Bless You Sally for posting this so darn quick! I thought I'd have to wait until tomorrow to read your (or anyone else's) views on the Chart.

I enjoyed what you wrote. And I believe, looking at Kerry's 1996, I think, race against Gov. Weld which he won despite being dangerously low in the polls, that Kerry and Edwards will be able to successfuly skirt those landmines and perhaps plant a few of their own for the Bushes. Kerry's got a political lifetime of fighting dirty tricks and he's ready for whatever Bush/Cheney/Rove can throw at him. And I believe, taking into account Bush's delusional grandiosity and Cheney's arrogance, that they may have underestimated Kerry and Edwards.

Never screw with a Prosecutor. They know where the jugular is and are not afraid to go for it.

Again, wonderful article and I look forward to the many comments I'm certain will follow.

Jonathan

(okay, I think I'm finally done for the night) LOL

After watching Kerry's speech,I am truly optimistic and energized.

I am just wondering, however, after watching CNN's coverage,just how badly Time Warner wants Bush to win. I mean after months of complaing about Kerry's lack of passion, overemphasis on boring details, tendency to be overly pedantic, etc. media whores Judy Woodruff and Jeff Greenfield could not stop whining about Kerry's lack of specifics, his emphasis on self definition and creating and expressing a bold optimistic vision, rather than giving a laundry list of senate achievements and vote justifications.

You just cannot win with these people (unless you are W) but guess what, the American people WILL WIN when Bush gets his sorry ass thrown back to Crawford in the Fall! This was one of the truly great political speeches of all time.

Anyone want to run a chart on Time Warner? I'd use the one from a few years ago when America Online took over the company. I'm guessing there will be rough waters ahead for Bugs Bunny and friends.

It was one KICK ASS speach!!! I just hope that people stayed tuned to hear the pundits tear it apart while their memories were still fresh from the excellence. The media discredits itself too boldly.

Two of my favorite lines were:

:"Wouldn't it be nice to have a President who believes in science?"

"Let us humbly pray that we are on G+d's side."

Kerry difined himself and explained his plan.

Sally, I have been lurking here for a long time, and believe me, everytime I would post a long message, I would get a phone call and then my computer would freeze up and I would lose everything and get discouraged, oh my.....

So I don't post much. But I want to say how much I enjoy your astrological essays! John Kerry is 6 months younger than I am....I was born in June of 1943 (in Honolulu, and isn't Obama great?)....Vietnam was the defining issue (besides civil rights) for our generation. Now it has come home with Kerry....

Grizzly...I watch the CSPAN coverage...no talking heads at the corporate media outlets - I try to keep my blood pressure in check, hahahah. But I turned to the least offensive of the coverage, PBS just in time, at the end of the speech, to hear Repub star David Brooks saying that the Republicans had to go change their clothes because they were sweating SO badly over the last hour.....this was a homerun speech.

I am also reading Clinton's MY LIFE....and here is what he has said about being a "winner" Democrat ...

---------------------------------------------
page 368
(I just happened to have read it this morning: during the first campaign trail in 1991, BC got a phone call from Roger Porter, who worked for Bush in the WH. He knew Roger (in fact Clinton says he liked GHWB personally, although totally disagreed with how he was treating the country) from previous conferences on economics issues, and says Roger called to give him this heads up, thusly:
-------------------------------------------------
After five or ten minutes of what I thought was a serious conversation, Roger cut it off and got to the point. I'll never forget the first words of the message he had been designated to deliver: "Cut the crap, Governor. " he said "they" had reviewed all the potential candidates against the President.........
.............All the senators could be defeated by attacks on their voting records. But I was different. With a strong record in economic development, education, and crime, and a strong DLC message, I actually had a chance to win. So if I ran, they would have to destroy me personally. "Here's how Washington works, " he said. "The press has to have somebody in every election, and we're going to give them you." He went on to say the press were elitists who would believe any tales they were told about backwater Arkansas. "We'll spend whatever we have to spend to get whoever we have to get to say whatever they have to say to take you out. And we'll do it early."
------------------------------
I think that Kerry has made it VERY difficult for the Bushies to go negative on him now. Hence, the sweating!

Sally you are most excellent! Thank you so much!

Judi, what a wonderful passage to share. I hope you spread that far and wide, reminding everyone who we are dealing with.

sally said "And if GWB has one more scandal, one more problem, one more obfuscation that turns out badly for him, he is gone."

well, sally, this is truly inspirational. here is a menu of scancals, problems, and obfuscations over the next three months:

(1) we see the child abuse videos from iraq;
(2) either cheney is indited or named an unindited co-conspirator for plamegate; or any white house staffer is indited for this crime;
(3) the economy starts to drift or the europeans make a little mischief to hassle bush;
(4) haliburton;
(5) lay starts talking;
(6) someone shows the news video of colin powell handing over $50 million or soin foreign aid to the taliban government (around 3/01) for their great help in 'heroin eradication;'
(7) bush has a tantrum or a ron ziegler shoving incident with a staffer or civlian;
(8) our losses in iraq hit 1000 (god, i hope not but i think this is the figure of intolerance);
(9) an eco-disaster occurs in this country -- there are several overly poluted spots ready to blow;
(10) etc.

Sally, you said just 'one more'. Take your pick!

Great article. Quite amazing by any standards and all the more so considering the deadline.

Sally, you wrote:
Mars at 22 degrees Leo sextiles Kerry's Saturn, T Venus conjuncts Kerry's Saturn and sextiles T Mars setting up a yod with Chiron and tonight's Moon is moving toward that point of destiny.

An astrological question, Sally, how do you see "yods" operating? Will this be a frustration aspect for Kerry - and why shouldn't it be, as politics could be called the finger of G*d....all frustration, and then you are fingered - politics is winning OR losing, isn't it? And always after great effort....no wonder it takes people to be "born" to it...

oh...I asked about that particular yod because my daughter has the same planets...MC/Saturn in Taurus sextile Venus in Cancer and inconjuncting Mars in Aries....all in 8 degrees of the signs.

Oh...and because I am an artist, I often get visuals...and when I heard the "Help is on the way" thing, I suddendly saw Kerry and all the supporters marching with their "help is on the way" signs....and right next to him, Bush with "hell is on the way " signs....

oh dear, is that too harsh?

I was too young for JFK, but looking at John and John this evening, so youthful and dynamic (how could Bush & Cheney even compare) with their intelligent and lovely families - I could almost imagine how Americans must have hoped and dreamed back then - and could again.

Thanks Sally for sharing your wonderful insight-

We had a great rousing Kerry-Acceptance Speech House Party and then to read your newest article. . .I'm floating on air

"That spells a new leader for the Democrats, and a new leader for the nation as well".

"The acceptance speech and chart aside, on election day there are no disappointing aspects for Kerry/Edwards in their Natal Charts. Take heart from that".

Pat, I hope people copy that passage and spread it far and wide.

I have a really dear friend whom I went to Art Center in LA with -we have known each other since we were 18....she is tres intelligent and a wonderful writer now....and she said Clinton's escapades with Monica made her skin crawl, and that he is responsible for helping Gore lose, and that is why we are in Iraq and all those people have died. (OK...I sure as hell don't agree with ANY of that) Which sounds as if she has bought all the lies promulgated by the rightwing media. So I sent her that passage this morning. I then followed it up this evening with this second one:
page 406 of MY LIFE (It should have been called, MY EXPERIENCE IN POLITICS)...anyway, whether you agree with his take on this or not, this is HIS take on it, and I certainly understand it. It is obvious that Clinton is STILL angry and unrepentant, which I really admire him for. OOOPPPSSS, I think that means I have a character flaw...but who cares, I'll never be president in this life anyway....

(this was after the "did he inhale?" question and after Don Imus called him a "rednecked bozo" on air, just two of the problems he started having to face.
-----------------------------------------
Whether I had a character problem or not, I sure had a reputation problem , one I had been promised by the White House more than six months earlier. Because the President is both the head of state and the Chief Executive of the government, he is in a sense the embodiment of people's idea of America, so reputation is important. Presidents going back to George Washington and Thomas Jefferson have guarded their reputations jealously: Washington, from criticism of his expense accounts during the Reolutionary War; Jefferson, from stories about his weakness for women. Before he became President, Abraham Lincoln suffered from debilitating episodes of depression. Once he was unable to leave his house for a whole month. If he had had to run under modern conditions, we might have been deprived of our greatest President.

Jefferson even wrote about the obligation of a President's associates to protect his reputation at all costs: "When the accident of situation is to give us a place in history, for which nature had not prepared us by corresponding endowments, it is the duty of those about us carefully to veil from the public eye the weaknesses, and still more, the vices of our character." The veil had been ripped from my weaknesses and vices, both real and imagined. The public knew more about them than about my record, message, or whaterver virtues I might have. If my reputation was in tatters, I might not be able to be elected no matter how much people agreed with what I wanted to do, or how well they thought I might do it.

In the face of all the character attacks, I responded as I always did when my back was against the wall - I plowed on.........

Way past bedtime. Do a secondary progreasion of tonigh's acceptance chart to Nov 2, about 10 or 11 PM, EST, around that place a transit chart for Nov 2 at about 10 or 11 PM.

bob

Happy Blue moon for Saturday everyone!

I believe humanity is awakening. So many great speeches and upliftment for human hearts to strive forward. Why limit our choices as only between good and ego (evil) when we can make them between good and better. So yogic.

Thanks Sally for such a quick article, you are always so generous.

I am surrounding Kerry and Edwards with light for protection in my inner eye. The frightened fear mongering cabal might get really ugly.

I watched Lee Harvey Oswald shot before my very eyes live on TV when I was 8 yrs old. I had precognitive thoughts of the assasination occuring a few seconds before it actually did. It made me doubt my 'knowing' for a long time.

Judy: A yod is complicated and indicates the finger of destiny. They can work positively or negatively. I am counting on this one working positively for Kerry because the Venus leg was on his Saturn and the Acceptance Chart had the Mid-heaven in Capricorn. The Saturn at 19 degrees Cancer is at the reaction point and puts tonight's Moon and Saturn in a mutual reception.
The early degree Asc. in Aries indicates something new coming and Mars (Aries ruler) is another leg of the yod and on election day the transiting Moon will be in Cancer, the day ends with the Moon at 16 degrees Cancer.

These charts are rich with information and I didn't nearly cover it all, I was too anxious to get something up for everyone. But there are Mercury/Neptune aspects, his Natal Venus (ruler of his Mid-heaven and the US Mid-heaven sextiles tonight's mid-heaven, Uranus aspects his Venus, and Jupiter (ruler of his sun sign) is in an applying aspect (sextile) to tonight's Saturn. If Kerry ends up making it to the election he has a great chance, and if he doesn't John Edwards will carry it I think. Remember I am holding out judgement as to whether Bush or Kerry will run until Oct. 10. If they are both left standing after Oct. 10, then I am counting on a Kerry win.

bhakti, thanks for the comment on the oswald murder. i was about 12. it also took away my sense of 'knowing' and trust for a long time and i just figured out why (thanks to you). we were supposed to know he was about to die; it was a staged event; oswald was lead, fully exposed, to slaughter; and it made perfect visual sense, designed to fit the story line of concluding the slaughter of kennedy. at the last moment, it appears oswald realized this in a moment of rapid lucidity. we are headed for the last opportunity to correct this obscenity. i'm sure we wlil.

Mike what a great list and all so possible. I mean they are not out of the relm of possibility. I love it. Do you have a pick? I have one more I would like to add to the list and that is the "TRUE" story of 9/11 comes out. Keep the list Mike as the next few months unravel you might find you are prophetic.

I had a conversation with my candidate this evening after the speech ended. There is something truly sychronistic going on in this country. John Kerry's speech, indeed all the convention speeches, touched on issues that may as well be happening down the street. It's eerie how things that were touched on in the speeches, we've been adding those ideas to our campaign message all throughout the last week. Take the THK speech about women being called opinionated. My candidate added that concept to her stump speech at my request the day before THK spoke. Or take Kerry's comments about family values and valuing families. We started a word-of-mouth campaign on that issue last week. It's bizzarre how much overlap there is. And it's not from trying to coordinate our message either. My candidate says that sometimes the problems in small systems exist as a microcosm of the same problems in much larger systems. That phenomenon is clearly going on here. The problems Kerry talked about are both local and national.

I'm certain that candidates and their campaign managers are having this conversation all around the country. So did I think it was a good speech? Ummm yes.

Sally.....since I am not a professional and practicing astrologer, but only one who saw "patterns" and tried to explain it with a language that made some sense to me, alot of the complexity that you are able to explain I see as your talent...for complex issues! I await further complexities! Thanks for this....

This is also connected to the aspect of this hopeful and wonderful energy for the future being manifested now....I am always interested in my daughter's chart because, as Dave said above (wonderful insight into something I had noticed, too - Dave, that state of the art Democratic, fully paid for, headquarters has paid off....they are in real communication with every idea I have seen presented over the last 3 years) , there are a lot of synchronicities around gathering energies, as in the the JFK assassination, and the Oswald murder (and the consipiracies which still abound)...and my daughter was born Aug 10, 1969 in Hollywood. 2 weeks early, every woman who was almost full term gave birth that Sunday in LA....(a basalmic moon in Cancer)....my doctor delivered 4 women and 5 babies that day, all of us due in the next 2 weeks....why? Ask why Charles Manson chose that day and the previous day to unleash the evil of the murders of Sharon Tate and the LaBiancos (my daughter was born at the same time the LoBiancos were murdered, dawn on that Sunday, an innocent older couple chosen at random in the Hollywood Hills, and we had connections with half of the people murdered, including Sharon Tate ). And there was, according to my daughter's uncle, who is a lifelong Eckenkar member, "music in the spheres" when she was born...no retrograde planets, (but she has 3 "Yods")....that was a time of gathering energies, but they were so negative, and they ushered in more - the height of the Vietnam war. What has 9/11 ushered in?

btw, I had dreams before Indira Ghandi was assassinated....she was only a little younger than JFK. As for the Oswald murder....wow! You who "saw" it before hand at such a young age had an early consciousness opening (I've had that precognitive stuff so badly that I have had to go to bed for days before something actually happens). So Bhakti, I join you and I hope everyone will join and keep that protective energy around all the candidates and Edwards and Kerry.

A woman spiritual intuitive I worked with for years assured me when Bush was elected that it "would get worse"....perhaps so that we could see CLEARLY what the results of THAT would be, and lift our own collective consciousness?

It has been 29 years (that Saturn cycle) since the inception of the Plan for the New American Century and the neocons vision of THEIR dream for America....and to quote (in reference to a cycle finishing) what I heard someone say, cynically, quoting Malcom X, right after JFK was pronounced dead, " the chickens have come home to roost." Let's not forget that next year will be 42 years since that event . For people of my (Kerry's) generation, those years were the death of our idealism, with the assassinations of our hopeful leaders by those dark forces, and I haven't seen that hopeful energy (except for Clinton, and he was "assassinated" also) until this week with this convention. I cannot bear to conjecture this half cycle of Uranus when it is completed. I can only hope that those dark and malevolent forces will have been defeated.

Synchronicity = paradigm shift. We've shifted, Can't you feel the energy of the awakening? I started feeling hopeful right after the Venus Occulation of June 8.
Don't laugh, but I went through hell two years ago with my yoga community. Petty, negative, gossipy crap was thrown at me. This new regime of yoga leadership bullied it's way to the top and was causing division.I kept seeing the whole episode with me fighting back and telling them to shove it ( have alot of THK aspects in my chart) as parallel to our present gov't. The incompetance of the new leadership, the arrogance and spiritual pride. Those I acted strong with by not cowering to the bully tactics now treat me with respect and listen to my ideas. They know not to tread on me, near me or about me. I took time, took each one of the bully group individually and let it rip. I refused to be triangulated in group-think, even yogic rhetoric. I even challenged our resident Swami (he's cool) about the yogic rhetoric that people twist to suit their own personal greedy goals. I feel healed now that people are awakening, that we can see through lies, by not shutting up or down and calling BS for what it is. The PC attitude of 'too' nice is a drawback. In the Bagavhad Gita Arjuna must battle his own family ( a metaphor for the 'relations' he has with himself). Being alive for this part of our history on Earth (for me) is like renacting the great metaphor of Light over Dark. Our childhood memories healing and gathering the force of Unity towards ending the dark forces (lies, triangualting, distraction, greed, ignorance, shame, blame). It may not seem so, but I now trust myself to 'know'. It 'feels' so and I let my mind bow to my instincts.

As a reminder Pluto at 19 Sag is on Black Hole Ianna/Ereshkigal = regime change. Send the moving van to 1600.

Mike, that list is great. Bouche (the name Nostradomaus predicted) is toast.

the chickens are coming home to roost

http://www.drudgereport.com/dnc83.htm

ps The law of contradiction is how we learn in the relam of duality. Humans needed to have their free will taken away to appreciate it, to not get complacent. Big Daddy syndrome only causes even bigger babys and bigger dirty diapers. Time to clean oursleves and move on.

Judi, I thought your quote from Clinton's book aptly summed up this former Dean supporters take on his presidential run demise: "But I was different. With a strong record in economic development, education, and crime, and a strong DLC message, I actually had a chance to win. So if I ran, they would have to destroy me personally. "Here's how Washington works, " he said. "The press has to have somebody in every election, and we're going to give them you."
This very same scenario seems to have applied to Dean and he was 'given' to the press to demonize and destroy in my opinion.
Kerry delivered the final of several inspiring convention speeches to rouse dry bones(democratic party) and in essence started the revitalization necessary to take back the white house.

I must admit that I loved John Kerry's line about him being born in the West Wing of Fitzsimmons in Colorado.

Classic!

Jonathan

Michael Moore is right...we should challenge TV
station's license...make them report the news ALL
the news...stop the BS...

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/07/30/opinion/30krugman.html?pagewanted=print&position=

As an elective chart the time Kerry acepted the nomination is about as good as it gets the.The moon is always the key in an elective chart for success it must be in a good house and the first major aspect it makes should be harmonious and to a benifac. In the nomination aceptance chart the moon is in the house of worldly success and recognition. It is bright, expanding in light and the first aspect it makes is the tine to Jupiter.If iam not mistaken when bush accepts the nomination the first aspect the moon makes ishe opposition to Saturn so right there you have who is favored by providence and who is being shut down and blocked.
Furthermore the sun in this chart is in the house of political leadership(the fifth) and it being in cancer is disposed by this same well disposed moon that is going to the trine of Jupiter.. In the vedic chart for this time the trine is even stronger as the moon is in Jupieters sign of Sag. And when Jupiter casts a tight trine to a bright moon in its own sign sucess is assured especially if the moon rules a good house and is in a good house which it does its being in the tenth of worldy sucess and the h ruleing the fifth of polical leadership.
Belive me this was not easy folks. Had he made his acceptance with a void of course moon, or with it going to Saturn, or with an invalid ascedent, you could say right off his planned for campaign would fail.
I needed to see this as this is a branch of astrology that Iam familiar enough with that had he not gotton a good chart I would have been totally demoralized.As it is Iam jumping up and down and wanting to party all night and all day.
There is another consideration which by itself is enough to tell us who the winner will be and that is between now and the election In John Kerrys chart you have six planets riseing toward the midheaven of Kerrys chart ie Sun, Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn.When planets are risiing in the visible sky towards the midheaven ones ambitions and projects reach fullfillment.This is defnetly the case with Kerry and Jupiter and Venus the two major benifacs reach his midheaven right at the time of the election.
In Bush's case these same six planets are descending towards the nadar of of his chart the place were things end and become dead and buried once and for all.Who he is dissappears who Kerry is is made visibly manifest to the world at large.
In astrology it sometimes pay to keep it simple and I think any experienced astrologer would spot this right off and see Kerry as the likly winner and then go to more refined techniques for confirmation.This Nancy has alrealdy done for us and what I point out here is just further confirmation of what I think is a very accurate analysis on her part.
In Kerrys Hindu chart his second house, the house of speech is very strong with Jupiter aspecting Mercury in Jupiters own sign of Sag. from his tenth house of carrere success.I had been looking for him to make a great speech as he hs done in the past as far back as 1965 and last night as all of us now know he did not dissapoint.
Enjoy.... this is a great moment for all of us as he has shown that when the moment that was clearly his destiny he showed up and more than fulfilled the calling that has been given him.
Every 72 years so far in our nations history we have great president. So take a close look at him. The 72 cycle since the last great president was elected is due this fall 72 years since roosevlet was elected IN 1932.I think we are now seeing a preview of the next "Great" president in our nations history.

Dream on.

Here is the link to the Esquire article. Ron Reagan is "Krugman good".

http://www.esquire.com/features/articles/2004/040729_mfe_reagan_1.html

My heart is so full! After what has seemed like almost four years of an unrelenting triple Saturn transit (that's what it has FELT like, anyway), hope is back and I predict great amounts of champagne and wet Kleenex from tears of stratospheric joy on November 2nd!

I think we should all print out that list of Mike's and WILL that the truth of all of Chimp's trangressions come into the searing light before Champagne Day!

I was not addressing Chas whith the dream on comment. Enough said I guess.

First of all Joe, you don't stoop low for stars. The Universe just doesn't work that way. Stars are in the heavens above and as above, so below. Secondly, Liberals are not desparate. No one on this site is desparate. We share and express ideas, most of which are based on astrological symbolism. That is all.

I happen to disagree with your take on W. Bush's energies. We will see. I am especially interested in how those energies will play out during the debates, where we can finally see Bush/Kerry play out, one on one.

PS, Thank you Sally and Chas for the wonderful analysis. Would the day that W. Bush be accepting his party's nomination be this coming Sept 2?

Sally and Chas, thanks so much.

I just cannot, for the life of me, understand how anyone can support this man after all the lies, scandals and harm he has brought to this country. Read Ron Reagan's article in Esquire, posted above. It saddens me deeply to think that this country may be subjected to another four years of this atrocious plundering just because a group of people are hell-bent on not losing face. Because they just don't want to see the truth and admit that they misjudged and voted for a man who has turned out to be the worst thing that has ever happened to this country. OPEN YOUR EYES.

Greg Palast reacts to the candidate....

http://www.gregpalast.com/printerfriendly.cfm?artid=353

Jo

We are anxiously awaiting your take on the
convention, candidates, speeches, etc.

Come out of the garden.

Your sagacity is eagerly awaited.....

"The biggest load of crock?" You even sound like Bush.

Dear Joe, I find your fears and concerns about astrology to be interesting and I can understand why someone who doesn't know anything about astrology might fear it. I also understand how much you want "your guy" GWB to win and I do know when our ego is attached to a specific candidate
it's hard and even anger producing to have anyone point out that "the race" may not be over. People on this site have the same hopes for Kerry.

Astrology is like the weather report if there is a storm coming and it's going to be over "me" it doesnt' matter whether I am prepared or want it to come, it's going to come anyway. It might help you if you studied just a little more about mundane (events) astrology.

GWB has not given his acceptance speech as yet and the energies of that speech will be evaluated just as Kerry's energies were evaluated, as those energies relate to the election and the US.

It isn't the intent of this site to prove or disprove astrology or to teach astrology, for you to be able to get the most out of the site or to even to be able address the issues you need some type of understanding of the subject, so I can easily see why you are frustrated.

