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WHO’S YOUR DADDY
The empires of the future are the empires of the mind (Winston Churchill)
This is delicious. The State of the Union (SOU) timing is absolutely delicious. First of all the SOU speech is to be delivered on January 20, 2004 at 9:00pm EST, the exact day of the 2000 Inaugural Solar Return (01.21.2004 5:28am) and what a year that Solar Return promises. Second the SOU is an administration’s belief of the SOU, what they want You to believe about their work, how and what they will present what they believe is coming up for the nation, not necessarily what is actually happening (remember last year and their "Iraq is poised to drop a bomb tomorrow" tone.
George Bush will try to project himself as a visionary, but it will be all hubris, “full of sound and fury signifying nothing.” With transiting Neptune inconjunct the US natal Sun, people won’t believe or trust him, not even the ones who want to trust him. Even if they swear they do, they don’t. Neptune is also barreling down on his Sun putting him slightly off the mark, because he won’t believe what he is saying.
Jupiter is conjunct the Ascendant at 18 Virgo (retrograde) squaring Pluto in the 4th house (it will be squaring when it goes direct and hits that point in June.) This aspect is a “gonna save the world” aspect. What do you want? This administration will literally promise all of us the “moon.” Unfortunately the Moon at 19 degrees Capricorn has already moved away from the propitious trine to Jupiter, so their luck is off there. No Moon, no way, no how, but it won’t stop them from telling us their tall tales, and how they can deliver all we would ever want or need and his administration is just going to pick up that bill. NOT!!!
Last year Neptune contacts were pouring “snake oil” all over the SOU, not so this year. Jupiter in Virgo, in a square to Pluto, hyperbole abounds. We will hear BIG plans, BIG talk, grandiose chest thumping schemes resulting in BIG fools, BIG fall. Jupiter will return to square Pluto in the 4th and only to find there isn’t money for those BIG plans, and the people are going to want them to “show us the money.” The Jupiter square also indicates that they don’t know the State of the Union, it’s all razzle dazzle.
After last year’s debacle of Iraq’s WMD’s it’s doubtful we will be treated to pictures of George pouring over his pre-SOU speech word for word, line for line. With Mars and Pluto in the 3rd house last year in Sagittarius and Jupiter in Leo the spin-doctors were having a hay day, none of that this year. Pluto is in Sagittarius in the 4th house and in a just separating trine to Mars at 21 Aries, the key phrase is “separating.” No long term help, just the hype and swagger going into the speech.
At this point I should mention the Moon at 19 degrees Capricorn, and in two months it will square Mars at 21 Aries revealing the anger that is truly afflicting the State of the Union. With the Moon and Saturn in a mutual reception, there is a possibility this speech galvanizes, to new heights, the people who want him out. Saturn at 8 degrees Cancer hits GWB’s Saturn/North Node midpoint (Isolation for him)
Look for Saturn to hit 19 degrees Cancer opposing the Moon and Chiron, then 21 degrees Cancer, squaring Mars, all this will be later in the year and create much frustration for this administration.
A convoluted Chiron with Moon in an applying conjunction and square to Mars and Mars conjunct the USA Chiron with a Pluto trine. I would say “healing through our wounds” but beginning to heal.
There is something about medicine with Venus in the 6th house trine Saturn in the 10th. Perhaps more money thrown after an Aids cure or Cancer and that could turn out successful, that’s my dream. At worst this aspects indicate the pharmaceuticals are winning solid gains, nonetheless, you can count on Health Care being on the agenda of this speech. Oh, and the “you all are gonna get married and be happy” won’t lead the masses to the alter. (I wonder if Colorado’s “family first” Governor who is separated and rumored to be having an affair, might want to go to some of the classes.)
Sorry I digress.
These are the highlights of this speech as it stands alone except look for some type of further restrictions in a few days from the Patriots Act. We had some of that with the new airport security system of fingerprinting and profiling folks.
Now let’s go to the 2000 Inaugural Chart (ING) it’s Solar Return (SR) Progressed (P) and the SOU Speech.
A couple of glaring connections from these charts, ING Venus is on the SOU Descendant, and has progressed to 20 degrees Pisces, placing it in a square to Pluto, as is the Solar Arc Venus - a double whammy. The SOU speech is not going to go down well as the year progresses, with our Allies (if we have any left) Progressed Venus is also coming to a square to the US Natal Mars and opposition to our Natal Neptune just as Pluto is opposing the US Mars and squaring Natal Neptune.
As I stated in my 2004 article, Pluto to Mars/Neptune has never been a positive transit. On this transit we’ve seen the burning of the White House in 1814, the Great SF Earthquake in 1906, Assassinations in 1968 and now we are holding our breath in 2004. Whatever it is, it will happen on GWB’s and the Republican Party’s watch. I will again state that I don’t think there will be a terrorist attack unless designed and implemented by our government.
In the SR and Progressed chart for the 2000 Inauguration both Moons are at 24’41” Capricorn, both are VOC and both will arrive at the ING Midheaven and an opposition to GWB’s Saturn in a couple of months, further hardening the people’s attitude toward him, most importantly, both Moons have passed the trine to ING Saturn, some of his protection has been removed, and both Moons will pass a trine to ING Jupiter by the end of July. Mr. Bush’s serious problems will begin right before the Republican National Convention.
The United States, the Republican Party, and George Bush all have their Sun at 13/14 degrees Cancer. The Republican Party has their Venus at 11 degrees Cancer in a square to Saturn at 11 degrees Libra, very close to the US Saturn at 14 degrees Libra. Mark your calendars for the last two weeks in May and the first two weeks in June as more than troublesome for all of us. I can promise that when life becomes really troublesome for the US, it will become really really troublesome for Bush and the Republican Party.
There are clues in the past that would hint at the trouble. One of the major clues to me is on August 24, 1814 when the White House was attacked, Saturn was conjunct the US Pluto and Pluto was squaring the US Mars/Neptune configuration. While we as astrologers are looking at George Bush’s second Saturn return in the fall of 2004, less discussed is Saturn’s opposition to the US Pluto. I don’t mean to indicate that the White House would be burnt or attacked by outside forces, but there could be a “scorched earth” philosophy going on in the White House, let’s see.
