Thank you for beeing so positve! Nice article!

Dear Mr. Gianfermo,

Everyday I thirst for the stream of consciousness flowing through this web site -today I found your input - I am overwhelmed by your level of detail but you always bring everything around to the same place - 'the power of the heart' and I am confident that I can study your words again and again to finally get the message-I am certainly catching up on my mythology studies and life is looking all connected again - thank you and all the contributors here for your watchful eye, your analysis, your commitment - it is helping me to stay steadfast in heart for I think things will surely get more illogical as we shift out of the old...It is harder to predict in these times of great change what a free will chooses - can you tell I am not very astrology savvy though it is the road map I prefer these days?

Thanks,
M.

AG, thanks for this soulful article. It offers us hope during the madness we are enduring.

I just caught this on Yahoo News:
Sen. Byrd - a voice of conscience and integrity - birth date Birthdate: 11/20/1917
Birthplace: North Wilkesboro, NC
his Mars is 9 Virgo36 right on GW Bush's
and squaring the Eclipse Degree.

WASHINGTON - Sen. Robert Byrd (news, bio, voting record) accused the Bush administration of using "false premises" to get Americans to accept what he said was an illegal and unprovoked attack on Saddam Hussein (news - web sites)'s government.

Perhaps more of our nation's leaders will start speaking up for truth?

Thank you so much for the phenomenal article. It is so chuck full of information, I'm on my second read.

The world is indeed alive and talking to us all the time. It is clear to me, that this government is not listening. There has been a pattern in conservative (contradiction in term) goals, when they hold office, of pillaging, and holding their fingers in their ears to all but those who agree with them.

It has been my life's work to create environmental laws and enforce them but each conservative administration ignores and/or squashes anything that is not beneficial to corporate America. How is it that this can be changed? There are so many who work and speak, but are not "news" and so people with the desire to share life with nature think they are in the minority. I think it is not so much that there are so few people who care, but rather a stifling, creating intimidation and a sense of helplessness.

Consider the huge crowds that turned out globally to protest attacking Iraq. The attack took place in spite of that. Consider also the suppression of news in this country. It is as if the American people are being isolated in one small room of a very large house. All the windows and doors are being shut so as not to allow anything in or out.

What can the solution be? I can olny think that it must be a higher power.

Sally, can you remove one of the above. It didn't take, so I came back a few minutes later and tried again. It didn't take that time either, and Yikes! now there are Two!

Mercury has gone direct hasn't it? :-D

really loved the above..except the palestinians thing; anyone who watches the news in order of events knows that it's ALWAYS the palestinians who prevent any peace from happening..they're suicidal, (hello?), and therefore a demonic lot. people who ignore this are anti-semetic, or watching the news backwards.

byrd has always spoken out. the old geezer is the only one with any balls in washington! beautiful to see he's from the carolinas, which astrocartographically is a saturn on bush's ascendant: byrd will definitely have a hand in bringing bush down as bush's saturn starts to quiver...go get 'em old guy!

People become suicidal when there is no hope, when their babies are born on to die behind barbed wire while clean antiseptic hospitals are only for the 'chosen' not the infidel, walk a mile in a Palestinians shoes, they are people deserving of a better life as everyone is, not just the fat rich elitest Jews. Just like the American Indian the good land is taken away and they are left with sand. Sharon and his blood thirsty killers are as quilty as the Bush Cabal, same mindset different ethnicity. All people should be treated with respect. Death to them is better then a living hell.

Religion is a touchy subject and as an 8-year-old sent to a Baptist summer camp, I lived the living hell of religion. I didn't agree and knew in my heart that things they said were not true. Religious beliefs, IMHO, can be dangerous, i.e., they are evil because they kill themselves. People with strong convictions will kill themselves if they see a greater good for their deed. One must feel compassion for that dedication.

I personally think the world would be better off without any religion whatsoever. Okay, I said this was sensitive. It is difficult to discuss without hurting someone's feelings. By the way, I am mostly neutral in the Israel Palestinian conflict. I feel for both sides. Neither is evil.

I absolutely loved your piece, Art, but I have to read it a few more times and then I will comment.

Laurie, I started studying ancient religion when I was 11, I wanted to know why we believed what we believe and I've studied it ever since. It's taken me to philosophy, astronomy, medicine and law and of course astrology, as these are all things based in ancient religion. If there is one thing I learned and believe is there is a supreme being and if people are looking for a way to communicate with that supreme being they could not have come up with a better obstructing model than organized religion. I can't think of anything that could turn people either away from God or place them in such fear they never are able to reach that inner voice of God.

Sally, how true.