Oh as a post-script Joe, perhaps you don't mean it to be so, but your posts sound a great deal like "baiting" others into an argument and I am sorry but "baiting" isn't allowed on this site because it becomes just too ugly. So if the angry
rehortic continues I will have to delete your posts.

If you have a different astrological perspective please feel free to post.

Joe, astrology was not wrong in 2000. Al Gore did win.

Joe, you're an obvious baiter. No matter what anyone says to you you will argue it just to bait.

You are no longer credible and I will not reply to you. I hope you move on into a better place of learning where you can grow rather than stunt yourself.

Joe: First and foremost, Bush's transiting Saturn is in his 12th house and approaching his ASC. - 1st house. During this process SATURN will be RESTRUCTURING BUSH'S inner life, hopefully putting him in touch with who he really is. It will be almost impossible for Bush to have any kind of OUTER success or accomplishment due to the symoblogy of this process. His focus in life will be centered on his innermost self. Even if Bush were to be re-elected, he will not achieve any outer success and will feel completely burdened by the office of the Presidency. Astrology, planets, do not cause events -- they corrolate to events. Regardless of what other positive astrologly transits Bush may be currently under, his Saturn going under the horizon for the next 14 years is to me the primary issue concerning his near term success, achievement, or accomplishment in political realms. There will be NONE. He can heed the call to restructure his inner workings, which are sorely needed, and Saturn is teaching, but it is up to him.

Freeper Joe,
Bush told us he was the 'Leave No Child Behind' pResident. What he said and what he does are not connecting. His 'actions' say "leave all the children behind". I am in the educational field, a visiting author. I meet thousands of young students each year. So if that bumbling (how refreshing to hear Kerry's intelligence instead of uh-uh-) creep gets back in, you got me to fear. I will be in there teaching children to reject that lowlife conciousness of separation and division. Liking Bush shows me character traits of non compassion, a shallow pond that reflects off the top with no depth and just plain nasty.
So listen or stream into Air America Radio and hear BOTH sides because your one -sided script is old and tired and we see through it.

Kerry's acceptance of the nomination at 10:22pm, gives an Asc degree between 4-5 Aries, a 5 degree sabian symbol. Rudhyar's interpretation of that degree is:

ARIES 5 A Triangle with wings
This is the symbol of the desire to reach a higher level of existence, of pure aspiration or devotion, of bhakti. What has emerged...is coming aware of the possibility of further up-reachings. The principle of levitation is seen as one of the two essential factors in evolution.
The emergent being glorifies and deifies it, but it is still only an ideal. At this stage, nevertheless, the whole being experiences a childlike longing for its eventual realization. At this point...a new dimension of being is envisioned mobilizing creative endeavors.***

Works for me.

Joe: I am not using any coordinates. My feeling, and belief in this matter is based on where transiting Saturn is right now. Approaching a return to the Natal Saturn in the 12th house in Cancer. Further, Joe, I feel no need or reason to verify, nothing is correct or incorrect. Saturn is where it is at, which is not debateable. We are as human beings, connected to the Whole of the Universe and therefore, subject to the ebb and flow of universal cycles inherent in the Universe. Astrology speaks to the Universal archetypes as depicted by the chararistics displayed by the planets. I also agree that individuals can rise above the potentials inherent in the birthchart, however, to me this requires a tremendous, continueous amount of work on oneself. I do not believe, based on my study of Mr. Bush, that he has evolved his consciousness, has become
individuated, nor has any understanding of such matters. An evolved consciousness seeks the Highest Good For All, not just for a few, in all matters. This is all I have to say on this matter.

And from William Saletan at Slate
http://www.slate.com/Default.aspx?id=2104539&

***The theory behind Bush's hard-line style of governance came from his chief political adviser, Karl Rove. Rove believed that Bush lost the popular vote in 2000 because millions of conservatives stayed home. He believed that Bush's father lost the 1992 election by alienating the right and creating a Republican primary challenge by Pat Buchanan. So, on issue after issue, the current President Bush has played to his base. On Rove's theory, every step to the right earns Bush another conservative vote.

That calculation is correct. But it's only half the story. For every conservative voter who's inspired to turn out for Bush because of his unyielding conservatism, there's a liberal voter who's inspired to turn out for Kerry. That's why Kerry has had no trouble uniting his party after the primaries. It's why the FleetCenter exploded tonight at every one of Kerry's applause lines. And it's why Kerry can now move aggressively to the middle without fear of losing the left.

In his determination to unite the right, Bush hasn't just united the left. He has lost the center. Look at last week's New York Times/CBS News poll of registered voters. "Do you think the result of the war with Iraq was worth the loss of American life and other costs of attacking Iraq or not?" Fifty-nine percent say it was not. "Which do you think is a better way to improve the national economy—cutting taxes or reducing the federal budget deficit?" Fifty-eight percent say reducing the deficit. "When it comes to regulating the environmental and safety practices of business, do you think the federal government is doing enough, should it do more, or should it do less?" Fifty-nine percent say more.

One more Bush voter on the right, balanced by one more Kerry voter on the left, plus the tilting of one more voter in the middle toward Kerry, is a net loss for the president. That's the lesson of this administration, this election, and this convention. Kerry doesn't have to write any good lines. He just has to read them.***

...worth a read, and consideration....

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article6557.htm

Till now, wondering that a repug/con like joe hasn't shown up here to denfend other cons like
shrub,cheny,rummy,cunty etc. COWARDS like shrub, cheny,rummy talk so much about patriotism but when
their turn came to defend the country all three like other cons like quayle,speaker hatchet etc. all opted out for other PATRIOTS like KERRY, Max Cleland to defend our country.These cons, if they
have an iota of brain at all, must know actions speak LOUDER than all the bulls' words from shrub,cheny,rummy etc. So less these cons talk at
all, the better unless citizens get brainwashed by these cons' cock and bull garbage. Astrologically, shrub is doomed, come Nov.2004, watch it joe freeper.

Joe,
I'm going to skip over your posts.
From here on you're talking to yourself until the sorry tape plays out.

BTW. I'm an Author. I am all over the world. And I will be sticking my nose out way long. Can't stop me.

For your info, joe, cons are conservatives and repugs is self explantory as repugnants who are republicans, as usual a tyro repug-con would not know with neagtive IQs like the shrub, quayle etc.
Can't defend the neocons patriotic with all the verbose belching from them day in and day out!

Yes, I think bhatki is correct and we should just ignore ol' hard-on Joe. He'll move along and try to get satisfaction elsewhere.

WV,

When you ask the universe for something, you must be specific! Ask for "Jo" and specify the form! or, you get a freeper. ANYONE who defends a political position by referring to his candidate as a 'great man' is simply not debating... but emotionally reacting. The political issues are debated on a multitude of websites. It is narrow minded of someone to negate the discussion of others because it is not done in the manner they choose...

WV, the 'garden' I am involved in at present is 'kindergarten' --- this is the last week of summer for the grandchildren, and we just got my Dad moved from Charleston to here... so, to say the month of July was busy would be an understatement.

I watched and listened to Kerry last night... I thought he was strong, he touched on many points some in the Democratic party have wanted addressed, he stood tall, smiled warmly, used his hands in an ever 'open' manner --- embracing many times... his words were about UNITY, not separation... this country is in desperate need of healing... he is the man for that job. The entire week went well, although uncovered by networks... so many 'swing voters' probably didn't see it... not everyone has cable... in fact, many people cannot afford full cable if they have it all... not everyone has computers either... but the blogs have been highly instrumental in getting the POV of the progressives and the democrats out to the Demo candidate... Kerry seemed to address questions posed by the blogs and embrace the positions held by many of the posters. In reviewing comments on KOS late last night, there were high marks every where for Kerry... and the pundits, whores that they are, had to at least give him good marks...

A candidate's speech won't win the election, but it will either motivate his party or leave them limp with disappointment. Kerry seized the party for his own last night (imho)... that is important, with the overriding hope being that he did have some swing voters watching... if they watched, they had to be attracted... what's not to like when the issues most of us are dealing with daily are addressed head-on: backdoor draft of Reserve and Nat'l Guard, 'lack of support' for our troops with decrease in budget for their VA benefits as well as medical care when they return wounded; an unnecessary war! [sorry, Joe, this pResident did not respond adequately after the fact or before, imho... Afghanistan nor Iraq had anything to do with 9/11! His response was 'sabre rattling' and jingoism --- typical of a weak leader with no real exit strategy or goal!] I could go on and on, Medicare, education, etc., the outsourcing of jobs... heck John Q. Public knows how hard his pocketbook has been hit every time he stops for gas or takes his child to the doctor, forget the dentist... who's getting braces these days!

You're right Beverly, Saturn is visiting Dubya and finding him unprepared, his structure and form lacking for the 'house' he has built... 'nough said...

BLUE, Joanna, I see oceans of BLUE, everywhere, edged with purple, interspersed, with purple, unity and BLUE... because that's what I choose to see! I WILL not draw a victory for the other side to me. Period.

John Kerry said last night that it is now up to us, the people. Well, some of us will be behind him, and some of us will be in front showing him the way, and some --- like bhakti, with her Pallas Athena in full gear --- will be SHOVING the freepers out of the way. Some will even be soaring overhead painting their visions for Kerry and all to see... We WILL prevail... because we have to... we cannot allow the destruction of this great country to continue... the terrorists created the events of 9/11... the Bush Admin has created the subsequent mess in the demise of our freedoms and liberties and the huge deficit that our grandchildren will inherit. Response to the terrorists? Bush gets a "F" from me. As a leader, Bush gets a "F" from me. Time for regime change at home and Kerry proved last night that we can go to the polls in favor of our candidate, not simply against theirs. The universe has delivered. Kerry has delivered. The people will deliver on November 2nd. The moving vans will deliver Dubya to Crawford. Go BLUE...

Namaste

Flip : Leave no child behind
Flop: Leave all children behind

Flip:I'm the War President
Flop:I'm the Peace President

Flip: It's Patriotic to defend our troops
Flop: Cut vet benefits, backdoor draft,
lousy pay, lack of equipment and body armor

Flip: Kenny Boy
Flop: Never heard of him

Joe, go freep elsewhere. This site doesn't need your kind of 'fair and balanced' viewpoint.

But it was very leagal for shrub to send other peoples' kids to die for an illegal war and commit
war crimes galore with out himself go and fight
for the country in Vietnam when it was his, cheny's, rummy's hatchet's time. You can't defend
this even with a 1000 page verbose, joe and why you want that to be answered by some Insanity or
faso liar limbaugh's web site by directing to check other web sites?

Joe, I don't know where you are an educator but I recently was hired to do a study of Jr. High, High School and Community College around the US regarding their needs and how best the National umbrella association who hired me, could assist them. I did not hear one educator in one city or one state or one level of education say anything positive about the "no child left behind." And that wasn't even one of my questions, indeed not even one of the concerns of the organization requesting the study. Nonetheless I received an earful about the cuts, the lack of assistance from the National Level, the "promises" vs the "reality" Budgets being cut, teachers laid off, increased class sizes with reduced resources and the list goes on.

This isn't a left or right issue Joe, what is happening in the country is an American issue. Of course there will be tons of people vote for GWB, that doesn't make him a good president on foreign policy, or the environment, health care, education, or homeland security. How many "experts" do we need in all these areas to tell us we are on the wrong track before people listen. George Bush is not an expert in any of these areas by his own admission. People who have worked decades in their fields including many conservatives are shocked and concerned over this administration. Do you believe they don't know what they are talking about and this inexperienced administration does? How good can a President be if he won't listen to the advice of experts and keeps his focus narrow.

How can he bill himself a "war president" one week and a "peace president" the next. This country has been going through massive changes and will continue to do so because the world is changing rapidly, how can I possibly vote for someone who takes a stand and is so inflexible that he cannot make adjustments when new information or situations come along. That is insanity.

Pat Buchanan (an arch conservative) said no matter who wins this election there is a divisive fight coming for the Republicans and he didn't know if they could hold it together for the election, they are very upset over the Bush administrations policies and attitudes toward this country, this constitution, this congress (and his party controls congress)They are angry over the wonton spending and budget deficits. It has to change, this country has fallen into dire economic straits since he took office. We have basically thrown those children and their children you say you teach to a mortgaged future.

You seem hurt that the "left" is critical of "this poor man in the White House." You don't seem bothered by the dirty tricks "this poor man" plays on others or his unconcern about the future of this nation, including you. It isn't just the "left" being critical, not anymore, there are many conservatives speaking up and being "critical," and I am one of those conservatives. You're afraid Joe, I am too but when people are afraid we have a tendency to give our power and common sense over to others without even thinking what we are doing, just like Germany did with Adolph Hitler and dissent was squeezed out of the country. Do we want that here?

Flip: Rule of Law
Flop: Destroy the Constitution

Flip: Pro Life
Flop: Texecutioner

Flip: Pro Life
Flop: Veto Stem Cell Research

Flip: No Big Gov't
Flop: Enron. Halliburton

Flip: Return Dignity to The White House after Clinton
Flop: 'Go Fuck yourself' - Dick Cheney on the Senate Floor to a Senator.

There's nothing sadder than a troll.

Ignore 'im, everyone.
~D

This wonderful list was posted by "Snippy"over on DU just a few days ago.

Bush says he fell off his bicycle because of the heavy rains and he watched on television on the morning of 9/11 as the first plane hit the first WTC tower and John McCain has an illegitimate Negro daughter and Bush would veto McCain-Feingold and the yawning boy was not there and was not yawning and besides he was standing some place else and Richard Clarke had complete access to Bush and Rice which proves that Clarke was out of the loop which is Clinton's fault but the White House revealed that Clarke briefed the press on background about Bush fighting terrorism which means that unnamed White House sources may not be identified even when Bush wants to and everyone except Bush himself knows where he was during his National Guard service but it was Clinton's fault that Bush did not show up for duty which was after Bush volunteered to go to Viet Nam but before he was no longer required to take a flight physical and about the same time that God ordered him to smite Saddam because the 70 lines of embryonic stem cells and more arsenic in the water and more mercury in the air prove that republican science is better than sound science and the Bush administration did not illegally conspire to illegally reveal the identity of a covert CIA operative which resulted in 2 million new jobs being created because democrats support terrorism and are not good Americans just as the Jews were not good Germans which is why Bush said he would veto the creation of both the Department of Homeland Security and the 9/11 Commission but now claims credit for their creation and the White House is cooperating with the 9/11 Commission which is why the White House withheld documents and called the republicans on the Commission before Clarke testified and why the White House is not coordinating the attacks on the integrity and bipartisanship of the Commission and why Bush and Cheney negotiated with the Commission that the two of them would testfy one time only but never again since the dental xrays prove that Bush spoke with the CIA director everyday and did not ignore either the repeated warnings of the dangers of al Qaeda and Osama or the August 2001 intelligence briefing specifically warning of the upcoming 9/11 attacks because the United States is a nation with a mission and that mission is to bring freedom to every single person in the world which will cut the deficit in half if you do not count those parts of the deficit which will increase under Bush which is Clinton's fault but the boxes from China were labeled "Made in USA" which resulted in 2.6 million new jobs being created even though the $400 billion Medicare prescription drug decorative turkey was not labeled $550 billion and was passed without bribery or criminal deception and was not criminally promoted by the Bush administration using taxpayers' money for propaganda purposes which proves that government spending under Bush has gone down if you do not count the increased government spending under Bush which is Clinton's fault just as acts of terrorism have decreased since 9/11 if you do not count the increase in the number of acts of terrorism and Bush's plane to Baghdad was spotted because before Saddam bought the uranium and became an "urgent" but not an imminent threat which is Clinton's fault Bush had no plans on his desk to invade Iraq since the invasion was not planned before Bush took office even though it was the subject of his first national security council meeting in February 2001 and in December 2001 when plans for the invasion were being finalized Bush said he was focused on the military operations in Afghanistan and then the Carrier Costume Party was too far offshore for the Navy to make a large enough "Mission Accomplished" banner to describe the WMD we have found in Iraq some of which Saddam was giving to Osama for following Saddam's plans and using Iraqi hijackers on 9/11 which is Clinton's fault but everyone who pays income taxes got a tax cut which created 3 million new jobs and allowed Iraqi oil revenue to pay for the cost of the reconstruction of Iraq after the invasion by a small number of troops who would be greeted with floral program related activities except for the dead and wounded troops who are being brought home secretly which is Clinton's fault since Bush is the one who hugs the mothers and the widows and the wives and the kids and since Bush does not watch television news he did not know about the republican torture pranks occurring in Iraq until he saw the pictures while watching television news and that is why Bush who will use the jawbone of an ass to force OPEC to open the spigots and who is responsible for good economic numbers but not bad economic numbers which are Clinton's fault wrote the poem that he did not write blaming Laura for dropping the dog.

a warning worth considering....

http://electroniciraq.net/news/printer1570.shtml

I've just finished reading todays postings. I have always enjoyed lurking and occassionally posting and what a disappointment to see that someone like "Joe" has brought his/her baiting to the site. It's apparent he/she just wants to argue. . .period. . .Really, what productive dialogue results in responding to such an inflexible, argumentative, confrontational individual. . ."Can we just ignore "Joe"!

Thankye Kap. One has to wonder which is sadder, political astrologers or the one screaming at the political astrologers.
Namaste~
~D

I'm with you KAP. Right now this site is highjacked. Let's get on with astrology and visualizing lots of Blue.

$445 BILLION Deficit?????????!!!!!!!!!!

Even after he inherited a huge huge surplus!!

Bush has created big doo doo for the grandkids. We'll be suffering for years.

John Kerry is scheduled to leave from Muskegon, MI on Monday (about 5 miles from me) via our car ferry to Milwaukee. I hope to see him, but the details of whether or not he will stop to speak have not been finalized. I hope he does. I would love to cheer him on.

Boy has this site been freeped. Kerry must be doing way better than even any of us thought!

Jo: Thanks for the Kos link to Senate and House.

"Jo"

Wisdom and Truth flows through you veins.

Thanks you for your take on things.

You can be my Grandmother anytime - but
methinks I am a wee bit older than you.

The co-ordinates of shrub is all skewed and screwed up, joe.The whole world knows that in the last 4 years and it is time for this imbecile to
be tried for war crimes and put along side with
saddam, milosevic etc in an abu ghraib house for life.

No, there are no legal requirements-but a national leader in a world economy, and at the head of the world's greatest military needs to be deeply prepared and deeply ready to steer the ship of state. Would you put a new driver behind the wheel of a custom racecar? A new pilot to fly the Space Shuttle? An intern to do brain surgery? So it is with the United States: too damn big and powerful for amateurs to fly and lead. All of the great Presidents: George Washington, Lincoln, Jefferson, Clinton, JFK, Adams, even Wilson and FDR were men who valued learning and spent countless years studying their country, the world, and politics before taking on the White House. Truman was a Classisist who could talk about Ovid and the Founding Fathers with comsummate ease. And these men were President when technology, international relations, and social relations were far less complicated than they are now. Your idol spent years diving into a bottle and hoovering up cocaine, and God knows what else instead of reading books and studying politics under even conservative masters like Reagan. He hates being President so much that he runs from his job whenever possible. All of the greats loved their job, and yearned to do great things with the power they posessed. They had to be dragged away from their desks when a crisis or a challenge occurred.

Why is Shrub running? He needs to prove to his daddy/mommy that he's not a failure, that he can do better. What man who loves his father would say that he doesn't get advice from Dad, a former President, but from a "higher Father" who won't criticize him or tell him no?

I thought the cons(ervatives) don't believe in astrology except the ronnie reagans, because GOD
told them to be so.

Sally,
I hope that you do NOT delete this man's info just yet, I want to read the script (but getting tired of so much of it) it clues me into what the old/new spin is so I do not get caught up in it. Thanks.

BREAKING: Hundreds of Millions Missing in Iraq
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/international/AP-Iraq-Audit.html

Joe, the world has seen enough of Shrub to know that he is incompetent and childish, and does not deserve another term at the helm of the greatest country in the world. No amount of polishing can hide the fact that he is a lifelong failure who has once again failed abysmally. He is inarticulate, undiplomatic, ignorant. And our paymasters in China and Europe are waiting to see if we have the courage to toss his ass before they start calling in their loans.

" ...work on becoming better listeners rather than putting themselves on pedestals and refusing to hear a different point of view".

OMG Joe, that's the prayer I send out to GWB and his administration every day!!!

Sally, Isabelle ---
Thank you both so much for the really fine last three articles...

Isabelle, your comments on THK and her charts are music to my ears! Our country needs more strong women as role models, and I am looking forward to having an opinionated female in the White House again! Hopefully it will not be much longer (it's already been too long!) before we see one in the top position of leadership...

Sally, the convention turned out to be wonderful and your analyses right on target. Can't imagine how you managed to turn out two wonderful articles so quickly and so timely, but as usual you did so in a fine and authentic manner. Your handling of the freeping is a model of politeness. You are very kind to provide this forum and most of us attempt to remember our manners when using the broadband. After all, we are guests... this is not "McDonald's" where you throw your money down and supersize your order! You are indeed a kind host, and I thank you for all the information and wonderful articles as well as the other authors you bring to the board.

Very few of us would feel okay about wandering into a church or synagogue and standing and arguing with the folks present as to how they express themselves. But apparently in cyberspace some feel free to barge in any open door and argue and disrupt a thread of thought. I'm of an older generation, but even today I believe that is
considered rude by most.

Joe, you will make no converts here... for, indeed we are biased against your POV. And while I would not suggest to you that you not express yourself, I will suggest that you not be so rude as to feel you have to address every post --- if your ego has that great a need, try spreading your views around --- there are plenty of forums in cyberspace.

Namaste

I won't delete, I think he may be lonely and there is nothing wrong with a different opinion and he/she hasn't reached being rude or crude, just expressing what he thinks. Mundane astrology is the study of one person's energy upon the energy of events (or visa/versa) The entire collective country is going through a transformation (never easy) and when transformation comes our inclination is to hang onto the old way of doing things. The reason the war in Iraq is sooooo bad and not working out (neither is the Afghan war but we don't hear about that in this country) is "war" is an old response to events and Bush is doing the "old response to nearly everything," Bush has a Sun right on the US Sun tieing into the collective, when WE shift our understanding of the consequences of our responses to others and ourselves, then the President or leaders will be shifted.

I listened to Barak Obama and his "one America" and unifying message and people saying his message was the new face of politics, as was Teresa Heinz Kerry's message about women being accepted as smart and well-informed, and if this is the new face of politics it is a very hopeful sign. It is past time for us (America) to be unified and demand honest answers from those who work for us, instead of us fighting each other.

Interesting article (with more to come, apparently) on Smirky's lawyer:

http://www.legalunderground.com/2004/06/presidents_lawy.html

WV,
Thank you for your kind words. You may be older by a few years, but I believe you have a truly old soul... mine is still young, though I no longer am... but I'm dancing as fast as I can, and chopping enough wood and carrying enough water for several lifetimes... maybe the next one will be filled with leisure! LOL!