I am not ready to say whether Mr. Bush will be re-elected (depends on the authenticity of the voting machines) I am ready to say that his ride is getting bumpier and bumpier and I am ready to say that if he does win by May or June of 2005 he will be on his way out, as well as his administration.
Hopefully other astrologers will write about the State of the Union and Inaugural Return, it is impossible in one article to gather in all that is happening. There are so many aspects, so many midpoints, so many asteroids, black holes, and fixed stars being activated that if I addressed them all this would become a book.
The next 18 months will be a defining moment in US History and it will affect the rest of the world. George Bush is only a symbol of the great shift occurring. I’ve heard astrologers and psychics say that this year is our last chance to salvage what we can of America, I don’t believe that to be true.
A quote from the Revolutionary War was “If the vote of the people could actually change things, voting would be illegal.” But we can change things; we the people have changed things throughout history. This isn’t our last chance to get back America, this is our opportunity to make America what in the shape of the ideals, not what we’ve become.
As time is measured we have gone an inch in our evolution as a country. We are within grasp of cutting off the head of the Hydra and smashing her tentacles that are choking us to death. This period of time will have to be played out.
The early Hippie Movement in the 60’s was a response to the hypocrisy being played out in families, religion, corporations, before it morphed into a focus on Vietnam and drugs and free love. Prior to that it was the Beatniks who had dropped away from the phony mainstream and tried to find authenticity and they morphed into the Hippies, still looking for authenticity. A person, a country cannot find authenticity until they first see the fraud.
George Bush is not the problem, he is simply a symbol of the “fraud” the lies, the corruption, the superficiality, the hypocrisy, the imitation of what we were, a symbol for how low we fell. And there are symbols we can look toward right now on high we can climb.
There are town meetings all over this country discussing these problems; this is good. There are 18 year olds getting involved in the democratic process; this is good. There are city governments making the Patriots Act illegal in their town; this is good. There are people who never read a legislative bill in their life, reading House and Senate Bills; this is good. We have a Black Woman (well she dropped out) and Black Man step up to the plate to say “I have a right to try and be President of the United States and be taken seriously;” this is good.
All over this country we are talking about how we feel about pre-emptive war, empire building, where our money is being spent, judgmental behavior, mainstream religion, corporate corruption, our ethics, how we feel about immigration, how we feel about what we call the “democratic process,” who are the people we have put into office, what is their accountability, would our government hurt us for their own agenda; all of this is good.
Do I like this administration? No! Am I happy about what they are forcing us to define and stand up for? Yes! So take heart, the run is on and we get to participate, we get to demand our voices be heard, and if they aren’t heard, we get to yell louder. This is happening all over the world, this is good.
As Saturn in Cancer tries to reign in freedom and spontaneity, the inconjunct from Neptune to the US Sun (and Bush and the Republican Party) will thwart and dissolve their best-laid plans. Plus Uranus is going to trine the US Venus and Jupiter, telling us “don’t worry, be happy,” resulting in the people being sick and tired of the generated fear by our own Homeland Security. THIS IS GOOD.
IOWA CAUCUS UPDATE
I was wrong, it wasn't Dean and Edwards, instead Kerry and Edwards. Saturn sitting on Howard Dean's Asc. certainly didn't help him much and I have expected him to run into problems about now. One disturbing indication of this initial run is the people still seem to be afraid of moving too far away from the mainstream and Washington. Unfortunately Dean cannot afford to nurse his wounds for long, NH is looming and Clark has a big leg up. Dean has a well run organization behind him and he can come back from this. It is nice to see John Edwards well received, he's tried hard to run a clean campaign and he deserves this boost.
Sally Cheyne McDonald on Jan 19 |
Link
Sally,
Absolutely wonderful article. The time and talent it took you to share this info with us is not only admirable, but greatly appreciated. I look forward to revisiting your thoughts and interpretations in a day or two when I can better focus and savor each words and wonderfully turned phrase.
Excellent work!
Jonathan
Sally, excellent, excellent, no, outstanding! Thank you so much! I'm sending the link to all my friends and family. You're the best, and I don't mean that lightly.
Wonderful to read your article, Sally. Perhaps America will turn from the shadows back into the light. Many of us are holding that thought and received renewed hope while reading your article and enjoying the analysis.
Yes, Sally, you ARE the best. I love the way you relate the aspects with such narrative, story-telling style. I also think your interpretations are so insightful, while being somewhat guarded as to how the possibilities can manifest. Thank you for your hard work. Only 2 points I want to make: I think that this year IS a defining moment for the US. The world's peoples have given us this chance to stand up, and they are watching. If we can show them that we do have equality and peace in our hearts, we can transform the hatred and contempt directed at our nation. THIS IS IT, I firmly believe it, and the evolution of our universe is dependent upon the choices made THIS YEAR. 2nd point: don't ya'll just love that cutie pie John Edwards? :) My mom thinks he's the Kennedy of our times. I just think he's a doll, and am very pleased about his showing in Iowa and the "support" by Kucinich.
Thanks Peg for the kind words. Defining moment? There have been so many "defining moments" in history, this is one, but there will be more, many more. In recent history 2000 election, 9/11, Afghan, Iraq these were all defining moments in history and will be seen as such. This year will be another, the question is "when was THE defining moment?" Was it when Bush, Sr. was elected, or perhaps Reagan. Was it when we gave the Iran/Contra basically a by. Was it when we gave Prescott Bush with his ties to the Nazi's a by. When was it and will history be able to pin point the exact time. According to the Myans, the defining moment comes in 2012, the Hopi's, it came in 1998, the Chinese, it hasn't arrived, and the hippies, it came with the age of Aquarius. I think everyday, every minute is the moment for us all.
In 1998 or 99 I read an article in People's Mag about John Edwards and thought then he could be a presidential possible, he may "look" a bit young to the electorate. When he looks too young and immature to be president to my 30 something colleagues then I think that might be a problem for him in the long run.
I was wrong about Iowa, I really thought it looked like Dean and Edwards, Dean needs to learn something from all this or he will fade fast but Iowa had the aspects to deliver a surprise and they did.
