feelings of gender on this blog except when everyone is talking about being females. Most of what is discussed here comes from the higher mental plane levels which have less to do with the emotional and physical planes than with the mental plane. Ideas drive the discussion here and ideas have no gender.

Heavens Neith. Your husband.

Very interesting about the world of ideas.
Goldensilence, as usual. So well put.

I am heartened by this. And this is why the discussion while waiting for all the emotional horrors of these childish politicians to play out is such a refreshing action for me. Nothing wrong with being childish, if one is a child not a leader of a country. I am not rejoicing in the knowledge that English is now the USA official language.

I've always prized the detached and intellectual view of events where so much objective learning takes place and I think I've consciously worked on this as the manipulation of fear gripped our country. I was totally frustrated with the collective agonized scream with every move, how people jumped every time they snapped their fingers, spreading rumors unintelligently, leaping to conclusions prematurely....comparing this little schnook to Hitler and crying constantly about the massive destruction of our country. I found this a little exaggerated, but by no means am I trying to underestimate the danger. Only to see it as accurately as possible so I know what to do. And the mental plane is a great place to start. Even though the pain is visceral and emotional. It hurts less, I find, when the mind works well. So as a result of our country's predicament, I feel some character improvement. And I see this around me as well.

This is why I love Sally's view. Of course I want Rove gone, but I will not stop my growth and forward motion, and my enjoyment of life, while waiting for something to happen to him.
I think we did it. If he goes, the others who have invested so much in his removal will surely be disappointed, while the idea people will have learned something new and still see his behind out the door.

Can't lose for winning.

In this vein, I feel an ending of sorts. As the North Node goes into Pisces I think we will see the undoing of it all. The disintegration of our government is a fact. No one's fault in particular, it was meant to be. They can't help it. If the Democrats gain back a chamber, I expect even more pandemonium as they are overwhelmed with trying to figure out the power structure. But our government is at a loss. There is a lot to discuss and much we can do for ourselves. Now is the time. There is less to fear now. We're not entirely doomed at the moment.

Oooh, Judi Gem ! Nailed me there, Mars in cap loosely conjunct S.node, fifth house along with my conjoined sun and moon in Sag (my birthday is the 15th dec, the day before Phil's ). Wow another sci- fan/ artist! I can so identify with your experience at art school. To put it into perspective, I lost my first job in the public library at the age of fourteen because I kept reading the books. The one I ultimately got caught at: Phil's 'A Scanner Darkly'. I am who I am today, for better or for worse because of that man. Please don't feel alone. Perhaps we were almost alone in 1977 or even 1990, but the internet has changed things, we can talk now, and so many others are joining in...

JM, you have a tool belt?...how coooool! :)

You all are such strong and independant women, the more I get to know you the more impressed I am! You are goddesses all! And I want to put a good word out to our fellow Gods! Any man who spends time talking to us here is definitely in touch with his feminine, and is welcome!
I had an odd combination of parents, my mom was cappy, my dad a cancer. Mom was a career woman ( a physical therapist since the late '50's)very caught up in her work, my dad (an educator who worked with the handicapped) was the nurturer, the one I always went to for comfort.
Namaste, I honor the God/Goddess within you all! Juno

PS I have my south node in capricorn and my north in cancer...a 'male' soul being taught become one with/find balance with the female? From reading this thread, I suspect there's a lot of it going about, thank you all for opening up. Juno

http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0425-20.htm

DYING FOR NIXON, DYING FOR BUSH

“I didn’t want to die for Nixon,” said a man I met recently in a Seattle park. He’d served on military bases in a half dozen states, then had a car accident just before being shipped to Vietnam. “The accident was lucky,” he said. “It was a worthless war and I didn’t want to go.”

I agreed. I admired those who fought in World War II, I said. We owe them the debt of our freedom. But to die for Nixon’s love of power, fear of losing face, deception and vindictiveness—to die for him was obscene. Nixon’s war, the man said, had nothing noble about it. And neither did Iraq.

What does it mean to die in a war so founded on lies? Bush may lack Nixon’s scowl, but he’s equally insulated from the consequences of profoundly destructive actions. He came to power riding on the success of Nixon’s racially divisive “Southern Strategy,” which enshrined the Republicans as the party of backlash. He won reelection by similarly manipulating polarization and fear. Like Nixon, he’s flouted America’s laws while demonizing political opponents. His insistence that withdrawing from Iraq would create a world where terrorists reign echoes Nixon’s claim that defeat in Vietnam would leave the U.S. ''a pitiful, helpless giant.''