Namaste, Jo

Jo, thank you so much for your kind words especially since I literally threw last night's article together. You know Jo, my last name is McDonald so this is "McDonald's" site and I so appreciate everyone's attitude and appreciation to this site and those who post here, you too Joe, just be polite to others and no obscenity.

Joe,
My name is NOT namaste. My name is JO... namaste is a word that translates into:

It starts with a mental submission. This submission is in the spirit of total surrender of the self. This is parallel to the devotion one expresses before a chosen deity, also known as bhakti. The devotee who thus venerates with complete self-surrender is believed to partake the merits or qualities of the person or deity before whom he performs this submission. There is a prescription in the ancient texts known as Agamas that the worshipper of a deity must first become divine himself, for otherwise worship as a transaction would become invalid. A transaction can only be between equals, between individuals who share some details in common. Hence by performing namaste before an individual we recognize the divine spark in him. Further by facilitating our partaking of these divine qualities, namaste makes us aware of these very characteristics residing within our own selves. Simply put, namaste intimates the following:

'The God in me greets the God in you
The Spirit in me meets the same Spirit in you'

In other words, it recognizes the equality of all, and pays honor to the sacredness of all.

Namaste, Jo

Joe, I can judge the results for myself. I don't claim to be President, nor do I want to be one. America has not fared well under Shrub, and does not need him. Like my guy, Dean, "we can do better", and we will do better-starting with Kerry/Edwards.

Joe (and probably others may come) are here because the predictions of Shrub's uraveling are bearing out. If we were wrong, they would let us pontificate in peace-and with a shrug.

Why are they stubbornly clinging to Shrub despite all of the evidence that he simply is lacking as a President? A theory that I have had is that we are dealing with a stubborn macho cult. Shrub somehow connects with their sense of manhood without threatening them with competence-he is really like them-inept and unable to think deeply and with power. They need him in power to validate that. A real President-Kerry, Gore, Clinton, (Dean someday) makes them feel inadequate-they are successiful, intelligent, loved by the ladies, and have many friends. Your normal couch potato male feels inadequate in comparison to that.

http://images.ucomics.com/comics/po/2004/po040728.gif

Joe,

"it is obvious I have to write 10x as much to get my view point heard. So I guess if that bothers you, you could choose not to read it or go to another site."

If you will 'listen' to other posters, they are telling you they oppose your point of view.

Point is, this is a small website, and you are taking up alot of broadband... why?

Namaste

Wow! The LA Times has one whopper of an article. Truthout has posted it, so you won't have to go through the hassle of signing up with the LAT:

http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/072904L.shtml

Losing America: Confronting a Reckless and Arrogant Presidency by Senator Robert C. Byrd

Get Yours Today:
http://www.buzzflash.com/premiums/04/07/pre04033.html

A ringing call to action by one of the country's longest serving and most respected legislators.

Now is the time to regain the Constitution, to return to the values and processes that made America great. Byrd does not shrink from speaking the truth to an ever more aggressive and imperial White House.

Ahhh, joe uses that liberal word as so many of the cons-repugs, who cna't debate and win when I
criticize those cowards against their phony patriotism, then he directs me to other websites like insanity's or fatso liar limbaugh's.If you can debate those crooked skewed cowards, debate properly without using liberal every other sentence, joe. cowards are cowards like shrub, cheny,rummy, hide behind the bushes and send other
kids to defend those cowards. By the way, for the
regular bloggers, you know who I am, don't you?

I think that those that love Bush are running scared over last night's speech and much of America responding favorably to it. Otherwise why would there be so much invective, fear, panic and immaturity? Kerry's a threat, no doubt about it and, if Bush's Black Box Voting Scheme doesn't highjack the Election --again--, we'll finally get back on track with President John F. Kerry.

Love the respectful, well-balanced, polite and astrologically intelligent comments, guys (and gals). Keep it up. :-)

Jonathan

Sally,
Of course I realize your surname is McDonald... which is my point. I think we should all be as polite on your site as we would in your home.

And now, I apologize, for I have taken up more than enough space.

Namaste

Jo, I knew this joe being one of those cons/repugs
will have such a low IQ like his kith and kin-shrub, quayle etc, I'm not at all surprised, he thought 'Namaste' is a name. I asked him to debate and defend those COWARDS and all he can do is direct me to insanity/fatso limbaugh's website
or call me a liberal as expected!

Blah, blah, blah. Yawn.

http://www.alternet.org/election04/19389/

Colin McNickle, the political wife-beater for billionnaire Richard Mellon-Scaife's right-wing attack machine, has set his sights on Teresa Heinz-Kerry – good thing she's willing to stand up to it.

I've been just lurking for a while because so much of the discussion over the past several weeks has not really focused on astrology and, as I've said before, I'm not sophisticated enough politically to participate in most of the discussions. Until the 2000 election, I considered myself an independent although I voted Democratic more often than not. I preferred to look at the candidate and not the party. The Republican party has moved away from me and told me they do not want me. They no longer offer the likes of Lincoln, Eisenhower or T.Roosevelt. Instead they offer a "Constitution, what Constitution?" attitude. I do not nor can I ever believe that the current administration has been annointed by "God."

John Kerry, John Edwards, Bill Clinton and all the Democrats that spoke at the convention have appealed to my idealism that disappeared with 9/11. John Kerry's whole demeanor (the same demeanor that cause some to call him dull) make me feel safe and secure and that I can trust him. Maybe too idealistic and naive but I have a sense of hope that George W. Bush can never give. He's too much like a little boy playing soldier.

And I would advise any GWB supporters who might be peeking in to play nice. Discussion is good, animosity is not and we are all guests on this board.

Sally, for a quick article, this one is really good and I have to agree with your conclusion.

All of that has been posted in previous articles. READ.

Jo, you just make me laugh and smile, what a joy you are, you don't live in the West by any chance do you? I would drive to meet you for coffee. In fact there are several on this site I would drive to share coffee with them (or tea)

Saying that all you can do to defend the COWARDS-
shrub, cheny, rummy is call 'liberal' is not an insult and don't be a cry baby to ask Sally to delete my post.If you want that, Sally knows it
must be your post, joe, which must be deleted first.I've been here for ages, before a novice like you started calling 'liberal' like all cons
and repugs do. So first grow up from being a brain
washed cry baby, will you?

Not only these cowards-shrub,cheny,rummy sped away
when it came to defend our country, now it is learnt as blogged above stealing our money, Iraqui
money in hundreds of millions and not accounted for.Also, as predicted by me, in one of ealier blogs, these burglar crooks of WH had demanded Pakistan to produce some lowly al-quida memeber branding him as a high 'catch' when our BRAVE PATRIOT Kerry was accepting his nomination last night.This lowly al-quida was caught and frozen last sunday but the NEWS is manipulated to appear yesterday but this crooked 'ruse' didn't work since all the voters, who are going to BOOT these
criminals in the WH, ignored that news entirely.
At long last brain washing is not working

It never ceases to amaze me how utterly and inescapably powerful WORDS are. A simple statement like "Kerry will win" or "Bush will win" can send people into fits of rage that run down their arms, bleed into their fingers and spill themselves all over their keyboards and eventually into our minds. But they're just words.

Yes, these Words indicate our thoughts, maybe even our beliefs. And, yes, those of us with a great deal of hope tend to cling to them and protect them from others who might hurt them and, in effect, us. But, again, they're just words.

And these Words, here, are on CyberSpace. If you don't like what I read, you can S-C-R-O-L-L down and save yourself the rage, the anger, the unpleasantness. Or, if you're curious, you can read them and understand that this is my Opinion and not yours, so you need not internalize it, be affected by it and feel as if You're Right and I'm Wrong. 'Cause they're just Words. Everyday letters, familiar characters we've known since childhood, scrambled together in different patterns. They're just Words.

And what I write here will eventually disappear and not matter. Civilizations rise and fall. The World goes on. Stuff we have cluttered around us will someday be nothing but dust. Just as the cherished mementos of lives lived 1500, 700, 300, 200 years ago crumbled and turned to dust. Lives begin, are lived, and end. So, all that we think is important now, in the end, isn't.

So, if someone disagrees with you, you have a choice:

Does that person's Opinion have any validity. Yes. Do you need to read it, experience it, swallow it whole and make it a part of you. No.

These moments we live tick by one after the other and can never be recaptured. Use them wisely.

And remember: they're only Words.

Jonathan

In any event, Saturn in the Twelfth natally is tough for an executive. It stirs up too many insecurities for genuine courage (said by someone with Saturn on her Ascendant). A successful leader needs Saturn in a location where the energies can be focused outward in a constructive manner. And Cancer, with its natural overprotectiveness and retreat doesn't help. Indeed, Cancer is in its detriment here-a sign that instead of structuring, we get inhibition.

Shrub would have been better off as a monk in a monastery, meditating quietly while pruning the rosebushes. The ordered life, with its security and privacy would have suited him well. Cancer there would have led him to simply make his monastic cell more homelike. The tragedy was that he was born in a family that demanded traits that he simply could not have-Leo traits of charisma and leadership, Scorpio traits of cunning and strategy, Libra traits of charm. And the second Saturn return asks the question-how have you handled your true adulthood? Have you done you life's work properly, and are prepared to leave a legacy to the next generation? For the next state is the Sage stage of imparting wisdom, the Grandmother/Grandfather/Great Uncle/Great Aunt/ who builds for the ages instead of for the family.

Shrub finds himself at this return handling responsibilities that he never really wanted in the first place, never having done the hard work (Saturn) of recovery, and facing the fact that he may never fulfill his father's ambitions for a true legacy. And at a time where he probably would rather give in to his natural inclinations to retreat (and probably would have spent this year going to them if he was wired differently), he has to actively play the Sun role of leader and ask the fickle public to give him one more chance as the Sun King.

I post my thoughts for others to READ, joe for your info, I don't have to read them, joe, the great AUTHOR, who becomes an author as soon as Bhakti mentioned he has written BOOKS!

What chart are you getting this from? A chart you charted yourself? If so what were the birthdates/locations you used to conclude them?

It is very easy to comprehend, joe when you don't know what 'word' is a profanity to ask Sally to delete, when what I wrote has no profanity and if you did find any, spell it out here you great author!

Hear, hear, Jonathan. Nicely said.

Could the person who keeps leaving their name off of their posts start identifying him or herself? It's nice to know who we are talking to.

It's nice to see you are back, Jo.

George W. Bush was born on July 6, 1946 at 7:26 AM EDT in New Haven, Connecticut.

When I still participated in my offline astrology group, we would sometimes attract Joe; sometimes they were fundies who thought we worshiped the devil, sometimes they were simply argumentative. I believe we attracted them because our group, meeting in a very conservative area, represented another way of thinking that was very threatening to their enforced consensus.

No Joe, Astrology will not get Kerry elected. The people will. All the people he's pissed off and alienated (say like the world) here in the United Stated. Like blacks, women, gays, teachers, librarians, workers, police, firemen, army, navy, marines, CIA, FBI, NAACP, moderate republicans and on and on and on.
Even if Kerry is not our first choice, we don't care, we're pissed and staying there until he goes. And we are all together this time. That's why Kerry is going to win.

I know who you are 9:32. You rock! Sending love.

I will only say this once, and then I'm using my time more wisely: Dissent is fine if the tone is respectful and not argumentative, challenging or otherwise "mean spirited". The dissenting views I've seen recently on this Board have been all of those things and more. We welcome opposing points of view. In fact, the astrologers here more than likely appreciate someone questioning their work as it nudges them to dig deeper and do better.

But when the post, the "opposing view", is filled with opinions, beliefs, thoughts, etc. bordering on name-calling, words that are intended to hurt or demean, or a "I'm right, You're wrong" attitude, then it's just a waste of time.

And the same goes for those that disagree with the Opposing View. Disagree, but be adults about it.

Please feel free EVERYONE to question the work done here. But don't think that to have an Opposing View you have to belittle or besmirch or demean anyone or their beliefs here.

And no matter what is said after I post this, this has, in fact, happened.

Jonathan

Don't get all that excited,joe, I meant 'great' sarcatically, don't get all carried away by this.
Only when the 'liberal'NY Times in your east coast
puts your book in their best selling list, can you
go gaga,joe, NOT YET!

"No Joe, Astrology will not get Kerry elected. The people will. All the people he's pissed off and alienated (say like the world) here in the United Stated. Like blacks, women, gays, teachers, librarians, workers, police, firemen, army, navy, marines, CIA, FBI, NAACP, moderate republicans and on and on and on."

And you think John Kerry hasn't pissed off huge blocks of Americans? Dream on, he has quite an extensive voting record that is going to be exposed that will alienate him from MANY Americans.

"Even if Kerry is not our first choice, we don't care, we're pissed and staying there until he goes. And we are all together this time. That's why Kerry is going to win."

And there lies the problem, it could be Saddam Hussein or even Adolph Hitler running, and since there is so much hatred for Bush, he would probably still get elected. That is NO way to elect a politician. It really is time to take a good look at your candidate and start questioning him before you run off on a rage and vote for someone who may be a potential disaster for this country. We've had George Bush for four years, and he hasn't nuked us into oblivion, we haven't had another terrorist attack, we have a more prosperous economy, we have better health care, better education. I'd say he is doing a pretty good job.

You go, Raj!!

Again, more Republican talking points. We used to run those types away from our real-life group because we simply would not buy their talking points and stuck to our astrological guns. Not only that, but we resisted making them leaders, insisting that everyone had a right to their opinion. They would never really come back after that.

Friends: let me inject a little Alice Bailey in the discussion: You have heard of the Rays- Well, Sagittarius and Pisces represent the Sixth Ray of Faith and Idealism. With Pluto in Sagittarius and Uranus in Pisces, what we are seeing is the mass effect of the negative Sixth Ray in action.

shrub doing a great job, you are NOT SERIOUS(like
McEnroe used to say to the chair umpire during
a tennis match, he is losing control)

Astrology will make the FREE WILL to overcome the
thievery plotted by shrub and his corrupt gang will be HISTORY in 3 months!

Oh Goddess, it a Full Blue Moon.

Flip: Better Health care
Flop: Higher premium rates

Flip: WMD in Iraq
Flop: Bomb the crap out of Iraq with USA weapons of somehat mass destruction and depleted uranium

Flip: prosperous economy
Flop: lack of jobs and lower wages due to outsourcing

Free will only works if there is a will that can act freely. The tragedy of a lifetime of unrecovered substance abuse and a life with little real structure is that there has been little of the deep thinking necessary to be captain of his life. His thinking and feeling and instincts are still that of a child or teenager, not a man who has developed a deep well of knowledge and philosophy to draw on during troubled times. Combine that with the enormous stresses of the Presidency, and he has little capacity to do more than simply hang on for dear life. Yes, a monk and some leaders can do differently through conscious awareness of the forces and energies in their chart, and a lifetime of mental discipline. But Shrub is not like that at all. He flies off the handle at reporters who ask him tough questions, gives goofy nicknames to reporters, refuses to read anything unless Condi gives it to him.

The more everyone blows wind at this guy the more it's going to fill up his sails. It's obvious that neither him nor we are going to be changing our points of view based on the arguments being produced by both sides. No matter which way you dress it up this is circular logic, a waste of bandwidth and a blatent insult to the hostess.

Still, in the spirit of cyber~ettiquette I swear to never, ever again use the phrase "giggling murderer" in the same sentence as GWB at this forum.

Now let's just take away the one thing he wants (that would be attention) and he'll hop away to another lilypad where people will play with him.
Namaste~
~D

Negative attacks:
Awwwwwwww, poor widdle georgie, we are hurting his feelings.
Wonder if the the 10,000+ dead Iraquis, 900+ Americans dead soldiers and their families care.

I hope you are all studying this well. This is the real deal. This is a troll. The right wing actually pays people to do just what is being done right here. There is no honor in it, they just want to win, period.

Sometimes rude is in the agenda rather than the words.

Joe -

I was born Jan 4, 1930 at 5:51PM 79W23 43N39

Why don't you recipocate and post your info so
the people on this board may have a go at you.

Surely you are a "young" soul.

Hey folks..... lets cool it,Joe has a right to his opinion but he is clearly getting a response that is doing no one any good.
I dont think anyone on this sight claims to be infailable but you have to call them like you see them and then see what happens.Had I not started studying the Vedic astrology about ten years ago I would not be as confident as Iam that Kerry will win.And the real Vedic astrologers that I have read on the http://astrodatabank.com
sight where the data on Bush and Kerry can be found have more than confirmed the my perspective.
However it is still hard too not see using tropical astrology that Kerry will win.There are some on the astrodatabank sight that disagree and that is okay.
Believer me I have checked rechecked my work in this area knowing I probably do have a bias but saying Kerry will win is not rocket science. It is not a hard call.I have done this for a liveing for over thirty years and if Kerry where my client, I would be able to say, relax, you are going to be the next president just go out there and do your thing.
Not that I couldnt be wrong. Have been wrong before and it will happen again.But a lot of confidence here and Nancy sums up well the case for Kerry.
Relax. Enjoy the show. Kerry is about to change the political landscape of this country for the next 36 years.

Thanks for the good work Chas!

Joe -
I have had two past life regessions - the last
by Dr Jeffrey Mishlove. I have had over 200 past
lives that I know of, however, they only usually
refer to lives that have an effect on this one.

Come now, give the time of birth and the longitude
and latitude or place of birth so people have half
a chance at understanding where you are coming from. I suggest you read Messages from Michael to
find your soul age.

By the way Jeffrey has a web site and has written
several books.

Joe, Sally and other astrologers have said that if Bush wins, which I have always believed was a possibility, that he would not last 6-8 months. I don't know exactly what will happen but he would not last.

I don't believe anyone here thinks that astrology is the end all but I do believe we are confident of a Kerry victory, that is, if he makes it to the election, which in itself is not assured.

Laurie,
shrub will be under the heaps of history in 3 months;even if cons like joe are stupid enough to vote for him, this time it won't cut the mustard
and only thing left will be to try him and his cronies-cheny,rummy for war crimes and put in that
abu gharib house and throw the keys into the Tigris.

Wouldn't it be fun if this freeper was Ann Coulter who probably has lots of time on her hands now that she is fired from USA Today.

Now, can we get back to discussing Sally's
great column. Celebrate the convention and get
to work to get Kerry/Edwards elected. Contact
everyone you know and make sure that they are
registered to vote. On election day, take them to
the polls if you must. Let's get to work Astrophiles!
I noticed the slogan around the Fleet Center
ASTROnger America - made me smile every time I
saw it. Methinks there was a message there.

favorite trump line of Kerry's: .."we need to get on God's side" (paraphrase) It socked the bushego of 'god is on my/our side' mission statements, etc
it was refreshing to breathe the 'air' (sign) energy swirling around - air sign moons john,john and theresa.
reports are flying on www.capitolhillblue.com about bush condition, anti-drepressants and his mood is even more uneven and paranoid - saturn is working him over. bush in the oval office: "pray with my dick".

Joe you are correct in as much as astrology is not an exact science, not that the information is not there but that we as astrologers either don't see or understand the information presented. The astrologers writing on this site have over 150 years of collective experience, I alone have 37 years of painstakingly studying the math, the energies and how they apply to events and people and have had through my career a high degree of accuracy.

A presidential race however is a bit more complicated, the 2000 race is a good example. I stated at the time that the winner would be the loser and the loser the ultimate winner. Most astrologers could see a tight race, problems in a couple of states but it never crossed our mind that the Supreme Court would take it out of the voters hands, because there is no history of that happening and we didn't look at the overall picture. It is essential in a presidential race to look at the candidates, their birthdate and their families, the time of the acceptance of the nomination, the day and time of the inauguration and most importantly the data for the US, this is a sampling of what mundane astrologers look at to arrive at their predictions, plus progressions, solar returns, asteroids, and fixed stars. As you can see this is a great deal to synthesize sometimes mistakes are made. The fact that mistakes are made is not as surprising as the fact that a good astrologer makes very few, that's the surprise.

There isn't any doubt that this race will be close and depending upon the integrity of the voting machines, which is right now in question, Kerry/Edwards has the edge over GWB. That said, I can tell you that the next 4 years has the potential of being as bad or worse for this country and whoever is President will take the blame and perhaps the fall for the problems. There are variables out there that cannot be assessed, the dishonesty of the voting machines, the Supreme Court, Martial Law, a severe earthquake, terrorists attacks, an economic crash (which is a real possibility in Oct.) a serious scandal for either candidate (another real possibility) these are all variables and must be considered. There is still 100 days until Election and in politics that's a long way off. Astrologically those 100 days show to be dramatic.

Joe, 3 must be a big number for you? With that birth time and year and Gemini being the 3rd sign . . .

I have a hard time understanding how anyone could choose Bush over someone with the stature and integrity of Kerry. And I know you feel the opposite. I am agreeing to disagree, as I have had lots of practice with a few family members!!

I have been all over the web getting predictions from astrologers and MOST, but not all, think it is a Kerry victory. The ones that say Bush wins usually refer to his Jupiter declination conjunct something (maybe the Sun's declination) on election day. Maybe that merits some looking at.

I truly believe another term for Bush will spell disaster not only for our country but for the world as a whole. I am not Bush-bashing, I am expressing my true feelings.

Hey Joe, it's Friday night. Dontcha got a date or something better to do?

So glad Bush got him.

may i play too?

flip: we must be a humble nation
flop: watch me as i alientate our long-running allies

in spite of what the cat dun drug in today, i am grateful for the rapid and insightful analysis of last night's speech. many moons ago, i lived in ann arbor, so it just feels right to say GO BLUE early and often.

best to all

Anyone who has watched and understood the past eleven years and is still supporting the Bush/neocons must have taken up one of the most horrid habits of the cheap labor conservatives. They have agreed to outsource their common sense, disbelieved in science, and are stumbling on to the end of life as we know it. The environment is unimportant to them, and kicking off the developing economic debt to their heirs is of no concern to them.

There is karma, and it does come around.

All neocons accuse others of doing exactly what they themselves do on a daily basis.

high coup:

arrive here to learn
to give thanks for wisdom shared
best to ALMOST all

Maybe you can focus on some of the other computers on that bank where you work. I won't miss you.

Sally, for that matter, all the sciences are inexact, as I mentioned before replying to Jonathan's dillemma.Medicine says one day coffee is good for you, the next it will raise your bp;
same with wine, and also other foods. One scientist says there is global warming backed up
with SOLID proof but shrub can get his own neocon
scientist to refute that.But the most funny thing was today the 'other'reagan who feels he gets step
son treatment from the ronnie's family says as
if he is a scientist that stem cell research can't
cure parkinsons and other diseases but the REAL scientists with PhD degrees say stem cell research is necessary for finding cures.(what kind of treatment michael reagan expects from the
reagans besides stepson treatment, after all he is
a stepson, like an adopted one, they're all the same.He was replying on 'Today' show criticizing the REAL BRAVE Ron Reagan

joe, you make all these grandoise like statements
but you've come knocking at our door since you worry Novemeber is goung to be bushwacking time, so you don't flip flop like your 'baal' idol man!