Thank you, Sally, for the wonderful article. I was looking forward to this. There are so many strands and threads, it takes a master to see the patterns. And you both show the patterns and explain them beautifully. Bush's whole life has consisted of making messes and then profiting anyway, while someone else pays and cleans up. No wonder he smirks! All hubris, yes! About the billion or so to "promote" marriage: a right-wing fundamentalist who got state money to do that in Missouri is now the head of Florida's Dept. of Fam & Children's Services. The kids in the system are as bad off as ever. The "marriage promotion" stuff is just another way of moving tax money that should be spent on health care, decent housing, etc. into the pockets of right-wing religious Bush backers. By the way, I notice transiting Mars is at the top of Bush's natal chart on SOU night. I'm sure he'll think he is wonderful.
This is good: Democrats in the state with the highest literacy rate, the highest education level, and one of the highest level of citizens in the armed services/reserves ... these Democrats chose a candidate based on both his positions and HIS ABILITY TO WIN AGAINST BUSH. This is unheard of for Democrats anywhere. It's about time. The scene of participatory democracy was so compelling and the race so exciting, even the negativist cable network talking heads dropped their bought-and-paid-for cynicism for an evening and just enjoyed themselves while covering a little news. Something magic happened in Iowa, something that will benefit all of us.
Mike what a great post thank you so much for that update and you are right, this is exciting.I also heard that there was a terrific turn out, unusually large. I hope this is a sign that Dems across the nation will be turning out in record numbers
Just learned that a drive was launched today in Europe by expat americans to promote the 2004 absentee vote for those living in foreign lands. The release said the drive is being launched because so many were distressed by Bush's policies.
The magic and the turnout was because of Dean.
The participatory democracy was because of Dean.
The intense coverage was because of Dean.
Does anyone here think there would have been excitement, even as cute as some people think Edwards is, without Dean?
Picture a race with Kerry, Edwards, and Gephardt and then try to stay awake.
How well do any of you think the aforementioned would have withstood the onslaught of attack from inside and outside the party?
Saturn = if it don't kill you, it'll make you strong. And I guess that's the gift the gods have to offer, because it will take enormous strength to heal this country after what has been done to it.
The testing phase is now, and I think the man's up to it.
Dean is feeling Saturn in a serious way.
From Krugman:
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/20/opinion/20KRUG.html
Going for Broke
According to advance reports, George Bush will use tonight's State of the Union speech to portray himself as a visionary leader who stands above the political fray. But that act is losing its effectiveness. Mr. Bush's relentless partisanship has depleted much of the immense good will he enjoyed after 9/11. He is still adored by his base, but he is deeply distrusted by much of the nation.
Mr. Bush may not understand this; indeed, he still seems to think that he's another Lincoln or F.D.R. "No president has done more for human rights than I have," he told Ken Auletta.
But his political handlers seem to have decided on a go-for-broke strategy: confuse the middle one last time, energize the base and grab enough power that the consequences don't matter.
What do I mean by confusing the middle? The striking thing about the "visionary" proposals floated in advance of the State of the Union is their transparent cynicism and lack of realism. Mr. Bush has, of course, literally promised us the Moon — and Mars, too. And the ever-deferential media have managed to keep a straight face.
More.....
bbuster, excellent observations and you are right, it's Dean who has generated the excitment and moved the Dems to their feet, made them aware of the issues. It is a testing phase for us and individually for Dean and I hope you are right that the guy is up to it.
Sally, your articles always feel like a birthday present, no matter what day it is. Thank you! I agree that Dean is the catalyst. Iowa had a 95% voter turnouot - the largest in history! Glad Gephardt is out, but I can't understand why people are believing Kerry (except that Iowa is heavily military and he has a good record there) after he remained silent while Bush gutted the environment, not to mention voting for the war, tax cuts and Patriot Act. Peoples' memories are so short in this country. I'd take Kerry over Bush with glee, but Dean and Edwards are the ones who stand out to me. I doubt Edwards can maintain campaign funds, and I don't think he has the boys to beat Bush, but Dean sure does. We need a fighter, after 3 years of being abandoned by the likes of Kerry and Gephardt in Washington.
Sally, everyone has voiced my feelings about your present article. So I add one more word to describe your piece---Brilliant.
Beautiful article, Sally. I hadn't thought of doing an Inaugural solar return. An excellent idea. One transit that adds to the general thrust of what you said in your article is the current station of Jupiter opposite Inaugural Venus, chart ruler. This adds to Bush's grandiose plans (the Moon, etc) and his success at putting that out for the moment.
The beginning of this Neptune quincunx is also very interesting, and the delusional Moon/Mars plans fit right in there as well. I think the people will be duped briefly, and he will get rave reviews for this speech. But then the deceit will show and disillusionment will set in more firmly than ever.
Pluto is currently sextile Bush's Venus, and his progressed Moon is square his Venus. So he will get some bump in approval and some believers in the short run for this speech. Happily, these aspects pass in a few days as does Jupiter opposite Inaugural Venus.
Hi all, just sneaking into the St. Petersburg library to comment on the Iowa caucus last night. I only have 30 mins at the computer. So was that an upset last night or what? Remember my birthday new moon research that I did on the Dem candidates, when I said that Dean was one of the candidates who didn't have one, and that if he won in the Primaries, that I'll have to go back to the drawing board with my b'day/new moon research? I also remember receiving a snide remark from shylurker I believe, who said that I will have to go back to the drawing board. Well, it looks like my research is paying off. Just to refresh memories, the candidates who had new moon birthdays were Kerry, Clark, Braun, and non-candidate Hillary. In fact, I think Nancy and I were the only two here who were positive about Kerry. I don't think Dean is out of the race yet, but if he ends up losing the nomination, I'll continue my research into the birthday new moon prediction. If one of my new moon Dem candidates manages to be elected President in 2004, the others with the new moons in their charts will, I feel, be given posts in the new administration, like VP etc. Hillary may even accept one of those. I was really disappointed that she didn't run.
They have state of the art LCD flat screen monitors at this library, so I may sneak in again to read and post more frequently. My computer is far from being up and running, and I'm supposed to be looking for a job, but I miss this forum so much, that I couldn't resist checking in.
I see lots of new articles have been written, but I haven't had time to read them. Hope all those who are in the cold climes are managing to keep warm. Morgana, hope you're managing to stay out of trouble :)
I'll be back later on to read more. Later guys.