While Bush assures our soldiers they fight for Iraqi freedom, and to “make America safer for generations to come,” 82 percent of Iraqis, according to a British Ministry of Defense poll, say they’re "strongly opposed" to the presence of American and British troops, and 45 percent justify attacks against them. This creates what psychologist Robert Jay Lifton calls “an atrocity-creating situation.” Lifton first used the phrase during Vietnam. He now uses it to describe a “counterinsurgency war in which US soldiers, despite their extraordinary firepower, feel extremely vulnerable in a hostile environment,” amplified by “the great difficulty of tracking down or even recognizing the enemy.” This sense of an environment out of control has seeded the ground for Abu Ghraib and for massacres, at the villages of Haditha and Mukaradeeb, already being compared to My Lai. Former Army sniper Jody Blake recently described his unit keeping extra spades on their vehicles so that if they killed innocent Iraqis in response to an attack with an Improvised Explosive Device, they could throw one next to the corpses to make it appear those killed were preparing a roadside bomb.

More...

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/1126-08.htm

The Impossible Will Take a Little While

http://mydd.com/story/2006/5/15/202917/008

BLUE NATION

jm, I know you are speaking of your own journey in terms of speaking out and it not being about what society dictates, but nothing exists in a vacuum. I experience the untiversal aspects of life....and little about ME. Check out my chart, the only planet in the first 6 houses is Mars in Aries in the 6th.....everything else runs from Merc in 7 to Neptune on the cusp of 12. I never could figure out why I didn't seem to know much about ME and a whole lot too much about everyone else until seeing my 'bowl' chart. (very common in the 1940's.) So we are both right for what we are talking about....the shape of the chart really does give lots of info too, and where and in what half of the chart....(gwb's chart is also classic bowl, but his planets are all in the eastern half I think (the ascendant side...and kinda nothing in the 4-10 side....it is a form of lack of balance.)

I think with the squares one needs to integrate the energies. My planets are almost ALL conjunctions ...so I don't have much of a choice...it already is integrated. Although integrating a Scorpio rising with a Gemini sun has been not so easy.

Little Moon,
I had a recurring tidal wave dream, when I was younger. We vacationed in Ocean City NJ every summer. Being under 6, I was very aware of the possiblity of enemy submarines "out there" ( I pictured Nazies with oriental eyes.) I remember American ships being sunk off the East coast before we entered the war. ( I was born in May of 39. )
That memory was verified by a recent Nova ( PBS) about some divers finding a German submarine 60 miles off the Jersey Shore. ( It was officially placed off the coast of Africa by the archives of the German Govt.).
The loss of shipping decreased, once we entered the war.
In the dream, I would start down the wooden stairs from the boardwalk to the beach, and be inundated by this huge wave that came out of nowhere. I always managed to hang on to the rail until it receded!
I'm still here 67 years later, no actual big waves encountered! Just be vigilant and aware; like the animals! Remember those 2 women in the WTT, ( on 9/11) who heard the loudspeakers say it was safe to go back to their offices. They listened to their instincts and high tailed it and made it ouit safely, among the first to emerge from the building.

Come to think of it.........I had another recurring dream, or variations thereof. I'm having tea in a roof top restaurant high up above the city The builing turns to rubber and flops over sideways from the middle, ( like Gumby) & everything & everyone just slides off. That one was so compelling, I was getting a lot of murals on upper floors, which made me uncomfortable. It definitely tilted the balance sheet in favor of moving to Maine where there aren't many tall buildings, when I had to sell my cabin in NJ. It certainly wasn't beyond my imagining, that people might fly planes into buildings!
I have mars in Cap.have tools will build! ( No belt!)
No nurturing skills..............used those up raising kids and mates!
My daugthter also has mars in Cap. & I remember being so proud of her. We had a commission to do 4 under water paintings for a country club, and the canvass had to be stretched on plywood rounds. She ( about age 20) put her foot up on that plywood balanced on the porch rail, and proceeded to cut a perfect curve with a Sears saber saw.
PQ

Judi, you are absolutely 100% correct. My planets are below the horizon and only my Moon/Jupiter conjuction is above. Transits will take us in either direction if we want. And synastry with our friends and partners. Scorp with Gem is very difficult, but I think you've mastered a lot of it. The element of lightness is integrated well with your research and deep pondering Scorpio desire. I still think the ASC. is paramount and is our Ace in the deck as we work lifelong with it. I think the rising signs have the best chance of manifesting the positive side. The way you analyzed the difference between us is proof positive.
Maybe you have an ingrained sense of self so that is why so many planets above.

Juno, you're tops! The Saggie types are coming out from the rocks and the caves. Their services are required.

Judi...as Pluto comes up to my Midheaven I expect to be learning a lot of the things you already know. How to fit my Aries self into a tight structured, largely ugly and ungraceful world where the cards are stacked against the individual. It will be tense, I know. You think you've got problems with the Uranus square Pluto coming up. How 'bout me with my Aries Asc? This girl's getting ready. The same rugged individualism that gets trapped is the same energy that will turn the challenge into victory, if things go according to plan. Otherwise, I'll give up and turn to my Taoist path in the trees.