You still haven't defended the cowards, because you can't, joe, but is very quick to defend shrub on this global warming issue but your defence rings so hollow like the other bigger 'baal' idol
of the cons, namely ronnie said that poluution is from the trees - this is the way these cons and repugs reveal their true stupidity and low IQs and
I won't say ignorance because they're like know it all types

Bush isn't just another viewpoint. Bush is dangerous to humanity. You are not just another viewpoint.

don't give me this 'balanced' poppycock like the con fox news calling itself, which was exposed completely bare by the GREAT Al Franken in his latest book and to add insult injury, got the fox
suit to use exclusively those words as if GOD had personally given those words to that moron rupert murdoch thrown out of the sensible courts(thanks it was not the supreme court, where very little sense is left!)

Against my better judgement I am going to answer you for the last time. First of all you seem not to read my posts and jump to conclusions that have been addressed in the post, such as "mistakes are made" I said that and if you had read what I wrote you would have seen it. Secondly, the thing that is frustrating is not that you've been able to refute a "liberal" stance, but that you don't seem to have any concrete data, or logical arguments to back your opinions. And that is the very thing liberals object to regarding conservatives, they don't have a reasonable or logical argument to state their case. They just throw out absolute statements like that are so incredulous it leaves one without a desire to talk to them. There is no debate, no give and take, no credible facts to back themselves up, nothing. Anyway Joe, I hope you have a nice evening and this is my last response to you, if the others want to continue this back and forth they have more of a stomach for it than I do.

Joe, ok things must be really bad if we use astrology to figure things out. If that's what you want to believe.
That's your personal opinion. Just because you think it, does not make it so, it's just your opinion, to which you are entitiled of course. But because I am entitled to my own personal opinion too, I believe that there is no sin, only the consciousness of sin. Be aware of your mind, watch your thoughts and words. When you think it, you become it. There is no sin, only the conciousness of sin.

NOW you're being rude and a bit abusive, Joe. And I think it's time for the Moderator to step in and bring some order back to this. If you have something to offer ASTROLOGICALLY that supports your belief that Bush will win in November, please share it. If not, treat the people here with respect and courtesy.

Jonathan

Since you have a degree Joe, you will undedrstand this.

despicable

SYLLABICATION:
de·spic·a·ble

PRONUNCIATION:
AUDIO: d-spk-bl, dsp-k-     KEY

ADJECTIVE:
Deserving of contempt or scorn; vile.

ETYMOLOGY:
Late Latin dspicbilis, from Latin dspicr, to despise. See spek- in Appendix I.

OTHER FORMS:
de·spica·ble·ness —NOUN
de·spica·bly —ADVERB

Just saw your Post, Sally. Thank you. You must have been writing as I was writing. Thank you, thank you, thank you. Truth be told, I'm still happy about the coverage Kerry's speech is getting. Looks like he knocked it out of the Park. And the Democratic Convention this year, with Barak Obama, President Clinton and Al Gore, Sharpton's wonderfully impassioned speech, all of it was great. Really enjoyed myself. And how wonderful a First Lady will Teresa Heinz Kerry be?! If she can do for America what she's done for Pittsburgh, we'll be in amazing shape after their 8 years have passed. :-)

Jonathan

Sally, you're most sensible; only if the other who hope to win an argument blurting out 'liberal'
can use 1% of that sense!I'd any time vote for a liberal who is smart, brave and high IQ guy and not vote for a dumb, arrogant, corrupt,cowardly low IQ guy.You know the names, I have in my mind!

Also COWARDS will NOT GET elected either even by stealing or throwing wool over voters' eyes;so this imbecile and his cronies will be thrown under the heap of history very soon and let the celebrations BEGIN for the sensible liberals!

Any one notice that Mars last night by being at 22 leo was exactly conjoined Kerrys progressed Jupiter and that the transiting Sun was exactly trine his progressed midheaven? Is another real good sign we have an accurate birth time for him.
For what happend to him last night there had to be a strong connction with his north node pluto conjunction and the midheaven and there was via the Sun bing on the his north node Pluto conjunction trine to his progressed midheaven. for the chart we are useing for him.

Pat C.,
Just took the youngest grand swimming for a couple of hours, he came back exhausted. While gone I thought about the disruption on this site, and my Pallas Athena was roused. I come back to find that for the first time since I have been reading this site [which is not that long compared to some] you have 'loose'd your mighty Athena! You go girl, more power to you. Your point is exact, right on the mark.

Light and peace

Apologize for my poor editing.Dont do this often enough to get the bugs out of my writing.

Heya Jonathan, I'm folding a bit about Mama T into the Blue Moon coming up. My repub bosses cracked jokes today that they need to brush up on their Portuguese (excuse my spelling) speaking skills for the next First Lady. Loved it.
So Jonathan were you there? I've bypassed a lot of the posts? You could hear a pin drop here at my house when Barack Obama spoke, roared with Sharpton, cried over the damn'd hamster. I thought they did a really good job of showing the human side of John Kerry. Loved the balloon snafu and that folks thought cnn anchors uttered dirty word.
Thoroughly enjoyed it all.

Jonathan, I loved Sharpton. You could tell which speakers knocked it out of the park those were the ones who have received the most negative press. I heard the press secretary for Reagan say that Obama's was the best because he did not use one cliche or hackneyed phrase. He speculated that if Obama writes his own speeches look out and if he has a speech writer he needs to keep that person on his payroll. Sharpton's imagery at the end of Ray Charles was just fantastic. Timing is everything Jonathan and I do believe the timing is right and this convention showed that, the unity of the democrats (and god knows they have not been unified in 30 or 40 years) seemed to freak everyone out, including the pundits, even the liberal pundits. So it's going to be an exciting campaign season.

Chas, thank you for all the fascinating input!! Don't care how many boo-boos, just keep it all coming!!

Has anyone looked at the stars for Bush's acceptance speech, probably around 10:00 p.m. as well, September 2nd?

Oh my gosh Chas, I completely missed it and it was right there, that just reinforces his nomination and potential.

I did look at it Laurie, but I don't want to comment until I have the exact time.

Hey , this has been a good lesson on how the Repubs stall in the House and Senate.

Jeez, taking a break and all H-E- doublehockey sticks broke loose. Full moon.

I am still on cloud 9 over those amazingly intelligent, strategic and well spoken speeches this week. That's some talent pool. It will attract positive talented people.
I'm loving Air America. These guys are right in the face of BS, call it, out it and end it.
As soon as the Rightio's (remember Felix the Cat cartoons?) talking heads who have no talent so throw negative misleading spindirt around to act like they are journalists, the Air America radio hosts sweep it up right away and usually expose the underlying story.

Happy Blue Moon. Stay Happy. The Neo-Cons seem desperate and worried. I would be too. We are changing the record groove. The old spin just became obsolete. Like the way of 78's, 33's, 45's. It does not play on the uplifted, awakened understanding anymore.

(((Jo)))

Everybody please scroll up and understand what this guy is doing. He's alternating between being civil and being abusive and every time he switches somebody is stepping up to duke it out with him. It's a standard GOP tactic, you may recognize it as a microcosm of what's happening between the candidates.

I've read the posters here at Astroworld debate on the proper use of the term "Metaphysics." I've read the astrologers answer questions normal people wouldn't think to even ask. There is simply no honor to be either gained or lost by engaging this guy in conversation. We are beyond this point. His opinions on astrology are worth less than his opinions on politics. We've given him enough pleasure for one sitting and wasted enough bandwidth to feed his need to be the center of attention.
~D

Morgana, we're looking forward to the Blue Moon and your analysis! btw, I think THK speaks five or six languages fluently, so your bosses don't need to brush up on anything...language-wise anyway... Didn't she look outstanding last night! Very few women can wear white --- she looked very chic, I thought.

Bl-ue moon, Morgana music... who could ask for anything more?

Joe, you bring the words of Bob Dylan to mind..."I wish for just one moment that I could be you and you could be me so you could see what a drag it is to see you." I'm not trying to be mean. I truly mean that in a sympathetic way. But I don't expect you to understand that.

Dommael that's exactly right. It's an old trick.

The most recent Zogby poll shows deeper trouble for President George W. Bush beyond just the horserace. Mr. Bush has fallen in key areas while Senator John Kerry has shored up numerous constituencies in his base. The Bush team's attempted outreach to base Democratic and swing constituency has shown to be a failure thus far, limiting his potential growth in the electorate.

The ugly details-
Among Hispanic Voters:
Kerry 69%
Bush 19%
Among Southern Voters:
Kerry 48%
Bush 46%
Viewed Favorably in the South:
Kerry 55%
Bush 55%
Approve of Bush's Job Performance in the South: 44%
US Headed in the Right Direction in the South: 43%
Among Young Voters (18-29) :
Kerry 53%
Bush 33%
Among Single Voters:
Kerry 69%
Bush 19%
In the Red States:
Kerry 46%
Bush 48%
In the Blue States:
Kerry 50%
Bush 38%

What does Joe have to say about this?

Joe! In the words of Teresa Heinz Kerry. "Shove off!" We love John Kerry.

Wow, the posts are all very revealing. To both sides of the very verbal fence, I offer something to reflect upon.

Fear is so powerful ... and makes us do and say things we would normally not say or do. Viewing these posts I keep getting one image flashing before me.

View
Breath
Meditate

http://www.apple.com/trailers/lions_gate/open_water/

Peace,
Robert

http://www.pressconnects.com/today/opinion/stories/op073004s106715.shtml

Hard to argue with the reality in 'Fahrenheit'

Fahrenheit 9/11 is an embarrassing movie. Or it should be. It should be embarrassing to the Cheney/Bush Gang, but those people are beyond embarrassment.

It should be embarrassing to the spineless Democrats in the U.S. Senate, not one of whom had the moral courage to co-sign a bill of particulars prepared by African-American members of Congress and others protesting the disenfranchisement of black voters in Florida, a blatant act that enabled Bush, with the help of his brother, Jeb, Florida Secretary of State Katherine Harris and five members of the U.S. Supreme Court to steal the presidency.

It should be embarrassing to the national media -- print and electronic -- who lacked the intellectual courage to show us what Michael Moore shows us in this movie.

And it should be especially embarrassing to the millions of Americans who fail to or refuse to see Bush for what he is: an inarticulate puppet for a corrupt, cynical band of neo-conservative opportunists led by Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice and Wolfowitz.

The sweet singers of the far right and their followers have tried to make much of perceived errors in Fahrenheit. I say perceived, because in some cases they are the only ones who see them. Example: Moore supposedly claims in the film that members of the bin Laden family in the United States were allowed to fly home to Saudi Arabia after 9/11 before the ban on commercials flights out of the country was lifted. But the film does not make that claim. And the Saudis went out on private planes, not commercial flights.

Moore does question the wisdom of allowing relatives of the man who masterminded the attacks to leave the country so soon after the event. But then when you look at the close ties, especially the money ties, that bind the Bushes and the Saudi establishment, including the bin Ladens, you understand the preferential treatment.

More...

Sally, do you think at this point, according to his chart, that bush wants to be reelected?

I wonder what Kerry will say about this.

http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0407/30/wbr.00.html

Britain at Odds With Bush Administration;

JIM BOULDEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's being seen as retaliation, the announcement last week's by Britain's defense secretary, Geoff Hoon, that a European company won a $1 billion contract to supply unmanned surveillance drones. The loser was U.S. manufacturer Northrop Grumman. Why? Because London is accusing Washington of unfair trade practices when it comes to defense contracts.

DAVID MULHOLLAND, "JANE'S DEFENCE WEEKLY": The U.K. government thought when they joined the U.S. IN Iraq that they would be viewed more favorably. But ,in fact, no. The U.S. is still saying, oh, but we can't trust our good allies the Brits.

BOULDEN: That anger boiled over in a letter dated June 16 from Hoon to U.S. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld. Hoon complained that legislation now working its way through Congress will make it even harder for non-U.S. firms to compete for American defense contracts. If it passes, Hoon warned Britain would have to have an exemption or consider whether to continue buying from U.S. defense firms.

More....

Abilene that is a very good question. In 1992 I could not get over how apathetic Bush Sr. seemed to be, and I thought he acted like a man who didn't want to win. Since 1992 I have watched the Republican "attack dogs" and I realized that Bush thought they would take care of Clinton with the Jennifer Flowers situation. It was a "plan" they followed for 8 years in their attempt to get Clinton. I think they were shocked when Clinton actually won. Bush, Jr. could be taking the same road. On a sub-conscious basis I have to wonder if he has the stomach for it anymore. This presidency has not turned out to be something a former cheerleader would enjoy. His father has shored him up and gotten things for him all his life and Bush has self-destructed on every single thing his father gave him, I have wondered since the election (which his father brought to him) if he would self-destruct through this campaign. I think he might be keep as far away from Karl Rove's attacks as possible so he looks as if his hands are clean, but I think he consciously will go all out to win. I would absolutely look for a scandal involving Kerry put out there and I rather believe it will happen close to the beginning of the Republican Convention or right after.

Gosh, guys...I was feeling quite hurt and embarrassed to realize that Joe is a fellow Gemini. (me...June 7, 1943, Honolulu, Hawaii...by Caesarean, 4:10 pm double wartime...anything else? 0h yeh...that Venus thing on June 8 happened right ON my Sun/Saturn conjunction, so I think I have mellowed quite a bit since that day, which was really QUITE a wonderful one, the energy was divine - quite a bit different from the Pluto opp/Saturn which happened 2 years earlier right on my Sun/Saturn which gave me SHINGLES.)

I'd like to add some concrete stuff to this discussion....my dislike of Bushonomics (I don't even have to go THERE about W himself, as it would be repetitive) comes from experience. I lost everything in the first Bush regime...my home, my savings, my career, I was audited by the IRS for a tax shelter my crooked accountant put me into,and I ended up in Chapter 13 bankruptcy. That recession, the lack of support for ordinary people, was a rip to the fabric of my being, if not to my actual body. Under Clinton, I clawed my way back, got a new start (I had been a men's fashion illustrator; my new career switch was to storyboard/comp illustrator for SF ad agencies) and I was doing ok, considering that I came from owing huge amounts of money and having no cash for months of 1993, to about half of what I had been making pre Bush 1....actually, the Reagan years. Those economics and the actual ripping off by my accountant, who kept trying to get me to join the Republican Party, just devastated me.

And here we are AGAIN....no work, no advertising, just day one from 14 years ago, all over again. Still in Chapter 13, though....and had to give up my health insurance, which I only had for less than 4 years, as it tripled when I turned 60....if not for an uncle, I would be on the streets.

This is what Bushonomics does....this is why the dark cloud of grief we all felt in 2000 was SO real to me...."Uh Oh....here we go again." I have nothing of material value other than portables to lose now...no IRAs, no savings, no real estate. Why would I think the Bushes are great men? Why? I'm sure Joe would have a great reply for me, but I'm sure not about to buy it in this lifetime or any of the 1000 I've had on this planet or any of the other planets I've had a life on (honest, past life regression, surprised the hell outta me)

A pause that refreshes:

"I come humbly to the bamboo grove
Each day hoping to embrace the Way.
Going and coming, there are only mountain birds
In the profound dark, there is no one.
Alone I sit within the dark bamboo
Strumming my lute, whistling along
In the deep grove, no one knows
The bright moon, how we shine together."

- Wang Wei (700-760)
----------------------------
In honor of the coming full BLUE moon. And a little something from my inhouse soothsayer, who will soon return to school (the 8 year-old, old soul):

We had just unloaded my Dad's furnishings and belongings in his new nest here... Soothsayer and I were driving to return a handtruck, when he turns to me and says "grandma, I don't think we ever really die." Don't you, I said. That's very profound, where did you get that idea? "Well, grandma, every adventure just leads to an even greater adventure." Silence. (thank you little soothsayer)
----------------------

[when the student is ready, the teacher will appear. I have asked for decades for teacher(s). We do not always know the form in which our requests will be answered!]

Namaste

Pat C.... re your post....I am not defending the Senators: you wrote....
It should be embarrassing to the spineless Democrats in the U.S. Senate, not one of whom had the moral courage to co-sign a bill of particulars prepared by African-American members of Congress and others protesting the disenfranchisement of black voters in Florida,,,

Just noting that the reason they did that is because, seeing that Bush would get the nod of the Supreme Court, they cut a deal....the Dems wouldn't ask for a recount if the Repugs would allow them to work "bipartisan" (not be SHUT OUT) of the next 4 years. Fat lot of good it did them....and Al Gore had to preside over that scene. It was awful, and sickening and stupid. They sold out. Almost the worse part of that movie to me....

I keep wanting to add...that 2000 election had a retrograde Mercury operating. Could it get ANY MORE clear?

Oh mah gawd, guys ~ are ya'll following Josh Marshall's blog?

"It's certainly true that Mr. Kerry said certain things in his war protestor days that can now be used against him with some audiences. But until he was well into middle-age President Bush's most noteworthy public utterances seem to have been limited to various invocations and inflections of 'par-TAY' and reciting the alphabet under legal compulsion."

I'm lovin' it!!!
Namaste~
~D

Yes, and Andromeda strained, and brought forth....Joe.

wow, leave this site for a day and it explodes. this is great: 'kind jo' and 'obnoxious joe.' joe, you be trippin my man. seriously, you need to get out more and smell the roses. are you here on a mission? it's not that you disagree, it's your weird notion that since you see your views as a miniority, you have to post 10 x's as much. you make your point loud and clear so stop being such an oinker with the space. why don't you go over to democraticunderground.com and lay outsome of your trash talk. they have sharper elbows that the more evolved and sophisticated folks here.

oooh, prediction for the 'predestined future'...joe will continue to hog space and be obnoxious!

Joe, let's talk about astrology for a minute, now that you have brought up the subject and for the second or third time mentioned predestination or the equivalent of ---

Astrology is NOT about predestination. That is a misconception.

This board does not attempt to teach astrology... however, you will find a wide spectrum of folks here, from newbies to beginners to students to experts. If you have given the discipline (and it is a discipline) a fling and studied it even very little, you will have found that astrologers are constantly having to defend themselves against the notion of PREDICTION or FORECAST. The view is that the transits offer opportunities, possibilities... we make the choices, individually and collectively. Our choices make changes like ripples in a pond, so that enough ripples will sweep away the opportunity, or the obstacle.

The potential, the opportunity, the possibility of John Forbes Kerry becoming President are looking very good... according to his transits, according to the chart of the moment of his acceptance last night, according to other charts which are reflected in numerous articles in the archives.

We are not twisting the transits to obtain an outcome we wish for... we see in the patterns an opportunity to obtain what we wish for... We are not so stupid as to believe that astrology will elect John Kerry or George Bush. We believe the people will elect John Kerry, if the election is not stolen through the computer ballot boxes.

On the other hand, daily interactions with some members of my own family and a review of the comments of the pundits on TV indicate that SOME believe Bush is wonderful, great and god- appointed no matter what recent havoc he creates. If you truly wish to dialog (and at this point I must say I am very skeptical on that point) you might do just that... dialog... ask a question about the analyses in the articles or comment on a post with some firm facts or sources. Most of us here attempt to provide a link for our political comments and astrological information for our chart analyses. I suggest you re-read your posts if you don't think they were antagonistic. And you might want to read some of the articles and comments in the archives.

None of us here agree on everything. Contrary to your assessment, we bring a great deal of diversity to the table.

As to your post above:
"they desire it to be true despite the facts showing how wrong that future really is."

We hope to see George Bush defeated in November and John Kerry elected as President of these United States of America. Please show me the facts 'showing how wrong that future really is.'
At the moment, Zogby (a conservative pollster) shows Kerry ahead of Bush BEFORE his speech last night. ["Show me the money", Joe!]

Peace

Joe
What is the source of your anger? Are you a misogynist?
Most of the people who visit and use this site
are middle-aged women with a 60's background. It
appears that you resent them. You claim to be an
educated man with a chemisty backgound, and an
interest in astrology. If you have an argument with some of the idea professed here, why not
present your views backed up by your astrological
assumptions. They would make a more powerful argument for your ideas, which seem to be more
political. I would suggest you read the British
papers more often, also papers from around the
world to see how the world really feels about us.
You mind seems to be closed, or you are in great
pain about something that has happened to you over
the past few years, and all you can do is lash out. There is nothing wrong with being a Liberal.
I've been one all of my life. Either you have come
from money and resent those who are not in the same class as you (a la the Bush family), or with
all your education you are blind to what has been
going on in this country for the last 24 years.
The biggest deficets have been created by Reagan -
who accumulated a debt larger than all previous
Presidents before him. Bush 41 did him one better.
and W has hit it out of the park. That is not
responsible in my book. In 1994 with the Contract
on America the Republicans insisted on a balanced
budget and got it passed into law. It is a law
they have yet to honor. If you don't think 2000
was a coup you have been ignoring the truth and
have not read many of the nation's best sellers
that have come out since that event. They have
tried to keep every one off guard since 9/11 -
with the ridiculous color codes. They have lost
track of billions of dollars in the Pentagon and
in Iraq. They allowed Ken Lay to screw the people
of California, then got a recall through using
false information. Schwartznegger could never have
won a primary in that state and they knew it.
Bush has cut the budget for practically every program he has signed in a photo-op. And what he
has done to the military - cutting VA funding-
charging the wounded for their meals, cut the
amount paid for overseas duty, cut money from
military families.
You should spend more time reading Yellow Times,
Counterpunch, Alternet, Tom Paine, Juan Coles,
etc. I certainly hope you don't watch Fox or CNN
for your news, when there is the BBC, CBC, Deutesch Wella, LinkTV, NOW with Bill Moyers.
Surely with your education you must realize that
the NYTimes is no better than Pravda or Izvetsia
during the Soviet era. Are you aware of how many
of our elected officials vote in lockstep with
Likud? Does it not bother you that the GOP gives
huge tax breaks to the top 1% and wants to make it
permanent, with millions are below the poverty line. Bush has stopped aid to the elderly in
Kentucky,WV,VA,NC etc, for heat in winter.
You are probably a person of privilege who has too
much time on his hands. So why not get out and into a volunteer program that helps the poor, aged,less privilged than you. It just may change
your view of the world.
I would also suggest that you sit down alone some
where and say the names of all the people who you
feel have done you wrong, verbalize aloud their
slights and follies...then say "I forgive you, I
forgive me". I tell you it works miracles, takes
a heavy load off your shoulders and frees you to
enjoy life. Good luck, best wishes and Blessings,
Expand!

Joe,
Here's Dubya's chart: http://www.star4cast.com/index2f.asp?page=home%2Easp and you can find it several other places online... just google it up! You don't have to reinvent the wheel...

sally, thanks for the encouragement. Regarding your suggestion, here is a start. mike (channeling guido perhaps) said here are the possibilities for realizing sally's prediction that bush is headed for crawford soon!
'

(3) the economy starts to drift or the europeans make a little mischief to hassle bush;

VOILA from a Republican news wire service:

Posted on Fri, Jul. 30, 2004

U.S. Economy Slows Drastically in Spring

MARTIN CRUTSINGER

Associated Press

WASHINGTON - The U.S. economy slowed dramatically in the spring to an annual growth rate of 3 percent, as consumers, worried about higher gasoline prices, cut back their spending to the weakest pace in three years, the Commerce Department reported Friday.

The April-June advance in the gross domestic product, the country's output of goods and services, was below the 3.8 percent increase many economists had expected and was significantly down from a revised 4.5 percent growth rate in the first three months of the year.