I'll tell you Nancy there is so much in these two charts, plus the US it's impossible to put it all together in one article, so feel free to add all you see. Bush has some really great aspects on election day but he has to get from here to there and that's the question. There are some health questions I have, particularly with his SA Saturn squaring his progressed Uranus and Pluto aspecting that and Saturn not only conj his Sun but Sirius as well. It's still a long road to the election has he has to navigate it as do we all.
I too feel a little sad that more people did not connect with Dean. No matter the end result, I think it is really important to continue to have a catalyst to shake people out of their complacency and apathy thinking the government will run things without them showing up and taking any responsibility. The world is ruled by those who make the effort to show up and speak up.
of course sally's articles are always a present..well said!
i was pretty impressed with kerry last nite and the message he has..i am still for dean, but the fist-rib-punching in the air isn't appealing..or atleast he didn't look good in the past few days - a bit like a reumatic boxer...god i know i'm being such a virgo! i liked kerry's, "we're coming, you're going and don't let the door hit you on the way out." felt it actually COULD be more effective on the cheney gangsters than outright anger. i mean do you fight with an insane person? no, you just put him away. but would kerry concede to a stolen election? yes, would dean (the scorpio), no way in hell....but personally i could never vote for kerry as he voted for the war, but from what i saw last nite, he did seem to have the right stuff more than anyone else.
right on with sally's prediction of the surprise element for last nite, that 'came true'...any predictions in regards to new hampshire? i can't recall...
I look forward to reading the articles and comments on this site and each and every time I do I find myself grateful for all the insightfulness. I couldn’t agree more with Lucy with regard to her perceptive views of Gephardt and Kerry and in my humble opinion Lieberman. So many Democrats just sat silently by while Cheney/Pearle/Bush pressured and bullied. For the most part the Democrats became a timid bunch of “Go-Along Get-Alongs”as the Bush Cartel fiddled and America burned. While the Democrats were unable or unwilling to hold Bush accountable the American press appallingly aided and abetted the Bush Cartel with no investigative journalism. One certainly has to give Governor Dean his due. He stood-up and spoke out when a majority of Democrats were to intimidated to utter a dissenting word. I hope the eventual Democratic nominee will have it in them to be a rough and tumble street fighter. They will have to be capable of placing Bushes feet to the fire because the right wing will bring out it’s enormously funded arsenal of dirty tricks, lies and poison to direct at them. By the By . . .. Michael Moore is now calling Bush a deserter and rightfully so . . .You go Mike!
A very good article if anyone is inclined to read. .
Masterful Machiavellianism
Southern Style
by Rebecca Knight
Machiavellianism: The political doctrine of Machiavelli, which denies the relevance of morality in political affairs and holds that craft and deceit are justified in pursuing and maintaining political power.
http://www.buzzflash.com/southern/04/01/sou04002.html
What all the hype and hoopla about shrub's union
address? Last year was full of of lies, was it 10 or 20? This year is not going to be any different;
bunch of another 20 lies to cover last year's lies
I'm not going to waste my time the useless speech
full of lies from a corrupt liar!Gimme a break!
America wake up from being totally brainwashed!
Absolutely Raj.
The 215th State of the Union January 20th, 2004
House Office Building, Washington DC
He was introduced at 9:06pm EST and again at 9:10EST by the Speaker.
George W Bush began to speak at 9:11EST.
He started with the fear factor. The Republicans cheered. The Democrats were silent.
Have at it astrologers.
bbuster, you're right. Dean was the lightening rod! He did some serious cage rattling before it became fashionable. However, there is a world of difference between Kerry (calling for 'regime change in Washington' during the war) and Lieberman and the other silent Dems. Dean did provided a wonderful service in a -cause- that is beyond any individual. His regrettable self-destruction last night was almost kharmic since it is his time to setp aside after his role is complete. I went back and re-read Nancy's piece on Kerry. I is interesteding how the hard aspects over the next few months are seen as strengthening his efforts. Which ever candidate emerges (other than Lieberman or Sharpton) will emerge giving us (and the planet) one last chance at sanity.
All of the same-old/same-old Dems voted for the war and the so-called Patriot Act. For his part, Kerry did once a long time ago supposedly throw his war medals away in protest. Turns out, or so I was told, he kept his war medals; instead he threw away those of someone else. Kerry was a member of Skull and Bones. Etc. Sure, I can vote for him as ABBB. But that's just about all the enthusiasm I can muster. Thanks for letting me vent. Carville, with the traditional Dems, is already taunting Dean. I wish we could rescue the Democratic Party from the established order which has let us down so badly. Only after Dean fired up the grassroots did anything happen.
It is Tues night Jan 20 and I watched CNN doing the "color" before the pResident's entrance and noticed they carefully avoided mentioning last year's speech with its Niger Uranium lie and the fallout from that, not to mention the other lies. I heard Bush's first few minutes and his theme seemed to be "Everything's coming up roses." Earlier this evening was at the meeting room in a public library with a group of women watching "Uncovered- the Whole truth about the Iraq War." If you are interested in buying VCR or DVD check out
http://www.truthuncovered.com Anyhow there was a sign on the meeting room door announcing the film we were watching. Someone who was in the library pushed a note through the double-doors with a bomb threat. Personally I believe it an idle threat, but the anger and attempt to intimidate were certainly real. Re the election, Sally, you mention that Bush has some really great aspects on election day--do any of the Democratic candidates have aspects as good or better? I sure do hope so.
I'm with you, Skylurker... Kerry is a DLC, skull n' bones, rich, pink-supremacist republicrat. I wonder if Iowa wasn't swarming with same. It reminded me in its "smell" of the 2000 dyselection Florida. I don't believe it was an up n' up caucus election. I think it was another acted-out script.
I must admit that I find it highly offensive to read someone saying Kerry is a DLC, skull n' bones, rich (why is rich a bad thing?), pink-supremacist (!!!!) republicrat. How do you know this? Are you sure? Would it be fair for me to say that those who live out on the West Coast are liberal, granola-eating, air heads who can't dress and wear their hair high above their heads in overly hairsprayed nests? And are stupid, to boot? Of course it wouldn't! Generalizations are always unfair. And I wouldn't do that! If you're THAT against Kerry, then keep your ass at home on Election Day and keep your whiney ill-informed complaints TO YOURSELF when your inexcusable inaction and stupidity help BelzeeBush get re-elected. The Republicans are counting on people like you to help their guy get back in office. Misplaced principles, they call it. I pray to God or Goddess that you're smart enough to realize that ANYONE OF THESE GUYS is vastly better than the pathetic and dangerous joke in the White House.