PQ, I'm envious. That accuracy of Mars in Capricorn.

Ah shucks, jm, thank you (blush). I lurked here a long time before I could summon the courage to start'talking'. I have learned so much by being here, about astrology, about people and the way the two interact...I've probably learned more about astrology since the internet than I did in reading about the subject for nearly twenty years previously. Thank you all again, Juno

http://www.osei.noaa.gov/Events/Current/VSHSoufriereHills140_G12.jpg

The volcano Soufriere Hills on the island of Montserrat erupted violently this morning at approximately 7AM EST. A pilot report in the vicinity of the volcano indicated ash reached the height of 55,000 feet.

PHOENIX FIVE EARTH CHANGES BULLETIN
May 17, 2006 by MW Mandeville (Black Canyon City, Arizona)

NOTICE: Due to Presidential Executive Orders, the National Security Agency may have read this email without warning, warrant, or notice. They may do this without any judicial or legislative oversight. You have no recourse nor protection save to call for the impeachment of the All the Criminals in the White House.

BULLETIN ITEM: Scenarios Seem Parallel To "Left Behind"

MWM: I have not read the "Left Behind" series so I cannot make a comparison. I do know that this is deeply resonant "thoughts" of the day from a subscriber who is a Lady with some mileage and wide ranging experience in the politics of the heatland. Please note what she says about everyone wanting to vote "independent", or for anybody but the above.

I especially liked this little zinger, speaking about the politicos:

"we only have carpetbaggers buying and selling us out while they stand in a circle of self congratulations."

From: B

Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 12:44:24 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [phoenix-quest] Scenarios Seem Parallel To "Left Behind"

Big things seem to be closing in. All the chatting and exchanges over the past few years in this group seems to be finding a nexus. Nothing is stable. Even If "W" is reading this, the beltway geniuses already knows not all of America is dumbed down to accept verbatim any of their baseless assurances. In the heartland, people are cranked to the max. They are despaired about taxes that some dumb judge tinkered with and cause so many older people to get BIG bills. The states raised taxes on them and cities have increased impending. Runaway healthcare costs, ageism that keeps vital workers from working in jobs wherein they can earn a real living and make real contributions, the rich-get-richer privileges paraded in front of us which is abusive and grotesque--all actions to ponder.

The landscape of mankind is not pretty. Our sons and daughters remain in Iraq engaged in yet another Vietnam, illegal aliens swarm in, imported poverty that lowers job wages while cost of living has not gone down--troublesome. The arrogance of corporate America is shameless. And now we know the drums are beating to face off with Iran.

People are so distracted by one whim of the day or another, so distracted they can barely smell the earthchanges and weather extremes. Most don't know what a chemtrail is! Social problems are overflowing and solutions out of reach. From divorce to crime to judicial hacks that make a mockery of the Constitution, people are too overwhelmed to be outraged.

But a few...just a few...hold up the candles.

Neither political party holds an answer for what ails the United States. They are the same and the election is only about the pocketbook you want the graft to go into...but commonsense leadership could arise out of the Middle Class if people will stop fearing and blaming and take up the mission. We need sensibility...not compromise. We are sitting on the precipice of world war with Iran as its trigger.

I have a young family member in Iraq. He wants to come home...but he cannot. We wonder if he will ever come home? At the same time, all of this has been part of prophecy. America used to push its ills on third world countries and impose itself on allies who would do anything to get "a cut" of the wealth. But we only have carpetbaggers buying and selling us out while they stand in a circle of self congratulations. And the focus of America is now on its own people...as Lou Dobbs will point out. He's the only good thing about CNN.

Oh, I'm just stinking-thinking out loud. This is the view of the day...it isn't very pretty, is it? The clock is ticking...for change. I feel it. Ever voter I've chatted with intends to vote Independent and look for some libertine insights! The extremes do not serve us well but they do awaken us. We do need commonsense--no matter what party one belongs to. But the environment is now abominable.

Just reflecting "the heartland."

B
Indiana

Best Wishes, Michael Wells Mandeville,
The Hills of Arizona USA at mwman@earthlink.net
Master Website Index is at: http://www.michaelmandeville.com

Eric Francis on Planet Waves has this piece on Rove's rectified chart.

http://planetwavesweekly.com/dadatemp/716494541.html

Eric Francis Sunday, May 21 | Gemini

Hey there. I've been hanging out in the background while the Sun made it's way through the last degrees of Taurus. The Sun & Mercury are now in Gemini, & we start a new cycle of experience, expression, & movement. We are already in the third sign of the season--(northern) spring began more than 8 weeks ago & (northern) summer begins in about 4 weeks.