Laurie, I have much appreciation for your sentiment regarding religion. And I must admit, I have limited my contact with very religious people (of any stripe) because they scare and sadden me. Just my opinion.

morgana..well theres loads of archaelogical maps to prove that land as judea, the lands of the jews, so please learn your history..they were spread the world over because they were divided up after believing in a false messiah, a couple generations past JC. this man believed in war against the romans..it was the ultimate slap in the face to their real messiah, who preached faith, and peace.. so the karma of that spread them far from their home, but it IS their home...

as far as to-day, just when peace looked possible the trouble makers started the killing. if they wanted hope for their lives, they would have stopped killing jews, and would have been way on their way by now. to a peaceful loving existance, to share those clean hospitals in beautiful israel, which was a pretty gross place before the jews came back..
but they don't rise up and tackle their own enemy: themselves. so they get nowhere.
anyone who lives in america lives on land that is not truly theirs, but the indians; yet there was an archaelogical find of a star of david back in the 80s..so who knows..
people who live in peace and want peace inherit the earth, and those who want violence will prevent happiness - it's a very simple thing. if the palestinians would rather die, then die, but don't kill others because of a demonic hatred. if only the arabs and some 'so-called' christians would realize the reason for all of this, the stumbling block of the jews, to not accept their lord because he wasn't rich, to be hated by everyone for always putting the golden calf first..but even if this is all 'true' it's ignorant to take part in the hatred directed at them. let God judge here and in the hereafter, what's to be dealt out to people for their actions..
it was one thing i hated about the anti-iraq occupation..a lot of people just were against it because they hate jews, not because of the real reason, that a country was being raped, with it's people killed for american corporations..
all of these happenings in the middle east are proof that there is not getting a away from the realities of our existance..and if you can still believe in 'man' instead of 'god' after all man has done to this planet and continues to do so, then that's just a 'new age' that's never going to be, as our lives to-day, still being affected by the mid-east rivalries, proves out. 'scientists' who don't believe in god, don't believe in astrology either, and believe in astronomy with no reason..they merely make bombs for greedy lost people to kill each other with..

I jsut want to remind all of us that there is so much under heaven it can be challenging to comprehend.

The Cherokee people also use the six pointed star as a revered symbol. They say it represents the six pointed star cloud people who came and taught them how to live.

Symbols we see today are ancient beyond anything written.

You are so right Pat and how great a reminder it is for all of us that "spin and marketing" of the people didn't just start with this generation. I remember reading years ago a book on the Lost Civilization of the Mayas, and realized how history, books, symbols have all been changed or destroyed or just erased so much we really don't know what's up or down, whose right or wrong, and so much of what we've been taught IS based on what is sadly called paganism and we don't even know it. You said it beautifully.

Sally, I agree with you wholeheartely about organized religion, and although it serves as a social outlet for a lot of people, it discourages the individual from having direct contact with God, as the yogis do during meditation. For them it's as normal as us westerners eating and sleeping. I think the phrase "we are all created equal before God" means that all of us who come into this world regardless of race, nationality, or creed, are given this link with our infinite source, and we can choose to make use of it or not, but it can never be taken away by anyone. One individual who comes to mind, who has made full use of this connection is Nelson Mandela, who managed to survive 27 years in prison, and emerge virtually unscathed, and not harboring any hatred or bitterness towards those who put him there.

This article is such a clear example of contemporary views toward education and shaping history.

http://www.english.upenn.edu/~mruben/herman_1.html

As we are about to learn even more urgently in the curtailment of freedom of information as the FCC closes the door on open media.

Isn't that the truth Crystal, I don't know if I could be that forgiving, I would like to think I could still love, still find joy, still truly forgive, but I don't really know that I could. You give me a lot to think about.

Beautiful. Thank you.

I was writing to Crystal.

So once again.

Beautiful. Thank you.

Mercury and I are going to have a discussion.

Roxanne, let's be fair - by the same token, a lot of those who were pushing for war with Iraq in the Bush administration and in Israel were Arab haters, and if the Israeli government were really interested in peace, they would not continue to build illegal Jewish settlements on Palestinian land. I think this is the biggest thorn in the side of the Palestinians. I'm not even going to mention the systematic destruction of Palestinian homes, farms, orchards, and olive groves over the years which deprive them of their livelihood. Nothing mentioned in the Bible could justify these vindictive acts.

It's a terribly difficult neighborhood, and a situation of security is always sought after.

Arafat and Sharon have aggravated this most explosive situation. The Gaza strip is security for both sides. It is elevated and sits in the middle.

Both sides need a home.....both sides need security.

Pat, you are so funny. I think Mercury, that trickster is still up to some funny business, even though he appears to have gone direct! It's happening to me too! :)

Crystal, this day has been filled with Merc Rx.