Or maybe I just shouldn't have watched the SOTU speech. Bush always gets me fuming.
to fuming, noname..so am i!!!!!
and to see that hillary get up and applaud bush saying sadam was no longer a threat to us, US< makes me so sick!!!!! god that woman is so gross!!! i finally have to say i regret having to vote for her..atleast that other long island jerk TOLD YOU what side he was on and didn't lie about it! it's so obvious she wants bush to win so she can run in 2008, all i can say is that i'm sure she'll meet the same fate as that blasphemous disgusting pig of an unelected president!!!
and the dems were too soft. of course what they said was true afterward, BUT< this is a man who lied on every single issue! how can he NOT BE IMPEACHED FOR LYING LIKE THAT!!!!!! and to have bill impeached for a blow job!!!!!! what the hell is going on around here???????
and the media respects this lying demon..in the bible (which bush doesn't read), it says satan is the greatest liar, that's GWB!!!!! and talking about going into the middle east..did everyone get that one!!!!!! maybe he's really the anti-christ will sit in the thrown at jerusalem and declare himself god, that fucking pig. and to say he respects those faiths when all three faiths (yes even some interpretations of islam), ARE AGAINST KILLING...
sally, i hope to god that your reading is true in that no one buys it! BUT the few bozos abc talked to were ok with the speech! i'm going into the bridge biz, and targeting bush supporters.i should be rich in about a week...oh and hillary supporters too..jonathan, i hope you had a wake up call when she got up and applauded that...come ON NOW!!!!!!!
No. DLC republicrats are the same. There is not a savior among them... not one. Dean/Moveonorg broke out from the DLC republicrats, along with several other dem orgs & groups. They & the repubs didn't like that. DLC republicrats will try with everything in them, along with the repubs, to keep the status quo... fascist corporatism/capitalism. Anyone but bush is NOT a great idea. I'm reminded of ANOTHER old saying: Dang & ohmygosh!! I just jumped out of the frying pan & into the fire!! Dean will be made stronger & smarter--& angrier--by this Iowa event. He knows.
It's also my considered opinion that includes, from where I stand, the unspoken, unadmitted rampant racism & genderism that continues on in a country of tremendous diversity & which INFECTS EVERY SINGLE behavior & policy. And THAT is also a truth.
The only "white" is albino... occurring in every species. In western culture, "white" is accepted as a symbol of pure, good, right, chaste, holy, superior. How very socially, economically, & polically convenient for the group that maintains, in one way or another, its supremacy over all others. They are ruddy-brown-pink... just another "person of color" along with everybody else & in no way supreme or superior. That is also a truth.
How many people of "other" color been president of the US? How many of them have been women? A fluke, you may say?! No. Way past time for some "other" experiences to speak in high, well-paid, powerful leadership. There are plenty from which to choose. And that is a truth.
Another truth... thank you, Pat. The truth of unspoken forced conscripted military participation or draft (now labeled "banned from leaving")... a "new" policy in this assault- & mass genocidal-"happy" country (not a new activity)... in an illegal conflict (as if any of them could be truly legal) rooted in base lies. Most of the conscripted are people of "other" color... NOT economically well-off & not in positions of power. Say! I wonder how THAT got to be?! ;O)
I found it far too difficult to watch the pompous GWB recite the bombastic manipulative SOU knowing it was spawned from the darkest recesses of the mind of Chief White House Nazi “Carl Rove”. . .I refused to subject myself to such an avalanche of deceptive Bull****. What I did watch was the reaction of many American citizens that were interviewed immediately afterwards. “Now That Was The Real Downer”. We have been turned into a nation of mindless/non-questioning, frightened sheep. In the quotes below just replace Hitler with Bush and Germany with America .
God gave the savior to the German people. We have faith, deep and unshakeable faith, that he [Hitler] was sent to us by God to save Germany.
-Hermann Göring
We believe that the Fuhrer is fulfilling a divine mission to German destiny! This belief is beyond challenge.
-Rudolf Hess
AND LAST BUT NOT LEAST
“Why of course the people don't want war. Why should some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece? Naturally the common people don't want war; neither in Russia, nor in England, nor in America, nor in Germany. That is understood. But after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country”
-Hermann Göring during his trial in Nuremberg
I managed to stomach just enough Dubya screen time to watch the State of the Union Address from beginning to end.
There was one moment of comic relief in the form of his flub about a "2 yr. old" (actually, a 10 year old) who wrote him a letter asking how she could help America. The rest of the speech was simply nauseating.
Did anyone else notice how he just kept smiling (beaming actually) while he said that our nation was still at risk for a terrorist attack? Very creepy. Of course, he mentioned Mars again. I suppose it's only natural that he wants to return to his natural habitat. And with Cheney's former employers, Halliburton, staged to make a huge profit off this mission to space, what more can you ask for?
So far, I haven't heard one journalist mention his homophobic blast against the "radical" judges who dared to allow secular gay marriages to take place in Massachusetts.
I wasn't surprised to see his cronies clapping when he talked about preserving the sanctity of marriage (by vetoing gay marriage) but it still made me ill. Then, only seconds later, he started in again with his bunk about "compassionate" Conservatives. I hope one of the Dems latches on to these comments.
The entire speech should give them plenty of food for fodder. I just hope their wise enough to use it! They need to stop attacking each other and aim their insults at their real opponent, Dubya.