Fri, I published a fairly extensive article on Karl Rove & his astrology. The piece includes a rectification of his natal chart, which should prove to be helpful & provide a reference point for the many people who have written in over the months asking whether I have Rove's data. I think for our next rectification project we had better do Patrick Fitzgerald, who also has a date, a place & no published time. When you read the rove piece, bear in mind that Fitzgerald, his nemesis, was born exactly on the (northern) winter solstice--with his Sun in the first degree of Capricorn. Here is the link. I'll catch you tomorrow.

http://planetwavesweekly.com/dadatemp/716494541.html

(Hahahahahaaaaa!!)

JoannaO -- Did you do the Rove rectification for Eric Francis? He is one of my favorite astrologers -- over the top excellent!!

Nope, Phil... I ain't in that league. G'morning!

I've been thinking a lot this morning, tho, on the mystery of the "universe" that allows one little dysfunctional murderous pipsqueak to have such affect on millions of lives & I realy resent it. Can you imagine being married to someone absolutely untrustworthy? ...always being jacked around, confused, played-with like a toy, manipulated 25/8... his spouse surely must have access to the bank account to make it all worth while to her imo... or mebbe not.

Happy Gemini all ... just stopped by to see what's up and noticed the discussion on Rove. I use 12/25/1950, Denver CO., 4:14AM, I'm looking for my notes on the rating of it.

Back later.

http://forum.truthout.org/blog/

Information Sharing on the Rove Indictment Story

JoannaOregon,

OK, I'll stop posting Eric Francis from now on! I did it because it seems everyone wanted to see stuff about Rove right now.

Great minds....

GoldenSilence... no ma'am... I just neglected to ck to see if an article had been posted or not... it's not my territory nor would I like to take responsibility for one.

JoannaOregon, All righty then! I guess we'll just be double posting every so often! I can live with that.

JoannaO -- Take a quick look back over the historical time space continuum -- lots of dysfunctional pipsqueaks have incarnated w/ power complexes the size of their inflated egos -- somehow humanity has survived -- not necessarily the wiser -- but eventually a tad bit more sophisticated in recognizing this defect in character -- before it has a chance to devolve our humanity to the level of an all out rat nest reality. Rove is small potatoes when it comes to what ails this planet -- just a rat in one ship of state -- in the big picture -- there are a lot more Roves' lurking in other governments -- that we may never learn about until it is too late. England and Israel are two countries that have Rove type - institutional ratster -- running their rat lines deep inside their respective government's walls and hallways. It's just the nature of the political rat race. Good to see Fritz the Cat on the scene -- gives me hope.

Ahhh... the glorified humanoid race! It should take its glorified self into space... search out new planets to glorify itself... &, well never mind. I just realized that Muhammad Ali posed himself as Shadow to El Pinko: "I'm the greatest!!" WhaddaHOOT!

USian's latest chump in Iraq...

* On Violent Day, Iraq's New Leader Promises Security

BAGHDAD, Iraq, May 21 — Iraq's new prime minister, Nuri al-Maliki, used his first full day on the job today to promise "max levels of force in confronting terrorist/killers.". But the deaths of at least 18 people in a new round of bombings/shootings in Baghdad, incl 13 who died in a lunchtime bombing of a popular restaurant, served as a marker of the uphill struggle that the [newest new-new] new govt faces to pull Iraq back from the brink of civil war. ... http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/21/world/worldspecial/22iraqcnd.html?hp&ex=1148270400&en=0ddb651273117699&ei=5094&partner=homepage

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.courant.com/news/opinion/commentary/hc-rennie0521.artmay21,0,3712857.column

Lieberman's In Trouble

Kevin Rennie
NOW YOU KNOW

May 21 2006

From the start of the Democratic state convention Friday night, there was something different from past gatherings of the faithful. Even U.S. Sen. Christopher J. Dodd, always a crowd favorite, could not work his usual magic with a speech nominating his senatorial colleague Joseph I. Lieberman for re-election. He sounded hackneyed compared to Annie Lamont's earnest seconding speech for her insurgent husband.

A Dodd tub-thumper on the virtues of being a Democrat is typically guaranteed to get the delegates in their seats and then on their feet. Not on Friday. His meandering address avoided getting to Lieberman until he had paid his respect to Democrats up and down the ballot and across the state. He even tipped his hat to challenger Ned Lamont. His nomination of Lieberman was more a tribute to diverse opinions in the party than a testimonial for Lieberman.