The administration, counting on a rebounding economy to bolster President Bush's re-election prospects, insisted the second-quarter slowdown was only temporary and forecast that growth would rebound in the second half of the year.

----------------------

http://www.thestate.com/mld/thestate/business/9281921.htm

nancy talked about an economic setback that would impact the elections. well, here tis one possibility.

INTERESTING INFO ON THIS FULL MOON IN AQUARIUS

http://www.astrowisdom.com/thisfullmoon.htm

ah... joe,.. like mike I think maybe you need to chill and not get your self all tangled up in those astrological points you are plotting.I have already told you where you can find Bushs chart at astrodatabank.com
Sorry to jump in here. You have a right to be skeptical but we have a right to be skeptical that you have enough astrological acumen to make any kind of judgement on the work of the astrologers who post articles on this sight.
But maybe you can proove us wrong. If so we are all ears. There are lots of astro arguments on the astro data bank sight favoreing Bush and I have looked at them and some of them do have points that need to be considered.If you can contribute something in the way of astrological analysis here, well go to it.

joe, you're pulling our chain...that's not nice. show some respect and stop the teasing. it's not 'better by hand,' you're just messing with people.

i'm off to see 'harold and kumar.' later all

ps. i'm not one of the 'evolved and sophisticated folks here'

GWB birth data. 7/6/1946 7:26amEDT 41N18 72W55

People, for the love of Mike (and Guido, too), quit abetting this bottom-feeder. Thnx!

Saturn conjunct Sun (now), a depressive and introspective aspect. Ask this Libra how she felt back in 1989 as she had to leave college. In orb to feel it...square Libra Moon...not very happy either. Neptune opposition Mercury...adds substance to the allegations of substance abuse-hard time to think clearly, and with oppositions, the outer manifestation is also a question on whether or not he is decieving or being decieved-and remember he has had this transit for several months (I'm familiar with the Neptune transit for its right on my Aquariusmoon in the third!) Pluto opposition Uranus and on the South Node, with its themes of radical unraveling (sorry for anyone born in the same month). Neptune opposition Pluto (not good for bedrock ideals).

Another concept to consider that I took from the Author of the "Next 20 Years". For the head of state, the National Chart supersedes the personal chart. Not even a King born to the purple can outrun the National Destiny. And Saturn (restrictions) is on the National Sun (Head of State)

Personal data: 10/13/56, Cincinnati, 10:05 am, (No EDT) (EST). Neptune has been very prominent in my life lately.

From Hassan Jaffer a vedic astrologer at astro databank.com 3/14/ 2004
"John Kerry has jupiter on his 10th house till Sept 2004 and in his tenth house during election. Jupiter trining his Uranus and Mars is a real windfall configuration,then it sextiles moon for popularity.All the progression and solar returns are purely fictious when such important transits say all.Saturn is riseing in his chart whereas Bush's Saturn in 12th(only one president ever won back under this tansit and he dies in office) Mars moveing into bush 4th house indicates HE IS GOING BACK TO THE RANCH". My caps
"Kerry will be firm and evasive like most politicians but more practical as well.(mercury in cap sq neptune) so you can expect going back and forth on the issues. However it is only because he is fooled by the rhetoric but once he realizes it was a mistake, he is not afraid to admit it like Vietnam.
Powweful opposition to his views from 2007 onwards as pluto conjuncting his mercury will slow him down but he could be two time president"!

And on 3/15/2004 Jaffers says; "Kerry is defnetly going to win. I predicted in my book moon majic that Al Gore will loose when he was 12 points ahead.
I dont see the election being so so close this time as there is no mercury retrograde and Jupiter is on top of kerrys chart trining his mars and Uranus and coming into a trine to his moon.Bush has Saturn squaring his moon from now into late summer.His family and he himwself will feel quite depleted. Saturn return for him in the 12th house is not good for him at all.It is reward for what you sow".
Many of these points hae been made by astroworld astrolgers but I like his style and the sublime confidence that goes with Indian astrolgers.I had one for a teacher of the vedic and when they make a prediction they have no doubts and are invariable correct.

Carol...my daughter has N Venus at 8 Cancer and N Moon at 18 Cancer (the moon is in the 12th)....the Saturn transit has, from what I can see from the outside, caused her to have to deal with restrictions (2 very young children, 1 & 3) and 2 VERY demanding bosses...because under the Venus transit from Saturn, she realized there wasn't enough money on just her husband's salary, she said oh, I'll just start being a virtual assistant. Being very accommodating (with a Leo Sun conjuncting her Leo rising), she has gotten trampled by her ASSUMPTION that everything would be EASY, working as a virtual assistant for 2 people who are always juggling 18 balls in the air and saying...I've got two of them, you catch the rest. Her ASSUMPTIONS have made her reasses her state of mind - and her grumpy attitude shows. She realizes she undervalued herself and her skills and that she really missed the boat about almost everything else....it was all very very difficult for her to deal with. However, she also saw it, said it, and admitted it. On her own....something GWB probably is incapable of doing.

Whoooohooooo!

Air America spreads wings

The liberal talk network Air America, heard locally on WLIB (1190 AM), is adding Mike Malloy, 10 p.m.-1 a.m. weeknights, starting Aug. 2.
Air America President Jon Sinton also says the network is adding another "major California affiliate" early next month, and "chances are very good" it will find affiliates soon in Los Angeles and Chicago.

Sinton says he thinks the flurry of stories about instability at the fledgling network "are pretty much behind us now. ... We're focused on making this work, and it's happening."

Simultaneously, he says, "Our product is improving. I'd be the first to admit some of what we did the first month was bad. But now we sound pretty good."

Timing is everything Chas. The planets don't care they just keep going around the earth dropping storms or sunshine on everyone, rich and poor, young and old, men and women etc, etc, etc. The timing is perfect for Kerry and for that matter Edwards.

Saturn will make an opposition to the US Pluto in October, then retrograde and making another opposition in Dec. and then another after the 1st of the year. This is our money, (US Money) if there is a crash after the 1st of the year the new President will take the blame. If their is a crash in October, this President will take the blame. Kerry was born on a Full Moon and in Vedic astrology that is an incredible aspect, particularly with the Sun in the 1st (in Vedic astrology that is a destiny placement) Pluto passed his Sun for the last time last year about the time he began rising as the candidate, Pluto over the sun gives you the opportunity to come into your own power.

The one thing that disturbs me in his chart is his progressed Mars (which was retrograde at birth) has now progressed back to his natal Mars and is within minutes of being exact.
This can be Kerry coming into his destiny or the end of his destiny. I've seen it work both ways.

Interesting that Joe is a no. 3/Gemini as he is quite an effective communicator and has certainly gotten our attention.

From where I stand, George Bush is not all bad - no one is. I am sure we can come up with some good he has done for the nation. However, for some very good reasons, he is extremely unpopular, not only among Democrats and liberals, but also among Republicans, Europeans, Canadians, and many others worldwide. Dislike and distrust like that has to be earned. It does not happen randomly nor overnight.

In fact, many of us gave our government the benefit of the doubt for a very long while. I remember feeling extremely uncomfortable with the decision to invade Iraq. It seemed to drop out of the sky. There are other countries in the Mideast who are much better equipped to do damage (Iran, Syria). So, to avoid cognitive disonance, I decided that our government had to have a damn good reason. So much for that!

Whether on his own or due to the influence of his mentors/handlers, GWB has: 1) gotten us into a very expensive, very sticky, and very unnecessary and tragic, pre-emptive war; 2) managed to get us into enormous debt for what reason? - political expediency. Money has been spent to buy the support of countries such as Pakistan as well as wealthy corporations, such as those in the pharmaceutical industry, so that they would keep him in office. The latter has resulted in a Rx drug plan that has seniors thoroughly confused and one that the "experts" don't even understand 3) Alienated teachers and school boards with the "No Child Left Behind" plan 4) Sacrificed critical environmental protections and has not responded to the urgent need to become independent of oil so that we will not have to go to war for oil nor will we contribute to global warning (we may not be able to control volcanos but we can surely control our own actions) 5) Not created nearly enough jobs to balance those laid off and outsourced; and many of those created are lower level jobs.

Yes, it is not for lack of good reasons that this man and his administration are unformly disliked. And were it not for the support of basically 2-issue, good, religious Christians and others who are duped by the packaging and see him as a "good ole boy" or a "strong leader," he would not have much support left at all. Yes, he comes across as decisive and persistent, but what good are those qualities if they are ultimately dangerous and destructive?

A lot of people will be very upset should Bush somehow manage to be elected in November and this will lead to even greater dissension and polarization in America. However, I choose to believe that America has seen the light, has realized that the Democratic party is, at this point in time, more honorable and virtuous than the Republicans now in office, and that the country is slowly but surely turning a spiritual shade of blue. John Kerry may not be perfect, but he has strength, intelligence, wisdom, and integrity, and he surely will look perfect next to George W. Bush.

Namaste,
Sharon

10-4 shylurker; that's a positive. let me know when i can leave time-out (lol).

Hi Sally and All,

Read some of the speeches from the democractic convention and they are really uplifting, gives one hope for the future of the world, new energy, new, intelligent and compassionate leadership coming out of the US is what we all look forward to.

John Kerry made some challenging statements regarding oil and the Saudi royal family which I don't think were made or taken lightly. I hope he doesn't meet with "misfortune", before or after the elections.

Obama is another with amazing energy, I wonder if his moon is at 22/23 taurus conjunct the great conjunction of 2000, making him someone to watch for the next 16 years in US politics. Need I say it's wonderful that he is half Kenyan.

What a wonderful change.

much love,

The BIG BLUE maps of the USA, with Kerry Edwards, or Michaud ( our Rep to the house)
on the other side are ready to march in out local parade today.
the situation in NJ with my son is proving to be an poster child for why "the laws of the land" need a sweeping overhaul. They don't protect the people.
When I had a landlord / tenent dispute, me in NJ tenant here Maine, He won! Now that its reversed, the landlord has the advantage.
NJ used to be a joke because of its superfund sites & landfills. The legal structure has followed suite, in the last several decades!
Happy blue moon everyone.
PQOP

Azara,
Soooo good to hear from you! Yes, Obama is an amazing energy... a rising star for sure... so very articulate, passionate and strong... a voice for the times.

The time they are a-changing, indeed. And that is what is bothering these white males so much... it's more than the desire for empire and oil, imho. Remember months ago when we discussed esoteric astrology and Pluto's movement through Sag? I can't recall the author's name... Sharon, Beverly ... do you remember...? wonderful couple of articles about the return after thousands of years to the feminine... to the goddess motif...

As a white southern female I have been watching the angst of the white male since the pill was discovered and they began doing battle with the 'liberal fems'... they are desperately clinging to their eroding power... unwilling to share. They've lost control... people of color are mayors in some major cities and knocking hard at the doors of governors' mansions and the white house... The tide has turned. [I intend no male-bashing... we have been pre-occupied with the male aspect of ourselves for much too long... time for balance, says the universe... hang on, Snoopy, the ride will be rough!]

Sharon, are you still on vacation, or back? Good to hear your calming voice...

Morgana music is coming... full BLUE moon is coming... peace and light surround...

Namaste

Jo

Just read you post above, and then went to
The Guardian - this is the first story...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/print/0,3858,4982979-110881,00.html

Evidently he hasn't got the message.

....sounds like an endorsement to me...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/print/0,3858,4983089-103682,00.html

WV,
You're correct... the Pope --- 'Papa' --- may or may not 'have the message' --- it's for sure he's not liking it! I am no longer a practicing Catholic... the Christian church, in all its aspects, is patriarchal... no way it's going to support feminism: the theory of the political, economic, and social equality of the sexes. Pluto is transiting, though... and the times? They are definitely changing, whether 'Papa' likes it or not... whether Dubya and his minions like it or not... whether the Grand Old Party, with its 'traditional' role of women (barefoot and pregnant?) likes it or not! Whether Ann Coulter likes it or not... or Phyllis whats-her-name likes it or not... ripples in the pond are tidal waves... BLUE waves, crescendos... BLUE everywhere... nothing, no thing... will turn that tide back...

Happy full BLUE moon WV... some times we picked to live in, right?

Namaste

Well, here comes the Piscean effect, and it will be here for quite a while.

http://www.prospect.org/weblog/archives/2004/07/index.html#003374

WAS BERGER SMEARED? Sure looks like it. The Wall Street Journal reports:

Officials looking into the removal of classified documents from the National Archives by former Clinton National Security Adviser Samuel Berger say no original materials are missing and nothing Mr. Berger reviewed was withheld from the commission investigating the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks.

Several prominent Republicans, including House Speaker Dennis Hastert and House Majority Leader Tom DeLay, have voiced suspicion that when Mr. Berger was preparing materials for the 9/11 Commission on the Clinton administration's antiterror actions, he may have removed documents that were potentially damaging to the former president's record.

The conclusion by archives officials and others would seem to lay to rest the issue of whether any information was permanently destroyed or withheld from the commission.

Archives spokeswoman Susan Cooper said officials there "are confident that there aren't any original documents missing in relation to this case." She said in most cases, Mr. Berger was given photocopies to review, and that in any event officials have accounted for all originals to which he had access.

More....

I want to play too. Inspired by the Pope's hypocrisy.

Flip: Pro Life for the unborn fetus (how come there's always a majority of men in the pro-life marches??????)
Flop: Bomb abortion clinics, kill living abortion doctors

Flip: Love, Peace, God, It's All Good
Flop: Closet-case priests molest children

The day when men grow a uterus is the day they can have an opinion over a woman's body . Otherwise, 'shove it'.

Azara, how wonderful to hear from you. I wonder how everything is for you everyday.

Yes, Mr. Barak Obama is creating quite a stir in the US, he seems to be the most exciting young star in politics. Wish I had his birthtime but the earliest degree of his moon could be (if born at midnight) 23 Taurus and the latest (at 11:59pm) would be 5 Gemini.

Mr. Obama made a huge hit at the convention, this guy can be taken seriously as a candidate for President in 2012 or even 2008. He suffers however from John Edwards problem, his youthful appearance. He is an outstanding writer an excellent communicator and seems to have the unusual gift of honesty. (I've been watching his reputation rise in Illinois for the last 9/10 months.) His wife is also intelligent (a working attorney) and she is graceful and beautiful.

Several months ago I read a little back page article of Mr. Obama and how he had gone to court to have a "stalking" photographer stopped. His opponent, Mr. Ryan, was doing this, the judge issued a restraining order. I was so impressed with how Obama just stood up to the bullies that I started following his career.

At least we have let the possibility escape our lips that there might be an African/American President or even (horrors of horrors) a woman president. So now the possibility is out there and where there is possibility there is probability.

Did you hear his speech? I heard a speech writer say the it was the best speech he ever heard, nothing trite or hackneyed, no cliches, and he was going to win Illinois Senate Race before Ryan dropped out. They can't even get anyone to run against him. I think he will get lost in the Congressional shuffle after he goes to Washington, but give him a little time and he will rise to the top, he's just too good and he is a Leo, he will go for the "world stage."

Willie Brown (former popular mayor of San Francisco) said he is the new voice of America and I believe that to be true.

Lovely to hear from you and take care.

Ha, Bhakti, I love it. Our new cry "shove it." This is the most frightened I've seen the European White Male in over 30 years. Not since the feminist movement in the 60's. I have been expecting a huge push again to get women back "in their place." I don't think it will work. Look at the women they fear, all strong, all popular. I feel that the dam is about to break, they must be terrified. Part of the "new world" coming.

What a great goodbye, the lady had cajones!

http://www.local10.com/news/3598475/detail.html

The BBC has been doing a series on Global Warming....that should be shown in this country,
maybe it would awaken the GOP

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3922579.stm

Yippie Sally, hope I'm a part of eroding that damn dam ;) I also sent a whistleblower letter in my profession for a contest where out of 40 semi-finalists 2 women were chosen. Oh and of course out of the 5 winners was the one token woman which is how it usually is. Said I'd use my contacts (over 2000) to out the prejudice of this and not to use his product. The guy wrote back and admitted he did not catch the lopsided ratio. Yeah, right. Money talks, doesn't it?
I think we should all boycott the products that are advertised on these Cable shows and the Rightio's radio shows and TV shows that are propaganderizing our minds.

Bhakti, you rock. This is great and if we all did this think what we could accomplish. This is great.

an interesting take, with some points I totally
agree with...

http://www.yellowtimes.org/print.php?sid=2021

CBS, MSNBC and CNN--on the internet (thanks, Al)--have the campaigns as their featured story so far today. Each of them has one picture that goes with the story and it is of Smirky. Interesting that Snarly seems to have disappeared.

I agree, Mr. Barak Obama will be a force to be reckon with. I read this over at dailykos:

One of the media conversations I'm peripherally aware of … is the "why do people call Obama black?" It's quite fascinating, really, that this is an issue.

Is it me or do they just keep digging a bigger hole?

good article on Obama...

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/pp/04212/354164.stm

Sally, I remember the incident about the photographer you mention in reference to Obama.

As I recall, his political opponent hired a person to, essentially, follow Barak every minute of his day and just annoy the living hell out of him. Nice tactic, Republican party, by the way.

I believe the judge initially hesitated to intervene but Barak made it clear that it was unacceptable and would not be tolerated and his opponent backed off. Another insight into Obama's strong character and perhaps a refreshing one in these modern times!
~D

Highest budget ever....

http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/printer_080104Z.shtml

Obamarama
Needless to say, his speech went over great in the convention, but watching it on TV I realize it probably came across even better to people at home. I forget who told me this when I was there, but IIRC I was told that after his speech the website was getting 18,000 hits per minute.

-Atrios 12:28 PM

Obama is a breath of fresh air! I really wish some network would replay the whole thing. More americans need to hear these words.

Sheesh. Smirky & Snarly. Biggest budget. Biggest deficit. Biggest job loss (well, not counting the Great Depression). And let's hear it, gang: Biggest loss ever at the polls on November 2nd.

Posted on dailykos:

Just saw this on MSNBC after Bush stopped talking, take it for what it's worth....

THURSDAY SAMPLE
BUSH/CHENEY 47
KERRY/EDWARDS 49

FRIDAY SAMPLE
BUSH/CHENEY 41
KERRY/EDWARDS 54

Also, tied on handling of Iraq.

Just think, if Kerry does get a 15% bounce out the convention, it will be the first time bush has predicted anything correctly!

Sally,

Do you perhaps know what Article it was posted here that outlined Nader's astrology and when he may be pulling out? I just noticed some news out of PA that says he abruptly abandoned the City Center office he had been using (leaving behind a mess and the room in tatters) after being besieged the night before by dozens of homeless people demanding the money they were promised for gathering signatures! If this news doesn't hurt his chances, I don't know what would!!!

I think someone, one of our fine astrologers, indicated he may pull out by August or early September. Do you remember what article it is so I can look it up myself? Thanks.

Jonathan

Jonathan, I don't know which article, I addressed him and so did Nancy, I do remember we both did so reluctantly because we both felt he was a non issue. I write a ton of articles for this site and a couple of small mags in Europe, so there would be too many for me to go back and sort them out. I will try later tonight.

I was thinking that this past week showed the RNC that Gore and Clinton made peace, black leadership is becoming mainstream, women can say anything they want especially in defending themselves. Sharpton could care less about speech boundaries of 6 minutes and went 20 minutes telling the world how blacks have been really treated in our history in order to defended the Dems. RNC learned how everyone is joining forces right now because we are aware and using that awareness to get this Shrub out of 1600. RNC must be really sweating.

BTW, since Crawford is a poser home for photo ops, and he can't go back to the Gov mansion, where is GW's real home? Does he move back in with his parents?;)

Last night Bill Mahler (don't know if thats the correct spelling) had Michael Moore and Ralph Nader on his show. Bill and Michael got down on their knees and begged Nader not to run. I don't think that has anything to do with Jonathan's post. It's just so sad to me how many good people bush has tainted. Dennis Miller, Colin Powell, John McCain and Ralph Nader. Some days I just ask myself, what does bush have on these people? How did Ralph ever let the republicans get to him? How did they get him to buy in to it?

Do believe the VOC Blue Moon 'virus' has disappeared with the direct Moon. Peace at last.

From Capitol Hill Blue: Nancy Reagan to Bush
"We don't support your re-election" - following
Ron's article in Esquire, and Michael's bitching
to the press that he is treated like a stepchild,
I am inclined to believe it.

http://www.capitolhillblue.com/artman/publish/printer_4935.shtml

I just realized it's Lammas!
Blessed Be, all you Wiccans and Pagans and beautiful freaks~
Light a candle for John Barleycorn!
http://www.gratefulness.org/index.htm
Namaste~
~D

Sally,

I know you do a great deal of writing and there are many, many things to sift through. Please don't worry about using your time to find the exact article. If someone should think of it, that's cool. If not, I'm sure I'll survive. That PA story, though, made me think of what you et al. had said and I wanted to double-check the timing. That's all. :-)

Jonathan

Okay all you history buffs... does ANYONE remember another time (apart from Nancy and son Ronnie) when the family of an ex-president opposed the party's sitting president? Publicly or privately for that matter? Thought so. Why haven't we heard anything from the press? This is news, right?! That's a rhetorical question of course.

Okay - here's an idea for the universe to spread and someone to pick up on - a funeral for the extinct, non-existing journalists in the 'news' [not infotainment] industry... The USA no longer has a 'press' corps... no longer can we depend on the networks or cable to report the news. So, why not a funeral... we need closure, folks!

Welcome to the new messengers... independent reporters working for foreign news agencies and the tireless researchers on the blogs... off with the filters!

----------
When I first came to this small town I live in 30+ years ago, the local newspaper reported very little 'news'... there was a column about gardening, there was 'farm' news, there was a 'social' section about the prominent folks and whom they visited out of town, and whom they entertained in town... want ads for mostly worn out farm equipment, etc. If folks wanted to advertise they paid for it with a few chickens or a mess of turnip/collard greens... the local editor was known by all. Then a fella from the Lowcountry newspaper came into town --- seems the 'big' paper had bought the little paper...

Well, seems to me the 'big' papers have taken on the habits of the little paper... there's no real 'news' --- just press releases from the White House or Talking Points from the RNC... and folks repay in kind --- not with chickens or greens now, but something a little more expensive... a couple of weeks at a fancy resort for the family, education for the children, new vehicle to chase those ambulances, etc. Anybody else think it's time for a change?

Jonathan, try this.

http://www.astroworld.us/archives/000375.html#000375

Good article about Kerry by Adrian Duncan

http://www.world-of-wisdom.com/04_articles/2004/04_kerry_pr.htm

-snip--

Kerry's chances

The key to Kerry’s success or failure in the November 2nd election may lie in the subtle influence of progressions, and they are looking good. Take a minor factor like the proximity of Kerry’s Sun to his Ascendant. It is curious to see that as his progressed Ascendant increases in speed through the signs of short ascension like Aquarius, it catches up with the progressed Sun, and will actually conjoin it during the next presidential period. Plenty of opportunity to look at mirrors then! More powerfully this Ascendant and Sun conjunction at 20 Aquarius is just two degrees from opposing progressed Jupiter at 22 degrees Leo, and this will become exact during the next presidential period. In fact the Descendant progressed will conjoin radix Jupiter at the 2008 election, which could even indicate a two-term president.