I think it is worthwhile to consider that Dean did ignite the platform of the democratic race for a presidential candidate but maybe as one astrologer predicted - Morgana gave the link not too long ago in a comment- that astrologer does not see him in the race in the end and she does not see Bush in the final race either...Maybe that is how it will happen - Dean must start what the future president must finish and maybe that is a good thing too...I do feel all contenders now except maybe Lieberman oppose the Bush Regime agenda and that says ALOT - not that we agree on everything but that we choose life not annihalation - we choose the change that must come rather than fight it - it should say ALOT that many have changed their voice since the vote that lead to war in IRAQ - Bush has not changed at all his agenda. I remember telling my mother that when any candidate speaks to me - I start to cry and I know I am not the only ravenously hungry soul out here. Bush has never moved me...I could not watch the SOU charade because the buffers are falling away...we are feeling the devestating effects of his policies no matter the spin - thank you for the link to review of book about American Dynasty...we must take heart...that hateful arrogance and republicans or republocrats are not all synonymous.
conservative commentators here in Colorado are "panning" the Bush Speech. Wondering what on earth he was talking about. There wasn't anything in that speech (like last year) that was absolute, it was a nothing speech, not even a real direction. The Dems and Repugs both were pretty silent on the blanket Hispanic Immigration, that one is going to be tough to carry out.The Gay Marriage issue will be an issue, Iraq is already an issue. He was careful about not making an out and out lying statement as he did with the WMD's.
To the person who wanted to know if any of the candidates had good aspects on election day, my answer is "yes" they all do. The question is what's going on for them between now and then, who will make it to the election. I have said over and over that I'm wondering if Bush makes it to the election, he may not be the candidate for the Republicans, but if he is and if he wins I will be stunned if he serves more than six months.On the Dems side, Edwards looks like a real dark horse or a comprimise candidate.
wow it took three glasses of wine and two joints, cheese and truffles (FROM FRANCE) and a badfinger video to calm me down last nite!! and no one is talking about what he actually said, about going into the middle east and making them in the image of iraq and afghan..no blame, he told everyone, informed them...2005 will definitely see the implementation of the draft...and all the no sex, no illegal drugs (but ritalin is ok), no sports heros, just military military military...pig pig pig...wasn't satisfied with anyone including the after comments EXCEPT t. kennedy sitting there shaking his head, rolling his eyes..to show him during the medicare comments was a beautiful thing..
I didn't have the stomach to watch the SOTU last night but my son did. He says it was very satisfying to watch the Dems - who have had a spine transplant thanks to the Doctor - actually boo the Resident. Sat with arms crossed refusing to clap?
Heh.
Last time that happened was the rePukes during the impeachment crap in '98. Goes around, comes around.
Obviously, I'm a Deaniac but I'll say this anyway - all the others in the running have gone from Bush Lite to Dean Lite. Why have imitations when you can have the real thing?
It's amazing how Bush can stir up such passion, both for and against him. This election year is going to be more raucaus (sp?) than usual. I wish I could understand why Dean arouses such passion in so many as well. There is just something about him that I can't trust and I'm not able to put my finger on what it is. Kerry just seems so much more dignified and experienced. Edwards gave an uplifting speech after the Iowa caucus. I get a sense of fairness from both of them. I'm a Democrat and I will vote ABBB but I really hope it's a Kerry/Edwards ticket.
It must be horrible for Ted Kennedy to watch these atrocities occur, one after another.
Last night Ted Kennedy's animated expression was a beautiful thing for all of us out here who have felt unheard. May Ted Kennedy and all the rest of us find our own power. As the hero of Braveheart said, "What would you do without freedom!?". We mustn't turn tail and go home, hoping it will all be ok. There are some very strange, A moral men and women involved in all this who want your last five dollars, and all the power they can get is never enough. They won't go away on their own. They have been building to this for decades unseen, but now they are becoming visible. Now is the time to take our country back and cut off the head of the hydra. Otherwise we are destined to live the lives of fodder units. How about that for your future and the life path of your children and grandchildren?
Get busy.
From many years of workshops, both giving them and taking them, it has been my observation that westerners as a general rule, especially americans, are uncomfortable with intense emotions. Some may recall how the outpouring of volumes of feeling after the Wellstone memorial was misinterpreted and misreported.
Anger is a very misunderstood emotion and as valuable and life-saving as it can be, not readily tapped into by folks.
As the saying goes, if you're not angry you haven't been paying attention.
Dean's passion and intensity speaks to my own passion and intensity, as well as many others.
I had a friend once who used to say that she wanted to know that someone loved her enough to make her the gift of his anger.
Dean loves this country and us enough to give us the gift of all that intensity. Scorpios *are* intense, you know, but they are very selective about where and to whom they reveal the intensity. Some semi-famous astrologer once said that Scorpios aren't more sexual than the rest of the signs, but sex was one of the few vehicles available that could transport their feelings.
So apparently, is politics.
So my guess in response to Teresa's question about what she can't put her finger on that makes her uneasy is the quivering intensity just under the surface with Dr. Dean - as opposed to the emotional tidiness that Kedwards presents.
I think most people cannot handle an intelligent straight talking politician that does not water down or sugar coat the medicine, and to me, thats why they are having a hard time with Dean. Everyone's been indoctrinated to be so "politically correct" over the last generation, even tv comedy show host Bill Maher was fired for speaking his mind.
My Capricorn moon demands some emotional "tidiness" but I need to see beneath the emotions that run rampant in election campaigns to see if there is anything of substance. So far, with Gov. Dean, I don't find it. If it makes anyone feel better, I feel the same way about Gen. Clark only for a different reason. I cannot vote for someone I don't trust. After anger and passion subside and the business of actually governing takes over, then what? Just reading some of the posts here today have made me very uncomfortable because you can hear the hatred coming from a lot of it. I've seen so much of it coming from Republicans since Bush was given the presidency and it's hard to hear astrologers and Democrats using the same type of language. Sorry for the preaching but I'm surrounded by Republican lawyers at work and I don't have anyone else to discuss this with.
Damned right, bbuster. Dean is the REAL DEAL. I almost got sick when I saw Kerry using that slogan. If he's the real deal, WHERE has he been for the last 3 years? This is not difficult. We are trying to beat Bush and his policies. If you want to see Bush's policies end, then DON'T VOTE FOR THE POEPLE WHO SUPPORTED THEM. They include: Lieberman, Clark and KERRY. When choosing a candidate, pay less attention to what is coming out of their mouths than what their voting records reflect. Kerry voted for it all and remained silent through the worst of it. He can't be trusted.
PS - By their fruits shall you know them!