It fell flat but raised an essential question: Can Joe Lieberman win over Democrats by acknowledging the public's hostility to the war in Iraq but not altering his support for it? Friday night's balloting bodes ill for the humble but haughty strategy.

http://www.courant.com/news/opinion/commentary/hc-rennie0521.artmay21,0,1283529,print.column

Something to think about...

http://www.spychips.com/

WV, Spychips even in our jeans???
This gal will be fashionably frumpy in old duds i guess...nothing new there. This goes way beyond "Your papers, please"
Sigh.

Hey..speaking of murderous pipsquaks, remember how Nero has been compared to his drugginess? Well, last night was watching the National Geo channel and was too lazy to pick up the remote, so I watched the piece on Armageddon. You know how that 666 and 'the beast' has been the code for the anti christ? well, turns out that John, the original John the beloved disciple, was exciled to Patmos and got news of the goings on c. 70 bc with the lion sacrificies, etc....and he wote that who Revalations kicker chapter....scholars say to boost the moral of the early Christians...because he was talking about the fall of Rome! Not our times! AND, Nero Caesar 's name translated into Hebrew has the value of.....666. It was the code name for the troops to savor!

But 2000 years later, people have put imagination to work and made a new story out of old cloth.

I do think it funny that the security code for this post starts with 666!

i have been reading and pondering the many jewels left here. The personal comments about gender and the split of masuclinle/feminine i found especially rich, i thank all of you for such a sharing. For two days now my mind has been spiralling, swirling around some of these comments.

This is an area in my own life that does not seem to connect much with society. i think of myself as androgenous...sort of, really, simply human. i am aware that my famiy is very different, possibly because we had a very stong presence of "grandmothers" on the reservation and also among my Swedish immediate family. We lived quite isolated, no radio, or TV (of course) no religion, rare visits into town. My great aunts, the Swedish immigrants were brainy (early University of Washington grads also University of Gothenburg) but also very corageous and capable. One logged with her husband and when he was injured and crippled in a logging accident, she continued logging. Imagine that...this is before chainsaws, long 8-12 foot two handed felling saws were used for cutting down massive timber in the Pacific Northwest... Another aunt when she retired from teaching took a mule and treked the Cascade Crest Trail from Canada to Mexico- alone in the early '60s. No one thought any of this odd or masculine. These were jobs and choices not roles.

In my family we all learned to knit (brothers and well as me), and sew and chop wood no gender to jobs. The rule was if you see a job that needs doing, it's yours to do. When i moved into mainstream society imagine my shock. heh. I still don't quite understand. And i raised my son the same he knits and sews and is a mad-good welder.

Here is my "split" and i would welcome thoughts, if others have similar experience or insight. Judi G touched some on this.

When i was young the boundary between "my-self" and much of the world, but not all, around me was not perceivable. I was just deer with deer and cedar with cedar -an entwining, yet there was of course still the inner knowing of separation. The boundary i had to consciously learn. Have others experienced this i wonder?
Do you think it follows a pattern in astrology?

The old fashion illustrator in me just puked...I cannot believe this!

http://www.spychips.com/press-releases/levis-secret-testing.html

Do you have ANY IDEA how many pairs of Leyi's and Dockers I've drawn in my lifetime? geezuz. Probably more than any OTHER fashion illustrator in the world, that is for sure....I spent 25 years doing retail men's fashion, 80% of it probably from Levi's....

slime time!!!!! tomatoes due on Levi's Plaza, the fascist jerks.

Tseka....when I was 15, sophomore in high school, we studied the transcendentalist poets/writers...and I said....I AM A TRANSCENDENTALIST. (Tennyson, Whitman, etc) I knew it instantly and completely, that we were sensing the oneness of all life.

I do understand what you are saying and feel much the same way...you have a great gift as an artist and healer .... and remind me of The Last of the Mohicans!

Seriously....jm and I kind of defined where we are coming from (as defined in charts), the others talking of not being wanted for being a girl, or the gays with non acceptance of being the 'wrong' gender are all seeing the whole (hologram of our world from our own little pinpoint) and together we describe the whole thing...you contribute your vision now for all of us to see the common sense of it..

Just imagine you are at a place where you can actually view this hologram (and at Disneyland Anaheim, you can see holograms in the Haunted Castle) of all life, and just imagine that every single piece of life and rock and air etc. is being seen by every infintesimal point of light...and we are those points of light. It take s all of us to make the hologram....

goings on c. 70 bc ...that should be 70 AD not bc...on the NEro/666 post. the devil made me do it.

JudiGem,

664 & 668 -- neighbors of the Beast.

666A -- tenant of the Beast.

:-}

Barbara...indeed...hahahaha, you are too funny..!

Judi G, forgot to mention that, as I understand it, the "John" who wrote the wacky Book of Revelations (after living alone in a cave for I don't know how long) was a different and much later man than the John who was a follower of Jesus.

tseka, I too have been mulling the discussion threads on gender over the last few days. Now I'm wondering if my chart has any clues about my two spirit nature. Maybe when I have it drawn up again, I'll inquire of the astrologer. All I know is my sun, moon and ascendant, and that Saturn is the most significant planet in my chart, and its placement has a lot to do with power or lack thereof.