As mentioned before, Kerry’s progressed Mars returns in 2005 to its natal position after a 62-year apprenticeship. A rare Mars return of this nature suggests a radical change and completely new territory. As 4th house ruler, a move to the White House might be appropriate, especially as Mars conjoins the Moon.

Furthermore Kerry’s progressed MC is at 7.01 Sagittarius at the election. There is no reason to think that his birth time is inaccurate either... during the course of 2003 the IC has been exactly on his Uranus, surely reflecting the mad campaigning rush around America. His MC now trines his Leo/Aquarius nodal axis, as it also does the US nodal axis at the same position. This indicates a fated moment of greatness, in which the projections of the masses are fulfilled in the person of Kerry. From 2005 to 2006 his MC trines Pluto, so if there was ever a time when Kerry would be handling power, it is in the coming years.

Jonathan check out Nancy's archives for April 5th. I think this may be what you were remembering:

" But by mid-August 2004, Neptune, the Deceiver, will have effectively weakened its grasp on Nader’s distorted perceptions just as some much-needed Saturnian practicality enters the picture. From mid-August through mid-September, Saturn will in rapid succession square Jupiter, oppose Pluto, sesquiquadrate the Sun, and square Uranus. There is a strong possibility that these four weeks will see a bracing splash of cold water thrown over Nader’s pretensions. It may be that during this period or shortly thereafter, he will drop out of the race and accept the reality of his potentially disastrous impact on the presidential race. There is, of course, no guarantee that this will occur, but it is safe to say that the hugely inflated ego energy and the self-delusion that are very much impacting Nader’s current awareness will be far weaker from mid-August through November 2004. And we can hope that he may take the painful step that liberates his tiny band of supporters from making another historical blunder of massive proportion."

Nancy Waterman on Apr 5 | Link

Now is the time for all good men to come to the aid of their country.

thanks for the "snippet" from the earlier article. I knew there was something that had been written that dealt with Nader. If he keeps leaving his campaign offices in the shape he left the one in PA, he'll lose lots of friends fast.

Jonathan

Jo,

Riane Eisler wrote a very good academic book called "The Chalice and the Blade," (not be confused with a fiction book of the same name). She explains how the peaceful, partnership-oriented, Goddess-worshipping people of Europe were usurped by marauding, iron weapon-using oppressors from the northern plans and southern steppes.

The best example of one of these VERY evolved societies was the Minoans who lived on Crete. They made beautiful art and had advanced culture and technology. The intrusion of iron weapons and a warlike mentality changed the balance for all time to one of dominator/dominated, only to be shifted temporarily back towards balance during the times of Early Christianity, the Renaisance, and our own. When the book was written, 20 years ago, she felt we were on the brink of either shifting back or disaster. I "know" that we ARE shifting back to a balanced, peaceful world that will respect and honor ALL life, and ALL will be allowed and encouraged to realize their potential.

Did anyone ever read "Summerhill"? It's the account of a school in England where the most rebellous kids were sent, and where they were never forced to learn anything but were allowed to choose from among a very varied curricula (or do nothing). They eventually chose and follow-up showed they were very happy adults.

Yes, I am still on my 2-week vacation in the mts of New Mexico and Colorado. We began in Albuquerque and Santa Fe, staying in the vacation home of a friend, then went on to my brother-in-law's condo in Keystone (next to Breckenridge) and then visited him in Boulder. I white-water rafted 17 miles (not bad for a 53 year old; I was very nervous but it wasn't so difficult as the river keeps ya moving) and took a 6- mile hike down a mountain. Since I grew up in the north, I'm used to woods and mountains but nothing surpasses the beauty of the Rockies. I also visited the Georgia O'Keefe museum and the D.H. Lawrence ranch, two artists whom I revere. I am very blessed to have a husband who made all this possible. When I return next week, I'll begin practicing real estate and registering voters in the Democratic districts of New Orleans. Hope to pour a lot of energy into the latter.

Thanks for asking, Jo.

By the way, did you know that Barak means "blessing" in Hebrew? Except it is said with a final, Germanic "ch" sound, as in "Barach." Every prayer begins "Barach ata Adonoi" or "Blessed are you, G-d." Just goes to show you how much connection exists among peoples.

Namaste,
Sharon

Polls show shrub is falling off the cliff, irrespective of nader in the race or not.Nader will not help, as the cons/repugs think, shrub's
lost case; forget it. Currently Kerry/Edwards
ahead by 48-43, with 8% undecided and undecided
when they decide are less prone to go shrub.So, the fat lady has already sung for shru.cheny,rummy
ashy, they can pack up their stuff get ready for
prosecution for war crimes now.

Sharon,
Thanks for the post... glad to hear you are having a wonderful time, and I do envy you soooo. I lived in Albuquerque for almost two years... came back East kicking and screaming! Adore Georgia O'Keefe... saw her exhibit a few years ago in the East and have quite a few books with her paintings... Now there's a role model!

We ARE all connected... isn't it amazing how the psyche picks up cues and uses terms for things that express the 'reality' --- i.e., the internet, the 'web' --- 'threads' on blogs... etc. As the native Americans, especially the Pueblo and Anasazi remind us in their story telling of Spider Woman and her web... Thank you for posting and triggering my memories of a place that still evokes magic and mystery.

Namaste

It is Lammas! Yes, Lammas is another one of ye goode
old FYRE FESTIVALS.
***
From In the Circle by Elen Hawke:
In Celtic times, when this was the feast of Lugh and
the festival of first fruits, celebrations would
probably have gone on for the whole of August. Lugh was a Celtic fire god, a sacrificial god who was cut down
with the harvest and who, in later times, became John
Barleycorn. The God can also be seens as the mature
Lord married to the Goddess as the land, and
responsible for the survival and well~being of his
people.Ancient sacrificed kings were a representative
of this God, and the old tradition of August or
Lughnasahd weddings reflects both the offering up of
the God and the marriage to the land.

This festival also celebrates the more ancient theme of
the Goddess as Corn Mother, she who gives birth to the
harvest. But the forces of growth that began to
emerge at Imbolc must now return into the earth to
rest and sustain the soil before the next growth
cycle. This is symbolised by the Corn Mother going
into the burial mounds to become the Cail~leagh, the
Winter Hag, to await her emergence as the Corn Bride
at Imbolc. A Corn Mother can be made now, then
dressed in white as the Corn Bride when Imbolc comes.
In the old farming communities, she would have been
fashioned from the last sheaf of corn to be cut during
harvest.

Our own energies begin to gear down now, too, ready
for the inward turn at the Equinox and the descent to
the depths at Samhain. We have to make sacrifices
also, exchanging our failures and outgrown phases in
exchange for reaping the harvest of our spring and
summer endeavours.
***
Namaste~
~D

http://www.azstarnet.com/dailystar/dailystar/32301.php

Bush camp solicits race of Star staffer

ARIZONA DAILY STAR

 President Bush's re-election campaign insisted on knowing the race of an Arizona Daily Star journalist assigned to photograph Vice President Dick Cheney.
 
The Star refused to provide the information.
 
Cheney is scheduled to appear at a rally this afternoon at the Pima County Fairgrounds.
 
A rally organizer for the Bush-Cheney re-election campaign asked Teri Hayt, the Star's managing editor, to disclose the journalist's race on Friday. After Hayt refused, the organizer called back and said the journalist probably would be allowed to photograph the vice president.
 
"It was such an outrageous request, I was personally insulted," Hayt said later.
 
Danny Diaz, a spokesman for the president's re-election campaign, said the information was needed for security purposes.
 
"All the information requested of staff, volunteers and participants for the event has been done so to ensure the safety of all those involved, including the vice president of the United States," he said.
 
Diaz repeated that answer when asked if it is the practice of the White House to ask for racial information or if the photographer, Mamta Popat, was singled out because of her name. He referred those questions to the U.S. Secret Service, which did not respond to a call from the Star Friday afternoon.
 
Hayt declined to speculate on whether Popat was racially profiled, but said she is deeply concerned.
 
"One has to wonder what they were going to do with that information," Hayt said. "Because she has Indian ancestry, were they going to deny her access? I don't know."
 
Journalists covering the president or vice president must undergo a background check and are required to provide their name, date of birth and Social Security number. The Star provided that information Thursday for Popat and this reporter.
 
"That's all anybody has been asked to provide," said Hayt, adding that this is the first time in her 26-year career that a journalist's race was made an issue.
 
Organizer Christine Walton asked for Popat's race in telephone conversations with two other Star editors before she spoke to Hayt. They also refused to provide the information. Walton told Hayt that Popat's race was necessary to allow the Secret Service to distinguish her from someone else who might have the same name.
 
"It was a very lame excuse," Hayt said.

More....

http://www.startribune.com/stories/484/4904237.html

Dayton: FAA, NORAD hid 9/11 failures

WASHINGTON, D.C. -- Sen. Mark Dayton, D-Minn., charged Friday that the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) and the North American Aerospace Defense Command (NORAD) have covered up "catastrophic failures" that left the nation vulnerable during the Sept. 11 hijackings.

"For almost three years now, NORAD officials and FAA officials have been able to hide their critical failures that left this country defenseless during two of the worst hours in our history," Dayton declared during a Senate Governmental Affairs Committee hearing.

More...

Oh my gosh Sharon, that sounds so wonderful! Enjoy!

http://www.lewrockwell.com/kwiatkowski/kwiatkowski87.html

Why Sudan?

Build a Better Bush
http://homepage.mac.com/krousen/Bush%20site/index.html
*fun for hours!)
~D

Dear WV,

I have to say that the Ralph Ellis editorial in Yellowtimes was very biased against Israel. He is right in that the Palestinian/Israeli conflict is one of the most crucial of our times, however, he should think asbout the old Indian saying that you don't know a man until you have walked a mile in his shoes.

I hesitate to provoke any of the old arguments we have gotten into here (besides, Pallas18 is not around; I wonder where she is?), but I am somewhat surprised that you could support something so biased. As far as the security wall goes, Israel is without suicide bombings for the first time in a long while, and Netanyahu has said that the wall can and will be moved as soon as the Palestinians show they are serious about peace. The recent chaos in the Palestinian Authority as well as the desire of the PM to quit, just as the previous one did, shows that it is not Israel who has emasculated the Palestinians -- it is Arat & Hamas who have betrayed them with their violence and misuse of funds.

Other than that, Happy Blue Moon and Happy Lamas, Everyone. Thank you for the explanation, Dommael, as I was wondering about its meaning.

Sharon

Pallas is working very hard over at DU on an important thread concerning the Plame outing.

It is now thread #14

It's as big as a book now.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2123068

Sharon,

The WORLD has condemned the 'WALL'... Why is it okay to criticize the actions of the American government, and not the actions of Israel's government. I do not have to walk a mile in anybody's shoes before being critical of their actions. Neither does anyone else.

WV is free to post any link... is it bias to criticize Israel? Then, SO BE IT. What do you mean you are hesitant to "to provoke any of the old arguments we have gotten into here (besides, Pallas18 is not around; I wonder where she is?), but I am somewhat surprised that you could support something so biased."

Black people get criticized... Fundies get criticized... White males get criticized... Southerns get barbequed... Catholics get criticized... Holy cow, the Pope gets skewered. But one cannot criticize Israel? On what planet?

And fyi Pallas 18 is at Democratic Underground, or at least she was recently... do you need backup to criticize WV, who is probably ten years this grandmother's senior...?

I'm pretty tired of this...

I don't think John Kerry ever promised homeless people money to gather signatures and then skipped town without paying them. How can actions such as this make ANYONE a better person than anyone else?

Jonathan

Jo,

It is fine to criticize anything anyone wants to, including Israel. My comment had to do with the fact that the article posted was extremely biased, with no attempt at objectivity whatsoever.

Sharon

I wasn't aware we were talking about Al Gore. Weren't we talking about Ralph Nader and him being "better"? And, if one is to paint others with the deeds of those they know, couldn't we paint Bush with the brush of that little weasel Ken Lay? :-)

Jonathan

Ralph Nader man than John Kerry? That has to be one of the most inane statements I've ever read. Somehow I seriously doubt you'd be saying that if Nader were taking votes away from Bush. BTW, a candidate getting 3 percent in national polls (which is significantly more than he'll get on election day) has nothing to teach Kerry, believe me.

::ducks left, fakes right::
Hey Joe~
Ya got any astrological insight to back those statements up, my man?
::dodge, turn, parry::
Or at least any sort of reference to any source outside of your own opinion?
::right, left::
Preferably, something appealing for this crowd, as you've no doubt lurked here long enough to have grokked a feel for the interests and protocols of this forum. Juan Cole is nice, as is Josh Marshall, but hey, Rainer Maria Rilke is even a positive, universal message that everyone can understand or Whitman, or even Shelley, heck we've even brought up Aristotle and Plato at this old forum.
::bye::
~D

Joe is stuck in the neocon black hole and is just here to BAIT. His old acorns aren't worth the band width.

Kos has a poll from Newsweek as of 7/29-30:

Gist is Kerry/Edwards, 49%
B/C 42%
Nader/Camejo 3%

Here's the link for inside info on the poll as well as more poll info...

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/7/31/11579/3709

BLUE, BLUE, BLUE everywhere...

Does anyone doubt the moon is full?

Thank you Jo for the link!

Pat C,

I know. And I showed a bit of weakness in playing his game, so I won't anymore. Caught Barak Obama's speech from the Dem Convention on C-Span and, as is usually not the case, this one held up even after a second viewing! Just an amazing, heart-felt, beautifully written and delivered and sincere speech. And then caught Teresa's speech and was touched, again, by her sincerity and almost endearing shyness at times. :-) She'll make a wonderful First Lady. And it looks as if Western Pennsylvania is trending toward Kerry and the Democrats after voting solidly Republican the last several cycles BECAUSE of her amazing philanthropy in Pittsburgh.

Considering writing the Kerry campaign and asking them to respond to Bush's attacks on Kerry's Senate service by comparing that to what Bush was doing during those years. Arbusto Energy anybody?

Jonathan

Hey everybody,
I come from a family that talks like Joe. No matter how you bring up the facts of what is wrong, they'll deflect the attention away by triangulating. Triangulating means bringing in another person to talk about orblame (eg: they do it too) to not deal with the issue. Joe's hero Sean Hannity is the master of this tactic. Triangulating is an action for the desire to stay in denial. It is an action to not 'feel'. When we all stop taking care of Joe's Ditto mentality he will finally 'feel his feelings'. He wants to geta rise out of us because he is unable to feel his own self worth, he cannot feel his anger, so he taunts us as his projections of feelings so we can act it out and get angry, crazy, etc. Take the power back and don't go there and Joe will have to deal with himself and stop the games. So sad.

Jonathan, that's a wonderful idea. I hope you do write.

Here is another interesting poll to cheer you.

www.pollingreport.com

If only people would focus on the issues, the voting records and the outcomes with maturity and common sense rather than this petty, pathetic, infantile party rivalry bullshit that makes people blindly vote for whatever shit-du-jour the talking heads are spouting - damn, we'd have a country! We need to break through this dug-in-heels, them-versus-us mentality or we will get NOWHERE. Peace makes sense. A strong defense when needed makes sense. Protecting the environment we DEPEND ON to BREATHE makes sense. Making the education of our children more of a priority than sending spaceships to Mars makes sense. WHERE is the freaking common sense? Gawd, I'm sick of this.

Sheesh! This tit-for-tat shit has GOT TO STOP.

bhakti, THANK YOU for putting a name to this tactic so prevalent in my conversations with certain family members. Yes, yes! A denial tactic for sure, so appropraite enough the Queen of Denial, my mom. I ask her to define what she thinks Bush has done that is so wonderful for the country, and BINGO! we're talking somehow about Clinton. By the way, did everyone hear that a butterfly farted in East Pathetic, Texas and IT'S ALL CLINTON's FAULT!!

Pat C,

Just posted my thoughts on the Kerry blog. Let's see what the response over there will be! :-)

Jonathan

Do read this.

http://www.lostremote.com/archives/001905.html

Lucy,

I JUST SAW CNN report on that butterfly farting in East Pathetic and they agree that, yes, it IS Clinton's fault. But Bush is on the way and will save everyone, so just hold tight.

LOL Hang in there. Help Is On The Way ... and, no, it ain't Bush.

Jonathan

Wonderful Jonathan! I know you are being heard.

Pat C,

Aw ... you're makin' me blush. :-)

Jonathan

Oh Jonathan, I love a good blush!! :-D

Jonathan, do you think we should send out a special ops unit to KILL THAT BUTTERFLY before he TALKS!?

The Astrophiles already have a triangulation going at this forum. The objective seems to be to strike a balance between common~sense, book~learning and the ultra~intensive subtle nuances of astrology and the movements of the heavenly spheres. Gaining access to all three volumes in your mind is preferable, some folks can't even get one bulb burning steadily, but hey, I'm sure I'm just the lone voice in the wilderness on this. Though tolerant to sometimes baffling levels, I'd say there is a consensus among us that the heart of wit is brevity and if you don't have anything constructive to say, say nothing.
nah-mah-STAY (namaste~)
~D

Lucy,
You're too funny! Watch out, you'll be wearing orange! btw, what was the race of that butterfly? And is it near Cheney?

Lucy,

You can breathe easy now. I've just heard Cheney is going to go all "ninja" on that butterfly and, once again, Save the World. Thank goodness they're in Office, you know?

Jonathan

bhakti,
what could be a counter for this tactic and also the annoying, condescending laughter they turn on for anyone who doesn't agree with the bush agenda?
i sense some kind of master script and i'm not sure where they are getting it!
quite glad to hear that almost everyone here is a writer....

Well, there's nothing left to do but start a TIPS line to report suspicious butterflies. And we'll have to hire Halliburton to build new butterfly detention centers to keep our great nation free, because those butterflies hate our freedom, you see, and if we don't git 'em, they'll fart all over us.

Jo, the butterflies come in all shapes and colors, but they all look alike, see, and if they ain't with us, they're aign' us, so we gotta kill 'em all! I say, I say, kill 'em all!

Kill the butterflies! Kill the butterflies!

Oh, Gawd, I'm punchy from all this.

Lucy,

perhaps you might want to lie down, hon. this Butterfly incident has been a bit too much for ya, I think. :-)

Jonathan

P.S. There's a wonderful man named Robert, from TX, I believe, who was a strong supporter of Bush, but is asking those on the John Kerry web site to help educate him as to why he should vote for Kerry. He obviously likes Bush, but is torn because Bush seems to have broken so many promises and with the war and all ... besides he's got two young daughters and he worries about their future. He seems like a great, educated guy, and one who is evidently trending toward Kerry. Nice conversation with someone who has different viewpoints but doesn't have the baiting, the anger, the I'm right- you're wrong attitude. Just a wonderful conversation!

Jonathan, refreshing, the absence of that broken record, isn't it? One can almost smell the fear.

That broken record actually smells like success to me! Or is that just Flop Sweat?

Rubaiat and all,
When someone deflects us using the Blame Clinton Card we can bring back their awareness from out of the way back machine and into the *now*. We can say the issue is Bush in the now. Talking about Clinton is not going to solve the problems we have in the *now*. We must deal with the issues of the *now*.

The condescending laugh is the action to keep you down, to set up the power heirarchy. Let them feel their feelings of low self worth to have even projected that action onto you. Don't react. That honors your boundaries as well as theirs coz then you two don't fight. Keep on the issues. Why feel bad about yourself when you are thinking and being like a scientist or detective to see all angles of an issue. Keep seeing 360o.

I am not impressed with Dittoheads.

What broken record? The one of John Kerry singing along with Outkast in Bombs over Baghdad?

Sharon

There will NEVER be Peace in the world until the
Israel/Palestinian issue is solved. Solved to the
satisfaction of BOTH sides, not just the Zionists.
The right wing of Likud and the other religious
parties do not want peace. They want ALL Arabs out
of Israel, Gaza and the West Bank - they want the
whole thing, and that is NOT right!
The over 400 settlements in the West Bank and Gaza
have destroyed Arab farms, orchards, towns and
cities. Getting from one place to another is almost impossible. They have murdered many women
and children who had nothing to do with the war.
The offer Barak made was not satisfactory and
Arafat was right in refusing it. The Israelis
control the water, and the Arabs get it only a
few hours a day. The settlements have taken over
the hillsides to that the settlers can "look down"
over those less fortunate. They have destroyed
the olive and orange orchards. These people have
been there for thousands of years, they deserve
more consideration. How would Americans act under
the same circumstances? The would rise up and be
called Patriots.
If you studied history you would find that the Jews were offered a 'home'in Palestine NOT a home
land. It was the Zionist that finagled world
governments to play their game. Starting with
getting America into WWI to save Britain. The
result was the Balfour letter.
The Arab voice/view get very little attention in
the Western media. So they must use the web to
get their story out.
Two weeks ago Catholic and Jewish organization met
in Buenos Aries and declared that anti-Zionists
were anti-semitic. Robert Fisk wrote in a column
recently that the new Websters dictionary says
ant-zionism is anti-semitic.Bullsh*t! I am anti-
GOP does that make me anti-American? Hell No. -
How come it is only the Zionists who are allowed
to criticize?
I was raised in a Jewish neighborhood in Toronto =
on High Holy Days there were about 10 of us left
in class. I cried when most of my classmate went
to schule at 4 o'clock every afternoon and left
me behind. I have many Jewish collegues and friends. Not one of them support the Zionists -
some say they can no longer go to family gatherings because of their beliefs.
Again I repeat "there will be NO PEACE until this
problem is settled" and that means for the entire
world. The Jews need to return behind the 1967
line, as they have promised. No, ifs, ands or buts. Let them set an example to the world before
calling everyone anti-semitic. And frankly, I don'tgive a damn what they call me. I know what is
right and fair, and they are not playing the game
by the rules.
I suggest you read Haaratz and Rense occasionally
so you will gain a wider scope of the situation.

And thank God we live in a country where OutKast can make their music and a John Kerry can sing along if he wants to. At least we're not being forced ---yet--- to sing along with Ashcroft when he warbles out his "Let the Eagel Soar"!!!!!!!!

Jonathan, I have now recovered from the butterfly incident long enough to say that the smell of fear is eminating from the broken record. Can't you smell it?

Over and out. Going to celebrate the Blue Moon over our Blue Nation. : )

shylurker, i'm waiting.

Mike, what are you waiting for? Apparently, we're under red alert because of butterflies. Get busy, man, save us!

From LO, Michael Moore's barn-burning speech from the Take Back America conference:

On The Rise Of The Unlikely Voter
-- Who are these 50 percent who don't vote? Are they the wealthy and the privileged? No.

They are the people who have been the most hurt by the Bush Administration. They're people of color. They're single moms. They're poor. They're working class. The young people…

…And they are now talking politics. And they are not apathetic.

And I think we're going to see a significant number of them leave the house on November 2.

How quickly they forget about Jesse "the body" Ventura??? I was there. It took forever to vote that night. I think Kerry is going to win big!!

PS to Mike. Don't forget your war-cry as you charge those terra-ist butterflies: In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida!!