Several poll results have surfaced in the past couple of days indicating Dubya's approval rating is slipping (again). This one http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&u=/afp/20040119/ts_alt_afp/us_vote_bush_poll_040119072019&e=5 posted on Yahoo this past Monday shows that if election were now the Shrub would gain only 43% of the vote to ANY demo's 45%. When asked to rate demos, Dean came in first with Kerry pulling up rear with only 7%. So, just remember "Iowa" is the FIRST of many on the campaign trail... and as for Mr. Bush --- 9 months remain 'til November... long enough for lots of "light" to be shed on this administration's hidden activities and agenda... long enough to "birth" a new vision, a new day...
Keep walking the walk and talking the talk and remember to hang on when the ride gets rough cause this one promises to be memorable. Dubya is not the only actor on the stage. Any of you old enough to remember another time, another ayatollah? The one who brought down the Shah of Iran? You can bet your boots Rummy remembers... and Dubya's getting a primer while he "retreats" from his latest misadventure. the Village Voice has a neat cartoon of the Rove and others packing into a hovering helicopter evoking a past memory of the departure from Viet Nam. Peace, Grandma Jo
http://www.americanprogress.org/site/pp.asp?c=biJRJ8OVF&b=8473
"The reaction to the President's State of the Union address was nearly unanimous: it was a political document, devoid of serious, detailed proposals.
As CBS News put it, "the rhetoric, the themes, the pre-speech spin were all orchestrated to portray a president above politics, fighting evil on the planet. Politics without fingerprints."
The WP notes the speech "showed just how conscious they are of the opposition's emerging campaign themes 10 long months before Election Day."
Picking up on the defensive nature of the speech – and its brazen substitution of politics over policy - media critic Tom Shales noted that Bush's words "sounded like taunts - taunts to the rest of the world or taunts to Democrats." He said, "the fact that Bush appeared to be so giddily primed for another political slugfest was a little bit disheartening, and even a little bit scary."
The NYT reports, "the White House was so eager to highlight [certain] passages that the president's chief political adviser, Karl Rove, telephoned social conservative groups on Tuesday to make sure they would be watching the speech."
If I only watched mainstream media, I would probably have doubts about Dean, but increasingly I have been watching cspan to get the unedited version, and what I see is intelligence, fresh ideas, the ability to be succinct, combined with fire-in-the-belly motivation. I just finished watching John McCain on cspan slamming the republican special interest sneaky insertions into the pending spending bill. To me he was at that moment a Dean lookalike. What he said was great, and its too bad we have too few politicians speaking up for what is right like this instead of either pandering or whining!
anyone who watches the mclaughlin group will notice that in the past few weeks, newsweek and buchanan AND the washington times have been agreeing on most issues. all anti-bush. the washington times dude didn't even show up last week. all good...
the lies .. what about that crazy weird double talk about what the rest of the 'people' want in regards to gay marriage...that was so super crazy..
the nazi quotes above SAY IT ALL.
i just saw a poll that said, 39 per cent said they'd vote for bush, 30 no, and 29 depend on who's running against him, that's super bad news for bush within 24 hours of the sou, no? please tell me it is!
Roxanne,
Oh my God! We agree!!!!!!! That IS bad news for Bush. Perhaps we should mark this day on our calendars as the first day we agreed on ANYTHING, Roxanne?!?!?!! :-)
Signing off with a Big Smile,
Jonathan
Um, in my shock, I accidentally signed my name as Roxanne. But, non, c'est moi, Jonathan.
Sorry.
Still in shock, I guess. LOL
* Zogby News! - As Dems Vote in IA & NH, bush Looks Vulnerable in Both His Elect & Face-Off with Generic Dem; bush’s Job Performance 49% Positive, 50% Negative; Dems Lead Over repubs in Congressional Generic, New Zogby Internatl Poll Reveals. ... con't http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.dbm?ID=786
George Bush is nothing more than an empty vessel, masterminded and invented by the extremist’s neo-cons that surround him. They have skillfully honed his image to represent a person of compassion and caring, integrity, truthfulness and moral fiber. Bush is their wooden headed puppet and they speaks through him. . But Bushes personal history speaks for itself . . .A spoiled privileged failure in life; the wealthy Bush family bought George his political career in which he has seldom displayed an ounce of intelligence, principle, integrity, honesty, caring, compassion or character. The smoke and mirrors and lies used by the Bush Administration to lead the US to war, fill the pockets of the rich, favored corporations and special interests has worked like magic on the American public. The State of the Union speech last year was based on lies and fear mongering and worked well enough to lead America to a pre-emptive war that is now nothing more than a dismal failure. One year later I see nothing in the American psyche that leads me to believe that this years bundle of lies, pandering and fear mongering will not have the desired effect . . . Re-election. The scores of stupefied American’s that are fooled by this King of Fools may deserve this imbecile but unfortunately for all of us he has the power to affect the fate of the whole world. Canada is looking better and better.
He was not elected by the American people. He is held up by the corporate owned media which now makes Pravda pale in promotion abilities.
We'll see what the American people have in store for the neocon version of the Republicn Party. Personally, I think they are doomed. I just hope the innocent citizens of this country are spared.
Sally, Could you (or one of the other experts who might find this of interest) take a look at the Democratic Party chart and see if we will have any impact on getting it back to respecting the grass roots and leading our nation back to the goals it once held? This is a matter of much weightiness to me. Thank you.
Roxanne, I do watch the McLaughlin Group and have noticed for the last 6 months a shift, at first it was slow, now it's steamrolling.
Maybe the unnamed rulers are getting ready to drop him?
Amen, one and all.
Forget the polls...really - the truth could not really be much more than the 1% wealthiest Americans whom Bush and Co. support...and yes that would fill a sou speech hall...the t.v.s oddly were off most that night in this house. You all are so engaged here - I am glad to hear your thoughts!
Thank you!
IMHO Dean brought out the passion that we sorely needed and forced the other candidates to start taking a look at their own Bush-lite thinking, so I am grateful for the huge part he played in changing our country. I'm not sure he has a chance now . . . that Iowa loss will haunt him.
Edwards is great, Kerry is a good man - albeit a bit boring, Wesley Clark is smart as a whip and I believe would make an excellent president. Lieberman has no chance and I'm happy with that.
I have been very distressed with the way our candidates are attacking other candidates, and Dean did not start this . . it was Kerry and Gephardt.