Your recollections about your grandmothers, and the chores that everyone took on regardless of gender, was esp. interesting. People assume that because my partner is older and physically larger than I am, that he holds the purse strings. On the contrary, I manage the money, and he spends it (but wisely, thank heavens!); he cooks, I clean. I do the laundry and the garden work, he handles many household repairs. It's kind of amusing to watch straight acquaintances try to figure out who's "in charge." I actually prefer to let him be the front man while I operate in the background... probably a result of my Scorpio nature.

Gosh, Joe,

If you know your sun, moon and ascendant you know enough to find all the details in your chart.

Do you have access to an astrology program or have you tried Astrodient?

Pretty much Judi, and beyond light, sound; the great rushing pulse of all vibration, and more than that, for that is only aa pinpoint of what is - as you say.
Last of the Mohicans??? really??? hmmmmmm

Or maybe just an early seed. The native Lushootseed word for this gift of being is "sian" =seed child. The query is -to conciously learn to become separate little human? an astro-signature perhaps or no?

Hi, I posted this earlier over at Starlight's blog and I thought I'd share it here too. I just can't believe these guys, just when you thought they couldn't get any slimier...

http://www.strike-the-root.com/61/herman/herman11.html
This is insane.

Barbara, thanks. I just ran a free Astrodienst chart for myself as I can't locate the one I had done 1 year ago. Saturn is all alone in my 8th house, at 19 degrees Gemini 12' 52" r. (does "r" stand for retrograde?). *Everything* else in the chart almost opposes Saturn. The only planet in direct opposition is Mercury.

Funny... I thought my ascendant was Gemini but it appears to be Libra. Maybe that's why I'm so interested in balance!

Joe: Astrodienst is one of my favorite sites just filled with good access to basic astrological info. You must have had your birthdate, time & place to have your chart done originally - and on the Astrodienst site, it's just fill in the blanks! By going to the the expanded chart selection, you can get transits, progressions, solar returns, and much more. I learned how to do charts about a gizillion years ago but math is not one of my strong points & I kept forgetting how to do it - plus you need the assorted reference books.

tseka: I too grew up in a situation where gender was a non issue as to who did what work. It was on a small family farm in eastern Washington, and since I had one younger brother & two sisters, we all worked hard. My younger sister, brother & I were milking three cows by hand, feeding calves, pigs, chickens, etc when we were 10 yrs & younger. We always had a big garden & helped put up vegies too. Plus all the hard physical labor involved in harvesting hay, grain & sweet corn - this was during the 1950's & 60's and we couldn't afford the big machines that do so much of that work now. Our good fortune was our parents were college grads and we were all expected to go to college - which we did. Until my brother was bigger than me, I could outrun him & was stronger. I always thought of myself as female (as opposed to feminine), now, as a crone, I feel very neutral & as you said, simply human. It's a good place to be.

Correction: my Asc is Scorpio. And Chiron is alone in my 6th house.

If anyone is interested, here are my details: 11 November 1972, Rochester, Minnesota USA

Now that I think of it, I'm probably the youngest one here. :o)

Haha... seems like the beings here who're not split are wondering if they should be split... or something like that.

Joanna, I guess the commonality i saw was the masking of our uniqueness. We all do it on some level. The gender schism could be felt as a split or being out-of-balance between anima anumus in the the physical, mental, emotional. And "one-ness" that connects outside "time" or "self" and needs masking to be operational as human feels just as incomplete. And i use incomplete instead of whole because to my mind to be complete is connected beyond "self". Perhaps feeling whole is when the masc/fem princiles are in harmony in oneself? Just random thoughts you all have stimulated. thank you.

Neith, Hej, sister from the eastside. From where do you hail? My cradle was on a Salish rez on Puget sound.

Has anyone her been following the astrology of the Enron trial? We've all been so caught up in Rovemania and GOP scandals that Enron the big daddy of corruption seems to be sliding under the radar.

Ohgosh, guys... Oregon rarely has thunder storms. If there is one, it's in the spring. There's a fabulous one taking place right now... out my magic window. I'm watching full play of lightning with some very fine split streaks. Sure is awesome & beautiful & spiritual.

Jung posited that one first takes back the Shadow, then one marries the inner contra-gender, then one comes into the Great Self. After all is said & done, the one is the One. In my experience, spirituality was taught as something apart from & special from my "regular" life... compartmentalized/split off. Then I became aware that spirituality is as common as eating b'fast or sneezing. And that's actually special & regular divine. I kid you not!