I for one want to take this moment to thank George Walker Bush for uniting Americans by the lessons learned from his lack of heart, his simple single mindedness, and his sophmoric alienating attitude. I want to thank George for the the lesson of coming into our real power. He's been a real catalyst. Thanks! So George, your job is done, Karma over. We the People got the lesson and became united, and we the People are now going to boot your butt out of power. We pay you. And you stink at your profession. GW, you're fired.
To quote our Raj ' and locked up with the keys thrown in the Tigres'.

Berger Cleared of Withholding 9/11 Material
http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/080104A.shtml

PPS to Mike: Eeeeeeeeek! It appears the butterfly brigades are being joined by the dragonflies.

shylurker, free at last! hey, i saw those guys, iron butterfly, sing just that song (and i remember it). better living through chemistry! i'll tell you one guy who doesn't get butterflies, kerry. i have a nice x-section of friends from lefties/artist types to disinterested geeks/professionals. everybody that saw the speech was wowed (as in the 60's root term wow). one of my best friends, a former reflexive corporate republican said just today, it's not even going to be close; kerry rocks. i'm off to see the manchurian candidate...more later

Far out, man!

I'm just shocked, shocked I tell ya.

Y'know, I think there's probably one primary reason Astroworld is attracting dittoheads (and it's probably going to get worse.)

After the DNC (I simply do not have the energy to scroll up and find who said it) but it's been a week of women and minorities speaking their minds and displays of unheard~of unity within the Democratic Party. Some folks may be having cognitive dissonance that this website has a much larger influence over the inner machinations of the Democratic party that it actually does are freaking simply because they perceive that the Dems have soldered the cracks together well enough to remove *ush soundly from office. Little do they know that most everyone here has disagreed with everyone else on one or another points but there is an overwhelming mutual respect that lets us focus on larger issues. That mutual respect didn't appear overnight, either, it came from hashing and re~hashing points of view and referring to the primary focus, which is astrology.

Yes, the wheels are coming off the wagons of the GOP and if you just happened to stumble across the site you'd probably freak at your perception of our solidarity. That broken record is, and make no mistake, *fear* that you are hearing. Probably the first real, true fear at the changing of the paradigm that we've heard in a few years. Boah howdy you better believe that is only the tip of the iceberg, too. If we're hearing it here the wings of those butterflies must be fanning the flames like mad elsewhere.
It is, however, unlikely that GWB reads Sally's columns and can take heart from such reasoned and polished discourse coming from the midst of such a bunch of fools and heathens as we.
~D

I am distressed by this article about the GOP tactics. It is so negative--and, if they were women--would be criticized as being catty! They are really into the politics of personal destruction. I really hope this backfires:

Bush Planning August Attack Against Kerry
By ADAM NAGOURNEY
and ROBIN TONER
Published: August 1, 2004

WASHINGTON, July 31 —

...Mr. Bush's advisers plan to cap the month at the Republican convention in New York, which they said would feature Mr. Kerry as an object of humor and calculated derision....

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/08/01/politics/campaign/01CAMP.html

Joe, In my humble opinion, you are transparent in your misrepresentations of yourself and positions. You said you're well versed in many subjects, including astrology, but somehow can't find out basic birth chart information. When pointed to Bush's chart, you say you want to do it yourself. Like you never heard of google. And since that time no deep analysis of Bush's chart.

(Totally unrelated trivia: I read somewhere his chart was nearly identical to Michael Milkens'. I hope that means he also fades away from the publics' eye as Milken did).

http://www.galacticcenter.org/bush.htm

Joe, you say you really like Nader, but clearly just want to push him to take votes from Kerry with your "wouldn't it be great if Nader got 10%"? If you were a true Nader supporter you'd want him to do better than W.

Oh, I should've just left it alone, as Bhakti wisely suggested...

DFNEC

Do not feed the energy creature.

Loyalty Oaths

Josh Marshall discusses the loyalty oaths one has to take in order to attend a Cheney rally. I'm too lazy to hunt it down, but one of my many brilliant blog posts sometime back raised this exact question - how the hell are Bush/Cheney going to campaign seriously given the extreme private nature of all of their events and the extreme security associated with them? I guess we have our answer - they aren't planning to. It's interesting -- I guess their plan is to screw the personal touch and hope that positive local news coverage of their fake campaign rallies brings some more people aboard.

Good. It's a huge mistake they're making.

Go Karl!

I went to a Clinton rally in 1996. One had to go down to the local Dem headquarters to pick up tickets and I believe sign your name, but that was the extent of the barrier to entry.

-Atrios 9:00 PM

And this is going to be a tight race????

Joe,
You're a farce! What 'values' are you talking about? a date, time and location equal the same data no matter who computes... as Beth said above just google the chart up, must be 25 or more sites with GWB's chart available... you're a joke! You can get interpretations at these other sites, including the link I gave you last night... And your own birth data is suspect... 6/15/33 is 666! and the time 3:33? You trying to tell us something? We're not buying... You have not answered the first query with a fact or link or source... And regarding your comment above, this site existed a long time before Kerry was a candidate... ever heard of research? Do some... check out the site and its archives. I suggested that too last night. Kerry is ahead of both your guys in the polls... he's extremely electable... both as a Senator and as President.

You may post all you like but you'll be talking to yourself.

We've laughed, we've cried, we've lived, we've died and it's not going away until we stop feeding it.
~D

Abilene,
I saw that earlier and couldn't believe it... next they'll be asking for a blood test to prove you like Bush/Cheney... before you're allowed in, and you know Bush won't campaign unless it's inside an airplane hangar or somewhere on a military base or college, and he sure won't step off the bus... what's the man going to do when he heads back to Crawford in January? There's a 'no fly' zone over Waco now when he's in residence... there's paranoid, and then, there's paranoid...

He's just a fraud Jo at least in my humble opinion. Just don't talk to him. It's a waste.

In case anyone hasn't seen it (all one or two of you), just lookit how bad it is. Even the Repugs are telling people to vote absentee ballot in Fl:

http://www.buzzflash.com/contributors/04/07/con04321.html

Can you imagine the outrage and havoc that would ensue if our ATMs didn't work?

Repug cheneying of the people. Over and over and over again. Even to the point of wanting to make sure our votes don't count.

Onward people! We got a country to take back. We got honor to take back! We got honesty to take back! And we surely do have a country to take back!

Hello. This is for the regular contributors to this board. It is clear that "Joe" has been sent here because the information, points of view and astrological findings on this forum are causing someone, or several someones, in the Republican establishment to be uncomfortable, unsure, worried and/or frightened. The exercise of free speech and respect for opinion on this forum and the conclusions as to potential and likelyhood of Mr. Kerry's success in the Fall is not attractive to the Republicans and the accuracy and clarity of the information here is to be corrupted if possible.

Joe has been sent to see if, based on his meager and possibly coached knowledge of astrology, he can put a wedge into the commitment here to a clear and open evaulation of the political/astrological condition presently operating in the American polical environment.

Congratulations, he's been totally ineffectual and will have to report back that it didn't work.

Ann

In the future, once Sally condemns these creeps to the void I think we should take our cues from her. It's her website, after all.
~D

I rethought my 'don't react' position and I want to modify it. Don't implode people, if not reacting means not being true to your feelings and if it's appropriate, say something direct. Like, what's up with that annoying condescending laugh? Why do you do that?

Robert Novak on Capital Gang:

Responding to Shield's report of Republican warnings to vote by absentee ballot ...

I think there are plans underway by the Democrats to steal this election in Florida ... (laughter by rest of talking heads) ... no I think they are!! I have some facual material that will come out in due course ...

I'm speechless!!!

ok, shylurker, bhakti said i could do this:

Joe, here are some activities you may also enjoy:

-- go to a synagogue and proclaim Christ is risen; or
-- go to a Christian church and call Jesus a false prophet; or
-- go to a mosque and call Mohamed a ‘terrorist;’ or
-- visit AA with an open bottle of Jack; or
-- go to the Republican convention wearing a ‘Bush Sucks’ tee shirt; or
-- go on Hardball with Chris Matthews and show some manners (that would shock him); or
-- visit a bank and decry usury; or
-- look in the mirror and say "I am fun to be with. Because I'm good enough, I'm smart enough and doggone it, people like me.”

That should keep you busy for a while

This, I hope will make you cheer. You can almost feel the possiblities rising if the Dems can pull this off, and all of us need to help them. The America I have always known was one where we disagreed but we didn't hate one another and I sure would like that America back, no matter whether we are a rich or poor nation. I love

"the Democrats didn't move to the center, they are trying to get the center to move to them."

http://www.workingforchange.com/article.cfm?itemid=17389

BUSH CAMP SOLICITS RACE OF STAR

By C.J.Karamargin
ARIZONA DAILY STAR

President Bush's re-election campaign insisted on knowing the race of an Arizona Daily Star journalist assigned to photograph Vice President Dick Cheney.

"It was such an outrageous request, I was personally insulted," Hayt said later.

The Star refused to provide the information.

http://www.azstarnet.com/dailystar/dailystar/32301.php

oops-that was a "staffers" race they were ask'n about

BUSH CAMP SOLICITS RACE OF STAR (STAFFER)

Warren G. Kerry
Will the Democrat Tempt Americans with Promises of "Normalcy"?

By Peggy Noonan

But let me share a thought I've been having that is not so jolly. It has to do with Mr. Bush's re-election prospects and a worry I have. History has been too dramatic the past 3 1/2 years. It has been too exciting. Economic recession, 9/11, war, Afghanistan, Iraq, fighting with Europe. fighting with the U.N., boys going off to fight, Pat Tillman, beheadings. It has been so exciting. And my general sense of Americans is that we like things to be boring. Or rather we like history to be boring; we like our lives to be exciting. We like history to be like something Calvin Coolidge dreamed: dull, dull. dull. And then we complain about the dullness, and invent excitements that are the kind we really like: moon shots, spaceships, curing diseases. Big tax cuts that encourage big growth that creates lots of jobs for young people just out of school.
No, I am not suggesting all our recent excitement is Mr. Bush's fault. History handed him what it handed him. And no, I am not saying the decisions he took were wrong or right or some degree of either. I'm saying it's all for whatever reasons been more dramatic than Americans in general like history to be.

Here is my fear: that the American people, liking and respecting President Bush, and knowing he's a straight shooter with guts, will still feel a great temptation to turn to the boring and disingenuous John Kerry.

Hey Peg, I'd never thought of your lame excuse as a possible reason for Bush to lose the election: The "People" really like and respect Bush, But he's just too darn :EXCITING"' for them???

http://www.opinionjournal.com/columnists/pnoonan/?id=110005288

HaHAAA! Noonan, a classic fascist wing Mind-Mucker! WhaddaHOOT!

Will bet that Noonan has outstanding probs with neptune... slides right in with the bushoholic(s). ;O)

...and, lemme get this straight, Robert Novak is afraid the Democrats are going to steal Florida?!? Well, it's a good thing we're sending MMoore down there to keep a camera rolling on everybody, isn't it?
~D

Sho' is, Dommael... a REAL good thing! ;O)

* The John-John Team, by Maya del Mar

How will John Kerry & John Edwards work together? To help us understand this pair, I'm going to explore briefly the charts of Kerry/Edwards, & the composite chart, which is a combination of both charts, & describes the relationship itself. ... con't http://www.daykeeperjournal.com/feature.shtml

Zogby: Among People Who Did Not Vote in 2000

Ck this out....something new developing in the polls...

Among People Who Did Not Vote in 2000: Kerry 50% - *ush 25%
**************
Released: July 30, 2004

Shorter John Zogby: Give It Up, geo

The results from the latest Zogby Poll
http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.dbm?ID=849
are in, & dubya is in a heap o' trouble:

The most recent Zogby poll shows deeper trouble for *ush beyond just the horserace. Mr *ush has fallen in key areas while Sen John Kerry has shored up numerous constituencies in his base. The *ush team's attempted outreach to base Dem & swing constituency has shown to be a failure thus far, limiting his potential growth in the electorate.

The ugly details-

Among Hispanic Voters: Kerry 69% - *ush 19%

Among Southern Voters: Kerry 48% - *ush 46%

Viewed Favorably in the South: Kerry 55% - *ush 55%

Approve of *ush's Job Performance in the South: 4%

US Headed in the Right Direction in the South: 43%

Among Young Voters (18-29): Kerry 53% - *ush 33%

Among Single Voters: Kerry 69% - *ush 19%

In the Red States: Kerry 46% - *ush 48%

In the Blue States: Kerry 50% - *ush 38%

Among People Who Did Not Vote in 2000: Kerry 50% - *ush 25%

-Holden 6:17 PM http://atrios.blogspot.com/

Spicy Heinz adds a dash of unease.................

"She is so different, so unique that you don't know what to expect. She's an asset with partisan Democrats, a liability for core Republicans — and it's undetermined with swing voters."

Most men stayed mum in the focus group, suggesting Heinz Kerry makes them uneasy but they don't want to get into a fight about her. Luntz found the same male attitude toward Hillary Rodham Clinton early on.

Most political strategists doubt that wives have a major impact on the election, but Mrs. Kerry sure doesn't look like an asset compared to the super-popular Laura Bush, a former school librarian.
more.............
http://www.nypost.com/news/nationalnews/28359.htm
if you want to write Deborah Orin at letters@nypost.com and tell her what a threatened, sad, paperdoll, she is, please do so!

Our Democratic march in the parade yesterday was a smashing success!

Got lots of thumbs up on the BLUE MAPS
( thanks Morgana!) People along the parade route cheered, clapped & gave thumbs up to the maps all the way through town.

Our Jr. Congressman. Mike Michaud, running for re-election is a lovely man, more handsome than the TV depicts, but MUCH more important........ a very honest direct, warm human being! He walked in the parade behind Harold's truck, with the rest of us, and I directed him up onto the porch, to say hello to our most "infirm'. & most faithful Democrat. Her caregiver, brings her to the Town hall to vote without fail.
Then over to the President of the Bd Of Dir. of the local CAP agency ( social services), to introduce them.
Bodes well for my new political action to get the CAP agency, to sign up recipients of Heat assistance, in August, rather than Oct., Nov.!
By the time the papers are processed...........6 weeks, the price of oil is at its highest for the year, & we get less! ( The Fed releases funds in Oct.) I found an ally from the next district, who has had the same idea, who marched with us.............
And I think it will be a good tool for voter registration, among the poorest of the poor, who don't vote because they feel hopeless about the polititians ALL OF THEM! I plan to get them to sign a petition for it.....and when it goes through it will be a good object lesson!
Pat QOP

Pat QOP... good for you!! Great work imo!

this is a great read, in fact a MUST read...

http://www.onlinejournal.com/Commentary/011004Hasty/011004hasty.html

WV,
Thanks soooooooo much for the Hastings piece above. That's the best compilation of info I've seen anywhere... great research!

WV,
In return for post above, here's link to a Kos diary that will bring a 'smile to your heart' as Pat C. often says...

http://ttagaris.dailykos.com/story/2004/7/31/134852/455

Namaste

long before any US paper the Guardian/Observer
endorses Kerry

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/print/0,3858,4983473-102276,00.html

Thanks Jo, hadn't got to KOS yet, still reading
the British papers. I sent it to a news producers
at CBS news asking why it wasn't on last night...
I don't expect an answer.

Told you guys awhile back that Laura the Fake librarian invited Children's authors to the WH and my editor and many others in the field including me NEVER HEARD OF THEM.
I don't know everyone in my industry granted, but have been around long enough to recognize names, epecially who is popular. I'm going to tell that to the Post. Thanks for the link.

Is it me or is Broken Record sounding a tad bit abusive?

Against my better judgement, let me say that there are those here who have welcomed you and your different point of view (myself being one of them), Joe, and who have asked for your astrological expertise to back up your claims that Bush will win. You've responded with personal attacks and, as it now stands, absolutely no info to move the astrological debate. This is, after all, an astrological site and, yes, we do support the Democratic Ticket. So, the only reason you're taking part is to stir the pot. If you have astrological info that supports your claims of a Bush win, please share it so we can all contrast and compare. Is it too much to ask? And if you don't believe astrology is worth anything, then why are you here?

Jonathan

Here's the Repugs spin everyone, right out there for all to read and digest.

Cast your eyes to read the Repug Shell Game of Deflection: it is to NEVER answer questions, to start blaming and bad mouthing the Questioner.
It's old, it's dumb, it's tired, it's embarrassing to our intellects. This is why 360o is necessary. We've all been way too nice to Joe.

Sally, it's time to delete the thick skulled cretin.

"To call yourselves spiritually enlightened is like calling Saddam Hussein a born again Christian, you say all sorts of things to conceal the truth, but when it comes to November the "trial" for your candidate no amount of wishful thinkining, fake gestures, and astrology is going to save your candidate or Saddam Hussein."

Should this poster be tolerated?

The fact that we wish to rid ourselves of a psychic vampire, energy eater is highly spiritually evovled.

Get rid of him Sally.

"Using stars for wish fulfillment are we?"

"Sorry, but Kerry is going to need a lot more than a bunch of hollywood hippies talking about their private areas and slinging mud to win this election"

These are just TWO examples (reading the rest of your ongoing diatribe started to make me feel ill) from earlier posts of yours that clearly bait and show little respect for those who post here. These two examples are how you started your Postings here, Joe, so if the response has been less than you hoped, perhaps you should Rewind and start again. Different points of view are welcome, but not if the Poster requesting them is mean-spirited, disrespectful and here only to argue.

As for these exact coordinates, why don't you just friggin' Google (as many have urged you to do) and get the Candidate's charts yourself? I suspect, though, that that isn't the reason you're here.

I do feel a bit sorry for you, Joe. To spend one's days being argumentative must not be a great deal of fun. Or at least the kind of thing I would think is fun.

That having been said, I'm no longer responding to this. The use of astrology in politics is, after all, what this site is about.

Namaste,

Jonathan

Once again...

"To call yourselves spiritually enlightened is like calling Saddam Hussein a born again Christian, you say all sorts of things to conceal the truth, but when it comes to November the "trial" for your candidate no amount of wishful thinkining, fake gestures, and astrology is going to save your candidate or Saddam Hussein."

Should this poster be tolerated?

Once again...

"To call yourselves spiritually enlightened is like calling Saddam Hussein a born again Christian, you say all sorts of things to conceal the truth, but when it comes to November the "trial" for your candidate no amount of wishful thinkining, fake gestures, and astrology is going to save your candidate or Saddam Hussein."

Should this poster be tolerated?

Joe,

What are you getting out of annoying people?

Are you lonely?

Why do you call negative attention to yourself?

In our name and funded by our tax dollars:
http://www.smirkingchimp.com/article.php?sid=17238&mode=nested&order=0

Something to ponder:

Greatness cannot be found in the man who points at the misdeeds of others but in the man who finds in himself misdeeds and corrects them.

Just a thought ... :-)

Jonathan

There are no misdeeds here, just a neocon throwing mudballs.

Joe reflects his man Bush and just why we want him OUT.

Go back and read the wasteful energy brought to his board.
Actually, don't waste your time.

Something I've recently become aware of are the number of disenchanted Republicans who are staying in the Party, but voting for Kerry. John Kerry's website (www.johnkerry.com) has a multi-page thread of Republicans who voted for Bush in 2000, but can't imagine voting for him this time around. Is it because they don't like Bush? No, not really. Although many question his intelligence and sense of curiosity about the World he lives in, and many do feel lied to, it's more because of the NeoCon movement that's taken over the Republican Party. So, there are many, many disenchanted Republicans out there who are feeling ignored by their own Party who will be voting for Kerry this year.

Also remember to that there are many military families and members of the military who, because of the ongoing "you're going home next month, nope, sorry, you have to stay 6 months more" backdoor draft, will be voting for Kerry this time around as well.

And, in addition to that, the number of Americans currently living and working overseas who are registering to vote or taking part in the Election in some way (in support of Kerry) is up more dramatically this Election Cycle than in recent years.

Just to remind everyone ...

Jonathan

P.S. The Bush/Cheney website doesn't have a Forum for their Visitors or Members to post their thoughts. I checked there to see if the trend was bleeding over for the Republicans as well (Dems voting Republican), but, without a Forum for "disaffected Dems", it's hard to tell.

And if you begin posting the same rhetoric and the same nasty, mean-spirited, snide remarks you've posted here, you'll be booted off there in no time. The disaffected Republicans who post there are intelligent, respectful and support Kerry.

the latest Zogby polls show a dramatic decrease in support for Bush. I think someone may have the numbers posted above. And my friends in Florida (any Floridians here?) say that Bush's decisions involving Cuba have angered many of those Republican leaning Cubans who are now threatening to stay home on Election Day. Add to that the rising number of Democrat leaning Hispanics and Latinos moving into Southern and Central Florida and it looks like Florida (despite Jeb's best efforts at gerrymandering the vote) will be solidly in the Kerry-Edwards column.

Also, Arizona is looking good for Kerry. And with a Democratic Governor there (Janet Napolitano), the get out to vote efforts on Election Day will be MASSIVE. I think the same is true with N. Mexico (and Bill Richardson) and, despite Arnie being Gov in CA, Kerry is solid as a rock there. :-)

Jonathan

" Wow, you are more EVIL than I thought. "

Should this poster be tolerated?

Joshua Micah Marshall over at Talking Points Memo, has provided some info relevant to the "tectonic shift" he mentioned a couple of months ago. Very interesting stuff. Extremely upsetting that "our" policies are based on such fraudulent info and that so little is being done to certify that info being passed is bona fide before it is ever used. For 30 pieces of silver to a bottom-feeder, we have the deaths of over 900 of our soldiers and who knows how many tens of thousands of innocent Iraqis. To say nothing of the wounded and maimed.

Sigh, O sigh O

BREAKING: Bush Campaign Accused of Racial Profiling
http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/080204Z.shtml

Just picked these up from buzzflash:

Wild about Kerry 8/1

Newsweek Poll: Kerry/Edwards Leads Bush/Cheney 52 to 44 Percent 8/1

Wooo-hooo!

BTW, Mike, how was the movie?

Also, according to the Zogby figures from July 26 (I couldn't find the more recent ones ... maybe they come out early in the week?), in the Electoral College Kerry has a sizeable lead over Bush, 322-205. And in the States, the Battleground States, where Bush leads Kerry (there are only 4 where Bush leads Kerry: Arkansas by 2.8, Florida by 0.1, Ohio by 1.3 and W. Virgina by 3.9), it's all within the margin of error with each of them having a healthy number of Undecideds.

Jonathan

The New York Post is a shill for Repugs... who reads the rag? No one here...

Newsweek

Aug. 9 issue - Secretary of State Colin Powell recently testified before a federal grand jury investigating the leak of the identity of CIA covert officer Valerie Plame, NEWSWEEK has learned. Powell's appearance on July 16 is the latest sign the probe being conducted by prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald is highly active and broader than has been publicly known. Sources close to the case say prosecutors were interested in discussions Powell had while with President George W. Bush on a trip to Africa in July 2003, just before Plame's identity was leaked to columnist Robert Novak.

Closing the net?

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5570006/site/newsweek/

and .....

AOL News says that Bush will spend what amounts to a million dollars a day in August on attack ads on Kerry's record.