Recently I had to take a good look at myself, realizing that I have become just as bad as the Clinton-haters of the 90s. My very passionate hate for Bush is not doing me any good. I have decided that I'm not going to feel ANYTHING for Bush except I will be carrying the knowledge that when he says one thing he means another, and that he seems to get away with outright lies. The right hated Clinton for lying about an affair that had nothing to do with the nation so how in the heck can they like Bush who lies about things like whether Saddam had WMD's? Doesn't make sense.
I don't think it's a good idea for us to eat our own and I think we all need to start morphing our hate for Bush into sympathy or just plain distrust. It's not healthy to hate. I'm still working on it myself and it's not easy.
Laurie! You have touched on a subject my husband and I have been wrestling with every day ..our hatred for Bush and how it is effecting our everyday life as well. We are very peaceful people by nature and yet this President has brought out the worst in us and we find we cannot even stand to watch him on the television because of the negative feelings and emotional buttons his presence starts to push. We live in an area that is very pro-Bush and my husband deals with knuckleheads at work whose families are so Republican that they cannot think of voting any other way. Several co-workers have expressed their dissatisfaction with Bush, yet they feel they cannot vote against him because the "evil"to them is having a Democrat in office. The daily dealings with this, plus the daily dose of Bush worshipers on the local news channels has made us so negative that we have had to question if this is healthy for us as well. We have decided not to watch the news at night (we do watch it at noon when he's home from work for lunch) and have started to meditate and listen to peaceful music in the evenings and focus our energies into prayer for our nation and this next election. Seems a healthier way to add some balance to our lives and get rid of some of the negativity and hopefully channel some of that hatred we have to get rid of into more positive areas. So far it's been working - at least we both sleep better at night and don't wake up so stressed! Thanks for bringing this to our attention and wishing you good luck in finding your own spiritual peace as well.
Laurie you are absolutely right. The hatred for anyone doesn't do anything but send more hatred out into the atmosphere, and does nothing to change anything or to change the polarization we have in this country. "Divide and conquer" is a very old method of keeping the people from focusing on what is actually happening.
They have us out here fighting among ourselves, black vs white, men vs women, rich vs poor, christian vs everyone else, democrat vs republican and those aren't the issues. Soon with their war on "fat" it will be fat vs thin and then we won't be focused on what kind of controls do we have on our food to ensure its safety.
Like Karl Rove told Bush, "stick to the principle" and that is what we need to do "stick to the principle."
A dear friend of mine, years younger but ages wiser, said, "the only people we hate are those who have the power to hurt us, or to hurt someone we love." Mr. Bush has the power to hurt, and is hurting, the country we love.
My idea is not to spend heat and emotion on hating Bush&Co (he is a conglomerate) but to balance our love and passion for our country against his actions and to deal with him coldly and justly. Is it the Italians who say, "revenge is a dish best served cold?" I don't remember. Anyhow, use the anger for fuel--don't waste it on frustration.
Enjoyed Sally's article. What I expecially like is that she reminds us of the metaphysical side of all this. Where there is dark there is light, and what is being manifested reminds us to work on a higher level yet when it comes to this world. I agree with Laurie & Siobhan. I too have found myself being consumed with hate and constantly angered by the insanity of GWB & the neocons.I turned into a news junkie in the worst way and started being consumned by every apocolyptic web site there is.. Then it hit me, this is the worst WORST thing I could do to help heal myself the planet etc. By constantly be angered by the "Darkside" we are like a potential Darth Vader whose anger will eventually cause us to succumb to the very thing we hate! I agree with Sibohan, time to get back to ourselves in Light with pryer and meditation and fun and enjoying life. Once I turned off the news and started back on my path I felt such a relief and lightness and peace ! This may be part of our country's "lesson" then. Let not the hate consume us, but stick to our principals on the Light Path and we can still transform this country and this planet in Love
Peace
Swamp
Swamper all white light and peace by all means, for the darkness dwells in the White House. Our lesson is not to mix religion and politics, the People got burned. By all means turn off the news, avoid the paper, ignorance will make it go away. Ah, I don't think so. I think I'll stick to shouting out a warning to all mankind.
Morgana
You are right, we should not stick our head in the sand by any means. I am talking about not letting hate and fear consume us. BIG difference. That's what I mean by sticking to prinicples. We can have a keen awareness and certainly sound the warning call whenever and wherever we can. That is very different from spirialing down into the hate trap Sibohan and Laurie talk about. Constantly barraging oneself with all the crap is not the answer. That's all I am saying.I can be well informed but I don't have to make a 24/7 career out of it by becoming a news junkie and winding myself up. This is what's feeding a lot of the hate that other posters talk about. Walking in the light will spoil my aim a lot less than hate will. I feel that mediation and prayer is a valid tool as is marching, writing articles and sounding the warning any way one can. One does not preclude the other.
Peace
Swamp
"The right hated Clinton for lying about an affair that had nothing to do with the nation so how in the heck can they like Bush who lies about things like whether Saddam had WMD's? "
It wasn't his infidelity that roused their hatred. It was his seeming invincibility. Their real hatred stemmed from envy. He had an affair and was STILL extraordinarily popular. They couldn't destroy him and they hated him for it.
Bush didn't lie. He didn't mislead. You just did. Bush used the same intel that the congress did and the British parliament did and made a decision based on it along with many U.N. Resolutons. Read resolution 4117.
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http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/online-holdem.htm , http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/online-holdem-poker.htm
, http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/online-internet-casino.htm , http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/online-poker-games.htm
, http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/online-poker-room.htm , http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/online-poker-rooms.htm
, http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/online-roulette.htm
http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/online-texas-holdem.htm , http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/online-video-poker.htm
, http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/play-blackjack-online.htm , http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/play-roulette-online.htm
, http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/play-video-poker.htm , http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/poker-games.htm
, http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/poker-games.htm
http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/poker-room.htm , http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/poker-rooms.htm
, http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/roulette-games.htm , http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/slot-machine.htm
, http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/texas-holdem.htm , http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/texas-holdem-poker.htm
, http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/texas-hold-em-poker.htm , http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/vegas-poker-room.htm
http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/vegas-poker-rooms.htm , http://www.1-texas-holdem.com/video-poker.htm
, http://www.1-video-poker-games.org , http://www.1-casino-gambling.org ,
http://www.1-online-roulette.org
I agree with you .
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