Oh wow... now here comes the HUGE rain!! No misty Chinese-painting THIS time.

JoannaO wrote: "seems like the beings here who're not split are wondering if they should be split... or something like that."

J dear -- wholeness is not about being split -- it is about knowing that one is whole -- both feminine and masculine -- in whatever expression suits one best -- creatively. Let's not get into a gender word war -- as spirit is ONE -- TWO & THREE... Is not the UNIVERSE -- Nothing -- AND THE REST IS LEFT TO OUR IMAGINATIONS?

tseka, your comments on gender and your history were wonderful. Thank you.

This topic seems to have extremely strong legs, so I can't help but think it carries a seed of information we are seeking.
I have always found the discovery of the opposite polarity within ourselves to be totally exciting. We are so multidimensional, as Judi indicated, so complex, and there is so much to discover in our inner landscapes. It's absolutely delightful to meet our unknown selves, I've discovered. Then to share them. It doesn't get any better than this.

Joe. I noticed your Mars, Venus, Uranus conjunction. Mars and Venus represent our gender and sexual expression in an immediate personal way. Uranus is electrical and about polarity and the opposite from the norm. It even rotates on its side while the others go up and down, except Pluto, which sometimes goes sideways I believe.
So when Uranus touches these planets, often the sexual expression is not the norm of the larger group. There is that androgenous outer planet charasteristic where the gender line becomes blurred. Uranus in conjunction with these points can manifest in many ways.... homosexuality and bisexuality, relationships with people way out of the ordinary and unlike the individual, a tendency to form instant intimacy and an equal tendency to break relationships suddenly, a high need for stimulation in partnership, mental included, a need for a long leash and mega freedom, and things like this. In my case, I have a Venus/Uranus conjunction and everyone said that me and my man were the most together/apart couple they'd ever known. An he was an oddball genius. No one in the world at all like him. Nowhere near.

All in all, a unique appraoch to personal relationship and a love of the odd and unpredictable.

Yes, Philo. The split exists for the ecstasy and creativity of reuniting. It's all in the cosmic game plan. Together, apart. When we do it within ourselves, man, the sparks do fly.

tseka: I was born in Seattle but grew up about 15 miles outside Ellensburg. It's a cenntenial farm & after about 25 years of wandering, I got married & now live back in the family house - full circle. Here's an odd astrological note: neither my husband nor I have any planets in earth signs (my MH is Virgo) but our composite chart is loaded w/Earth! I too knit - mostly with yarn I've spun myself. Spent a year in a weaving school in Finland. yes, sister of the westside indeed . . .

BTW

Astrologers often are Uranian types and if you ever go to an astrology meeting you will see the wildest bunch of eclectic thinkers imaginable, all with unique perspectives never to agree within this lifetime. It's fun.

Joe: OK, this is indeed strange. . . my neptune/moon/sun in Libra overlap your venus/uranus/mars, and your sun in conjunct my mars/mercury. So many connections in spirit among so many of the folks here! Does make one think, doesn't it?!

Yes M'Lady. Yes indeed. And Neith. A sun/Moon//Neptune in Libra? How gorgeous and graceful. Holy Catfish.

And Joe. This is a perfect example of your Venus/Uranus. A young feller like you hanging out with a bunch of old wizened crones! Entirely natural.

I ve gone through the play and it actually deserves a success as its a perfect combination of comic and tragic elements.

I object to that "old, wizened" stuff. ;O)

Victor, maybe that's what is happening in our real life drama but it takes an artist to point it out. One definition I heard of genius was an individual who is able to see the folly of the time.
That perfect combo is always there, I believe.

There is no one I've wanted to see deleted from the political scene more than Karl Rove. But I said good-by to him a while back and the rest is detail. The Social Security attempted scam was ridiculous but the end came from my perception with the Terry Schiavo spectacle. He once had influence, but I think it has been draining out steadily. He is part of a political style that has been going on a long time with this particular group and it's played out. It happens naturally. Even if he's traded for Cheney in this present drama, he's long diminished. I think he is far from a genius and is motivated far too much by his personal inadequecies.

As always, I try to see what lesson can be gained.
It's obvious that Rove is the embodiment of the shadow of both Capricorn and Cancer. The shadow of Cap is all about humiliation. The upside, the pride of dignity. He has humiliated so many with personal devastation, the Cancer shadow. He is a very sick and disturbed man and I can only conclude that he is the most personally bereft and humiliated of all.
Saturn in shadow can be brutal, relentlessly so, inflicting punishment way beyond the supposed crime.
But why was he powerful?
I've mentioned before my view that this first Pluto return for the USA is a big event. Right now we are in the ending part of the old cycle in preparation for the return and I think Rove has risen to get us ready. Pluto will try to deliver the hidden treasure of Capricorn but we have to experience the shadow first. Many people in this country are feeling the effects of the beatings and should ultimately be ready to stand up tall and realize the necessity for some maturity. This cowering under the whip has got to stop.