After having already blown 100 million on same before.

http://tinyurl.com/4lmgh

Fla. GOP Advises Some to Vote Absentee

Republican Gov. Jeb Bush has tried for months to persuade Florida voters touchscreen voting machines are reliable. His own party apparently hasn't gotten the message.

The state GOP paid for a flier critical of the new technology and sent it to some south Florida voters where a primary election is scheduled next month.

"The new electronic voting machines do not have a paper ballot to verify your vote in case of a recount," the message states. "Make sure your vote counts. Order your absentee ballot today."

Has anyone seen this quote?

"I do know I'm ready for the job. And, if not, that's just the way it goes." George W. Bush- Aug. 21, 2000

Well, it's in line with the others I have seen.

One of my favorites is, "Who cares what you think?"

Jo, Alot of people read the Post here in NYC. I see it all over on the subway, etc.

Joe,
you came here new amongst a civilized group who are very welcoming and instead of being gracious and showing gratitude you gave us attitude. And preaching.

So we will not answer your questions until you, the new guest, answer ours first.

What about the 10,000+ dead in Iraq, 990+ dead American Soldiers, their families. Do you think they are loving GW?

What about the questions I asked you above?

No answers til you answer us first. Show some respect then we will respond with respect back.

From TO, which directly links to the Wall Street Journal. The end of the Sandy Berger slime-out by the Repugs:

http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/080104A.shtml

Bottom-feeders all.

WV,

I appreciate your response. I see that in many ways you are seeking to balance the picture for the oppressed Palestinian people and I, too, would like them to be extended the rights that they so sorely deserve, rights that all human beings and creatures deserve as their birthright. I am in full support of this. What I am not in support of (and my husband doesn't necessarily agree with me) is justifying the terrorist actions of Hamas and the other organizations as a justifiable resistance movement, as the Yellow Times editorial seems to.

As an outsider, I can see that Israel has committed grevious actions against the Palestinian peoples. However, I also see that Israel has been forced into a corner by terrorist actions. Each time Peace talks have been instituted, terrorist acts have escalated, so Israel has accordingly escalated. Is this right or wrong? I don't know. I would prefer that Israel did not, but, if they did nothing, I truly believe the Jihadists would not stop but would consider them weak (just as bin Ladin felt about the U.S.).

I would like to respond to a few points that you have made:
1) The Likkud doesn't reflect the Israeli public but, because of the type of government Israel has, they are able to block more mainstream action. The Israeli people want peace. I feel that the ONLY reason they voted Sharon in was because they felt their lives were threatened by suicide bombers.
2) The new plan has, as a beginning point, a withdrawal of a certain amount of settlements. I believe that in order for it to succeed, it has to be done in stages. Whether or not Israel withdraws to the '67 borders will be decided in peace talks, if Hamas ever allows that to happen.
3) My understanding is that when the land of Palestine was divided, half was given to Jews and half given to Palestinina Arabs. My understanding is that the Jews got to work and caused their half to become productive. What happened to the Arab land? Why was Israel attacked 3 separate times by Arab countries? What happened to all of the funding that has been given to the Palestinian peoples, some of which has ended up in Arafat's wive's French bank acct.?
4) If the U.S. had not entered WWII, I hate to consider the consequences.
5) I have not said that you could not criticize Israel. I myself do. I was talking about having a balanced viewpoint where both sides are held accountable. And, as far as that goes, I believe that in some way, Arafat and his handlers have wanted to paint Palestinians as martyrs and victims instead of constructively building a country and negotiating peace with Israel.
If Israel has made this impossible, than I totally agree that Israel is in the wrong. However, I have also seen that, when Israeli popular opinion was in favor of peace (as it still is), Palestinian terrorism did not cease or allow peace talks to proceed.

Lastly, what was it about the Barak's offer to Palestine in 1999 that was unacceptable? Clinton feels that Arafat has seen regretted turning it down.

Sincerely,
Sharon
I

Wow wv, you reference such great articles. Are you an old scholar perhaps (in MT language)? Thank you for the Hastings article. I was googling "Franklin Cover up" yesterday. Now that is really dark. Makes one have to wonder about the elder G Bush. So weird, and this was around the time William Colby died.

On a brighter note, I saw the Bill Maher RealTime show last friday where they begged Nadar not to run. But whatof that show was M Moore talking about "likely" voters. That the current polls the media is using reflect "likely" voters, not actual voters, which I am hoping will bring Kerry into office in a landslide. Then bopping over to read the recommended Koz article, it does give a good picture of what is going on out in the field. Beverly way up above somewhere said Kerry/Edwards were leaving from Muskegon to go to WI? I mean, I am tempted to make the sojourn just to see these guys, to experience the "energy" first hand.

Thank you Sally. Thank you.

I had a wonderful hardback ephemeris that expired end of 1999, it rendered the stations easy to read (for this student anyway). The one I have now leaves me in the dark. Question: when does tMercury begin its station Rx (it goes Rx 8/10) and when does the station end? Also, tPluto goes D on 8/30, or 8/29 (degree of expiation)? Am I correct in assuming Pluto S begins Aug 26th and ends Sep 4th? Mid GOP Convention? I am intrigued with outer planet stations... they're worth watching imho... tPluto has been D, Rx, and now moving D again on Dubya's nSouth Node. Making a point?

Fascinating "Timeline of Corruption of America" over on the Plame thread at DU. Check out entry # 29. Wow.

Thanks Sally.

Hope we all got educated on the Neo-Con-Artist Shell Game of Distraction after that and will 'know' it and recognize it when it comes up in our society. And how to deal with it. The demons will leave when you won't deflect. I am understanding how Arjuna battled his demons. Intellect with Heart is a big, and scary sword to Ignorance.

I am thinking we are in the 'shadow' of merc rx allready. I can feel it, right down to my fingers and type'o's. I meant to say in my previous post that "what stood out from that show for me was Michael Moore speaking about 'likely voters.'"

Got to use that preview button more often.

Cleansed! Sally, thank you ever so much!

Excellent editorial page cartoon in today's Sacramento Bee:

http://www.sacbee.com/content/opinion/cartoons/babin/story/10214155p-11134663c.html

we welcome insightful comments and discussion. to my knowledge there have only been two statements about bush from you , aside from the rhetoric, and they were: we haven't had any more attacks and bush hasn't "pushed the button" , like dems like to believe.
well...the attack, if it was an attack, was done under bushs' watch and the depleted uranium we have let loose in the war will affect armed forces and iraqis alike for years to come.
many of us really don't understand why anyone would vote for bush. we don't understand why he has such a strong base.
if you had given a point of view, a window into your world, it may have sparked a dialog.
astrologers realize that there are many ways an aspect can manifest, and it's always free will.
real people can do many things either to screw up a good aspect or turn the energy of a negative aspect into something good.
a chart isn't some kind of a spell, it's a life in time interacting with all the other lives and cycles of that time etc....
and finally if you knew anything about what we do , not only could you google, you would also have the knowledge of how to easily get the coordinates yourself. this is not private info. you'd have the books , the logorhythms, the atlases.
all of us did not wake up one day and despise george bush. he's has gotten more than the gift of the benefit of the doubt and shown, with his real actions,how unworthy he is as president and man.
i am idealistic enough to want to respect my president but i can't find one single reason to.

Shylurker!
Funny! Oh So wonderfully funnnnny... I set this cartoon as my desktop theme! [don't know how long I'll be able to stand looking at Dubya's buff posterior, so it may be replaced soon]

Thanks for making my day!

blessings upon you joe.
I see soooo much reactionary postings today. Is this what it has come to? Hasn't there been enough of this bickering and constant lobbing of verbal grenades?
I haven't read all of Joe's postings, however, I believe we all have to consider that he has come to this site. Is this not a chance to for us to have a "useful" dialogue with this idealogue? Let him have his arguements. This is the America I served after Vietnam. I volunteered for a military right after that unfortunate war. Our military was not a good place to be. You didn't dare wear your uniform in public for fear of being beaten up. But I wore mine! Let Joe speak in peace. I admire his dedication the concepts he believes are true. There is room for them.
I am an astrologer who comes to this site to read and consider how astrology is being interpreted in a mundane way. And, your right joe, sometimes it does seem that a lot of what is being expressed here is slanted toward what the interpreter hopes for. However, much of what is relied upon for interpretation are still caught up in the old paradigms. Think of astrology as a time piece of our particular solar system. There is order within our small system while in others we are finding there is mostly instability and chaos. "And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night: and let them be for 'signs' and for seasons, and for days, and years: And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give 'light' upon the earth: and it was so." (Gen. 1:14-15).
Joe has said he is a Christian who thinks there is more truth than what is just in the bible. A potential open mind, I believe. A seeker trying to find answers. An opportunity to share our limited beliefs so that he may take what is useful to him with our blessings.
Believe as you like, Joe. For truly, what does this election really have to do with but how our money is spent and for what reasons? We can get caught up in all the rhetoric and platitudes and lose sight of the fact that the candidates are only politicians. And politics is the art of saying what people want to hear while statesmanship is the courage to say what is needed. I believe John Kerry was born for this time. All of his life experience has prepared him for what is at hand. Another war fought because it was wanted rather than needed. I mean, let's face it, if GW had said that he wanted to go into Iraq in order to remove the suffering that twelve years of sanctions and Saddam had created since 1991 to the Iraqi people; and that in doing so, he hoped to establish a position within the Middle East in which to put forth democratic ideas in a region starving for freedom, could anyone have been against it? It's because, once again, our leaders have foisted upon us these lame and trumped up reasons for our sons and daughters to risk there lives in a foriegn land that insults me. John Kerry knows this first hand. If I felt that GW had been honest with me during this whole business, I might consider re-electing him. But he hasn't kept the faith of this American. I'm a registered Democrat with Green leanings, and I say these thing. It's about what has been done with the public trust that is at issue. I say give Kerry a chance. God love you Joe, because I do.

Mark

Jo -
I read the NYPost several times a week. It is a
Murdoch publication so I go to see just how racid
they can get. Murdoch himself called the editor
a couple of weeks ago to say that Gebhart was the
VP selection and they came out with a faux headline. He also owns Faux News....fair and balanced!
Shade -
No I am not a scholar, but since my teens I have
always thought of myself as a teacher/missionary.
I don't mean the latter in a religious sense, but
a spiritual one.I am not into dogma. Must be my Capricorn Sun
Cancer asc/
and Pisces moon. Father/Mother/Nurturer.

...don't make a wave, Rumsfeld in deep do-do...

http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/printer_080204Y.shtml

Sally, Jo and All, thanks for the responses, these time zones always ruin the flow of conversation.

My grandmother, who I barely knew, passed away last week, so it feels a bit strange (long story).

The best news for world politics has been the democratic convention, a shift in energy.
The meeting of the African Union to find an African solution in Sudan, at least it's a start.

Bad news, from todays papers, is that up to 50% of women in Kwa-Zulu Natal, where I live, are HIV positive, thats one in two. It is very scary, the infection rate is increasing, that means we are not beating this virus.

Whatever happens it is a virus inflicted on the body and not the soul. We just have to change our mindsets, rethink what it means to be living with or without the virus, until a cure is found. And not be afraid, I have been struggling with fear of infection, I can only be responsible for my sexual behaviour and not my partner, irrespective of the love and trust in our relationship.

Thanks for this wonderful site that has attracted beautiful and smart souls.

Mark,
I once learned: love everyone, but use discrimination. So I love humanity from afar and allow into my closer sphere just the integral,trustworthy people -who have earned this. Since you have a slanted view by not reading through all the posts, Joe was a baiter and would not play nice, no matter what was said to him. He had an agenda to distract and disrupt.

Neocons are not nice people. They play dirty. In my life I've learned how to level the playing ground with not nice people. They no nothing else, respect nothing else. Bringing up the 'good' person card ain't flying with me anymore when it comes to rotten behavior thrown my way. I will not turn my cheek (on myself) to be abused. Mirroring back the Neo tactics throws the ball of negative energy right back in their court where it belongs.

I am not on Earth to show Joe the Way. But I have learned lessons on earth to see through the BS and then take it to the next level which is to purge the BS. This is the attitude of awareness, it is the attitude of Self-fullness and self containment, this attitude is not Selfish.

i'm sick of talking about Joe.
Karma over.

Azara,
Each time you post I am reminded of how frivolous our concerns here in USA appear when juxtapositioned the 'reality' you are enduring. Our greatest fears are manifest in your world... and you write with such grace and poignancy...

My condolances on the loss of your grandmother --- her passing as well as your not having knowledge of who she was...

We Americans are soooo self-absorbed... riding down the highway I see countless bumperstickers "God Bless America"... indeed! Hasn't God (he/she/it) already blessed Americans to excess!? When will be begin to ask for blessings on others? I did see ONE sticker that read "God bless All Nations" ---

My heart goes out to you and your people... may blessings and light surround you all...

Namaste

Dear Azara, I am so sorry to hear about your grandmother, there are never any words that can truly comfort when there is a loss of a loved one.

I am heart sick to hear of the rise of HIV and can only imagine the fear of infection with which women are living. You are so right that the disease of of the body and not the soul and a personal committment to live without fear is the absolutely best thing you can do.

Something must be done by this country, all the western countries to help Africa, it is essential to the world's well being, to the very soul of the world of all of us.

I imagine you in your town, your home, listening and talking to people and focus my mine on a bubble of white light, health, and safety. I do believe that positive thoughts sent to others helps strengthen. I do know that science has proven that we are all connected by atoms and we can and do communicate through that connection. Take care Azara and what is that line from the movie Star Wars "the force is with you."

bhakti,
I am for the first time in this lifetime beginning to understand what you are talking about... folks who play dirty make the choice to do so... which brings up a thought for the day. Have we a fair and balanced election in our future? Not merely 2004, but ever again?

Twice today I have had an "in your face" message from the universe: first, In Part IV of his "Day of The Dead" election series, Alex Miller-Mignone looks at e-voting and its star-crossed prospects this fall... http://www.daykeeperjournal.com/alex.shtml

Secondly, a diary at Kos "Everyone Should Take Action on Computerized Voting Machines"
by Tocque Deville --- the author suggests we are asleep at the wheel in rehashing the Demo Conv and watching the polls when we should be demanding the removal of computerized voting machines that leave no paper trail...

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/8/1/73028/00509

I did a good bit of 'poll watching' in my younger days... and was considering organizing groups for the state this November when I was struck today that there's not a darn thing a poll watcher can do, for the manner of fraud perpetrated by these machines is not visible to the eye of the watcher! No need to worry about extra 'coaxing' by poll managers of elderly voters or others who ask for help... that's chicken feed compared to the potential numbers stolen by today's technology.

So, don't shoot the messenger, but I'm beginning to wonder if what Sally and some others are seeing (or not 'seeing') for Nov 2nd is blatant, flagrant fraud, the kind the Neocons do so skillfully...

Namaste

Azara, blessings and grace be upon you and all. I send you my love and visualize you and all healed and at peace. So be it.

And if flagrant, blatant fraud is what gets Bush back in Office, I can almost guarantee his Impeachment and Removal from Office within 6 months after the Inauguration. There's only so much Republicans can explain away or excuse.

Jonathan,
Thank you! I needed a blast of cold water to get my focus back! Too much tSaturn on my Cancer stellium... most of the time I can beat the fear away with a stick... but seem to mislaid my stick!

Namaste

Jo,

Looks like you've found it! Now if only you could learn to harness TSaturn on your Stellium and work WITH it, you'd be in great shape! :-)

Jonathan,
No fair --- I thought you were a "newbie" --- holding out on us, huh!?

I try... been a compressed summer, full of family/dharma/karma, and it's winding down (or at least tSaturn is moving off)... just in time for stuff on the macro level, right?!

Namaste

Jo,

I am SUCH a Newbie! It feels almost like a sham even posting on this board! I just learned that a Square can be a "good thing" and a Trine can be a "bad thing". Who knew? I have TONS and TONS and TONS to learn. My goal is to learn how to let the astrological energies present (whether we're aware of them or not) HELP me, not run my life. I know, big goals ... but I'm a 0 degree Aries Sun with a Leo Rising and a Taurus Moon right next to (but not conjunct) a Taurus Midheaven! I always dream big. LOL

WV,

Sorry if I have offended you in any way. I took note of the fact that you have a Cancer asc, a Pisces moon and a Capricorn sun. Well, I have a Pisces sun (0) and a Cancer Ascendent (10), so we are probably very much alike -- we are just looking at two sides of the same coin. (As a matter of fact I have my moon conj pluto in Leo opp Mercury in Aquarius...I have always been a fighter for truth and fairness).

As Joe said, I think both sides are wrong... and both sides are right. They each want the same thing - the ability to have a self-realized life filled with love, health, happiness and respect. I guess the best thing we can do is pray for peace, for love and for understanding, and hope that the hardliners on both sides soften to the point that they can have agreement. After all, the great Spirit that many call G-d, some call "the Universe," is the only judge and we learn through our mistakes, painful as they may be.

Peace be with you,
Sharon

* Detained, abused, beaten, tortured, raped: Iraq's child prisoners

A Sunday Herald investigation has discovered that coalition forces are holding more than 100 children in jails such as Abu Ghraib. Witnesses claim that the detainees - some as young as 10 - are also being subjected to rape and torture

Reprinted from The Sunday Herald (Glasgow): http://www.sundayherald.com/43796

Who would Jesus rape!! Who would Jesus torture!! Is that what Jesus meant by "Suffer the little children?!" IS IT?!?!?!! This is the one behavior of a series of disasterous behaviors that tips my boat beyond all recall. The only behavior left by US/UK govts' sick, sick indulgences is cannibalism & they may be doing that as well.

Does anyone have Kerry's birth time? I have his birthday and location. I have Bush's Data: 07/06/46, 7:46AM, New Haven, CT. The accuracy rating is "A" but don't know where this comes from exactly.

Would be very grateful for a chart of Barak who, intuition tells me, will one day be president.

Apreciatively,

Lynne Murguia

Thanks for that insightful comment! It makes interesting reading, especially when I need a cash advance.

Thanks for that insightful comment! It makes interesting reading, especially when I need a payday loan .

What a bunch of shit! Well its well past the election and you touchy, feely, artistic, historically challenged retards where wrong again. You see the moon was in orbit around a star, planet combination. It wasn't in a house, dumb ass. Astrology had a place back when our average I Q was 20, (using today’s 100 value) because they had nothing else to go by, and where to stupid to think anything legitimate up. And you’re still using it. Do you also ride a donkey? Do you spend 20 hours a week doing laundry? Did you vote for Kerry? Then your a humanity hating, Pol Pot loving, America loathing, commie retard. Move On to North Korea and eat rats while fat man Kim dumb shit tells you it’s the people’s revolution. Don’t sit there; go now live your commie dream. And leave my
American dream alone.

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http://www.founcorp.com/acer-laptop-battery/BTP-39D1.asp BTP-39D1
http://www.founcorp.com/acer-laptop-battery/BTP-43D1.asp BTP-43D1
http://www.founcorp.com/acer-laptop-battery/BTP-44A3.asp BTP-44A3
http://www.founcorp.com/clevo-laptop-battery/87-D408S-495.asp 87-D408S-495
http://www.founcorp.com/compaq-laptop-battery/134110.asp 134110
http://www.founcorp.com/clevo-laptop-battery/M22BAT-8.asp M22BAT-8
http://www.founcorp.com/compaq-laptop-battery/196345-B21.asp 196345-B21
http://www.founcorp.com/compaq-laptop-battery/DG105A.asp DG105A
http://www.founcorp.com/compaq-laptop-battery/E500.asp E500
http://www.founcorp.com/compaq-laptop-battery/N400C.asp N400C
http://www.founcorp.com/compaq-laptop-battery/N600.asp N600
http://www.founcorp.com/css/toshiba-laptop-battery.asp toshiba-laptop-battery
http://www.founcorp.com/dell-laptop-battery/01X284.asp 01X284
http://www.founcorp.com/dell-laptop-battery/1194.asp 1194
http://www.founcorp.com/dell-laptop-battery/7T093.asp 7T093
http://www.founcorp.com/toshiba-laptop-battery/PA3285U.asp PA3285U
http://www.founcorp.com/toshiba-laptop-battery/PA3098U.asp PA3098U
http://www.founcorp.com/toshiba-laptop-battery/PA3009.asp PA3009
http://www.founcorp.com/toshiba-laptop-battery/PA2487UR.asp PA2487UR
http://www.founcorp.com/toshiba-laptop-battery/PA2451URN.asp PA2451URN
http://www.founcorp.com/sony-laptop-battery/BPZ52.asp BPZ52
http://www.founcorp.com/sony-laptop-battery/BPS3.asp BPS3
http://www.founcorp.com/sony-laptop-battery/BPs2.asp BPs2
http://www.founcorp.com/sony-laptop-battery/BPs1.asp BPs1
http://www.founcorp.com/sony-laptop-battery/BP71.asp BP71
http://www.founcorp.com/sony-laptop-battery/BP51p.asp BP51p
http://www.founcorp.com/sony-laptop-battery/BP51B.asp BP51B
http://www.founcorp.com/sony-laptop-battery/BP2v.asp BP2v
http://www.founcorp.com/sony-laptop-battery/BP2T.asp BP2T
http://www.founcorp.com/sony-laptop-battery/BP2S.asp BP2S
http://www.founcorp.com/sony-laptop-battery/BP2R.asp BP2R
http://www.founcorp.com/sony-laptop-battery/BP2N.asp BP2N
http://www.founcorp.com/sony-laptop-battery/BP2E.asp BP2E
http://www.founcorp.com/sansung-laptop-battery/P28-battery.asp P28-battery
http://www.founcorp.com/ibm-laptop-battery/92P1101.asp 92P1101
http://www.founcorp.com/ibm-laptop-battery/92P0999.asp 92P0999
http://www.founcorp.com/ibm-laptop-battery/92P0998.asp 92P0998
http://www.founcorp.com/ibm-laptop-battery/02K7072.asp 02K7072
http://www.founcorp.com/ibm-laptop-battery/02k7039.asp 02k7039
http://www.founcorp.com/ibm-laptop-battery/02K7018.asp 02K7018
http://www.founcorp.com/ibm-laptop-battery/02K6928.asp 02K6928
http://www.founcorp.com/ibm-laptop-battery/02K6793.asp 02K6793
http://www.founcorp.com/ibm-laptop-battery/02K6769.asp 02K6769
http://www.founcorp.com/ibm-laptop-battery/02k6651.asp 02k6651
http://www.founcorp.com/ibm-laptop-battery/02K6620.asp 02K6620
http://www.founcorp.com/ibm-laptop-battery/02K6614.asp 02K6614
http://www.founcorp.com/hp-laptop-battery/ZV5000.asp ZV5000
http://www.founcorp.com/hp-laptop-battery/ZD8000.asp ZD8000
http://www.founcorp.com/hp-laptop-battery/PM579A.asp PM579A
http://www.founcorp.com/hp-laptop-battery/PB994A.asp PB994A
http://www.founcorp.com/hp-laptop-battery/F4809A.asp F4809A
http://www.founcorp.com/hp-laptop-battery/F4486A.asp F4486A
http://www.founcorp.com/hp-laptop-battery/F2299A.asp F2299A
http://www.founcorp.com/hp-laptop-battery/F2024.asp F2024