The '08 election cycle will be under the influence of the Pluto newly into Capricorn. Then on election day, the Moon will conjunct Jupiter in Cap and trine Saturn. There's no guarantee, but it is possible that the next president will have more of the good Capricorn traits. Perhaps an individual with dignity and self control, as well as a hard and serious worker. We'll see. Of course the hard lessons are ahead, but the end of the old cycle can be one of the most treacherous parts.

Another prelude to the Pluto in Cap is the vote I mentioned about no drilling in the coastal areas. The reason for this is because of the tourist industry that fought it vigorously. So as the corporations swallow everything in their path they will turn the corner and meet another monstrous corporation and the battle will really rage as they fight one another to the death. It is inevitable. We can watch the gladiators once again.

Oh, sorry J.O.

How 'bout "mature and wise guides".

Yeah, I like that.

Joanna, while I'm not sure of the etymology of the word "wizened," if you say it the way I do: wizened/wisened. :o)

jm, thanks for the interpretation of Uranus in my chart. I will save that as well. And as for hanging out with older people, I've always gotten along better with older people than I did with my own age cohort.

Neith, I'm sure there's a reason I'm here, so the overlaps, etc., are surprising and yet, not. :o)

They're comin' around! http://www.huffingtonpost.com/thenewswire/archive/ap/gopcan104.jpg

* Hundreds of Abramoff’s WH Emails To Be Made Public... http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=washingtonstory&sid=aqVyo4Z3w1Yk

BEATING HILLARY
By DICK MORRIS

May 21, 2006 -- CAN SHE BE STOPPED?: HILLARY CLINTON WILL BE THE NEXT PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES UNLESS . . . BY JOHN PODHORETZ CROWN FORUM, 272 PAGES, $26.95

WE seem to have a three-party system in America today: the Democrats, the Republicans and the Anti-Hillary. The party opposed to the former first lady is not united by ideology, party, race, ethnicity, religion, geography, wealth or educational level. It is composed of the enlightened many who believe her to be devoid, at once, of character, integrity and principle.

So we of the third party will welcome the bromide from New York Post columnist John Podhoretz's "Can She Be Stopped?" because it has a happy ending. Podhoretz assures us she can be. If the GOP nominates Rudy Giuliani and if the party doesn't rip itself apart over abortion and if Hillary's opponent can "smoke her out" on the issues and highlight her misguided health-care debacle. If, if, if.

http://www.nypost.com/php/pfriendly/print.php?url=http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/books/66300.htm

http://www.astrowisdom.com/thisnewmoon.htm

OR, perhaps Joanna you would like Eldris an old word from scandinavia? Feminine form of Elder.

The Eldris (also Eldi)in myth are the tree women who carry the light ~Elder and Alder, Birch etc. They carry memory and life-pulse into the earth and guard it through the darkest days. They were "married" to Raven ~transformer, in Salish myth.
Eldris is also old (woman) in the ancient icelandic
Eldris: keeper of wisdom / memory that connects "all-time". This word sounds like ealdris, sortof.
Personally i prefer Eldris to Crone. The image of birch standing tall in the harshest landcape and surviving pleases me greatly.

Tseka, JG, JO, Jm I love your ongoing conversation. It seems to be typical stories about how everone's genderless soul would manifest in this world in a balanced way given a chance. I see it as the result of many lifetimes learning, & experiencing whatever is possible so that you are very balanced and knowledgeable for these troubled times now!
My having Merc & Mars in Gemini as well as the Moon in Pisces, I've always been able to question the duality in people's actions and emotions. Including my own. (Busy mind always analizing. Well I do have Saturn in my 9th in Scorpio.) It wasn't until I took the advanced Silva Methods in Mental Dynamics and traded regressions with friends that I found out how sexuality and roles can vary over our many past lives. Interestingly, I spent some intense lifetimes as a homosexual man, even in the time of Atlantis! But what I remembered the most from that lifetime was my desire for the straight co-worker, and next to nothing about the underwater city we worked in. The biggest AHAA moment was the lifetime of 100,000 years ago as a hermaphrodite working near a pyramid. Believe me everyone else in the class was as shocked as I was when I said that, but it explains a lot of my confusion about my life. Also the Venus in Aries issues; coupled with the Jupiter 25, Uranus 24 Cancer, Pluto in Leo, I'm just a package of weirdness and damnwell happy about it! Look at my chart and see why I've had to raspberry my lips at my square family. 5-17-55 12:35am Miami Fl.
Thank Diety that you people are around and we can all discuss "wierd" subjects!

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