Mercury must be moving very sllooowly.

crystal: i don't know anything about what you're saying. all i know is that everytime there is calm, it's always disrupted by suicide bombings, which LEAD to the jews bringing out the big guns..it's always a retaliation. i have never known jews to do some of the things that were done by palestinians..like the dumping of the new york jew off the boat in his wheel chair, like the crazy palestinian lady joyfully killing a baby aboard a hijacked plane in the 70s...i've never heard of the jews doing anything but retaliation for terror on them, and it's always militaristic, never psycho..the way the palestinians celebrated 9/11 was purely gross..if they're that hopelessly screwed and damaged and unhappy then what can you say..there is no hope for people with a psyche like that. they wanted ALL JEWS gone that was their 'thing' that they wouldn't remove in their constitution..that's how the jews rightly knew they could not be trusted, because they don't want peace, they just want death....they send their own kids out to kill themselves, and are proud of it..that's purely satanic, i don't care how mistreated they are. they clearly wouldn't know a 'solution' if they saw one anyway. i can't stick up for them at all. i love arabs, and arab culture, i even went to an arab country for my honeymoon, but the palestinians. even the other arab nations don 't really help them, i don't wonder why.
as far as organized religions go, the first into judgement is the churches, how they've led so many people 'away' from God. we here should all know this...astrologers are wise men, not new age dabblers...
to me, to learn about what is going on in the world, through astrology, i must believe in the 'good news', to think that jesus isn't coming back to cast the beast into hell, would be just believing in the bad part of the bible, without the reward.

"Walk a mile in my shoes," is an appropriate adage here. Who are we to judge anything? In the soul's journey if one is too adamant about anything, it will come back and slap them in the face.

Black and white, good and evil, it's all relative. I prefer the shades of gray, and there must be hundreds of thousands of them.

Call me crazy (and there are those who probably will), but, when I come to this forum to learn about astrology and how the planets and their aspects work and to find others who have, like myself, had it up to HERE with Bush and his cronies, the last thing I want to find is a long dissertation on how evil the Palestinians are and how "hopelessly screwed and damaged and unhappy" they are. When posting to forums like this, I always think it's a good idea to be yourself and to share your views, especially on astrology, but to also be somewhat sensitive to those you're posting to. I have many friends who are Jewish and many friends who are Palestinian and for a Westerner, even one who went to an Arab country on her honeymoon, to try to wrap his or her brain around the conflict successfully is a long shot deal. I truly enjoy people posting their knowledge on astrology and even on World Events, but please be aware that when you say about the Palestinians that choices they make are "purely Satanic" and they "wouldn't know a solution if they saw one anyway", you might be perhaps crossing a line that a lot of people might find offensive, especially on a site as welcoming of everyone as this site is.

Jonathan

Jonathan, well stated.

I love this site, but read the religious post with a heavy heart. I THINK, religion, for the most part, is an emotional issue, and rarely can one reason with emotion.

Jonathan and Janet: well said, both of you.

Art, I was very happy to hear: "Mars the reformer in Aquarius is ready to push the envelope and conj. the US Charts Moon at 27° Aquarius (the people's will) in July." That and Sally's prediction that we (as a people) will begin to wake up from our foggy sleep after this next eclipse, albeit slowly, is so wonderful to hear. Thanks for your piece, I have read it a few times and every time get something new from it. Thank you so much.

Roxanne-

I'm not sure what you know about the Arab-Israeli
conflict, but I can tell you what we're seeing now
is only a present snapshot. In fact, two of the
most sincere peacemakers ever to grace that region- Anwar Sadat of Egypt and Menachem Begin
of Israel- actually got their start in what could
now be termed 'terrorist organizations' back before the War of 1948. The Palestinians are not
demonic, anymore so than the Jews who blew up buildings and terrorized Arab communities in the
1920s and 1930s. However, the current Israeli govt. under Sharon does indeed make the same fatal error as the Bush cabal: Perpetual War for
Perpetual Peace. Everyone sane person I know has
expressed horror and anguish over the spiralling
cycle of violence over there, but it simply does
not do to try and cast one side or the other as demonic. Maybe better to say that until both sides realize that peace is only possible through peaceful means, will we see any progress.

Which leads me to a final comment about religion-
especially the organized ones we see today. What
has happened in many instances is that someone
who advocates a great idea (peace, love tolerance, etc.) eventually gets his message changed and co-opted by others who show up afterwards claiming they TRULY know what the Great Master meant. If you can look past the
centuries of dogma and find truth in your own way, then that is the best path, whether it leads
you to any religion or not.

"Judge not, lest you yourself also be judged."
-Jesus Christ

Jonathan, Janet, Lauri, Subudei all well said. To unravel the "religions" of the world astrologically and who is right and who is wrong would take such a massive body of work and even then it would be doubtful it would be right, in fact, all has been changed and rewritten so much I would be willing to give a "black and white" statement and say it can't be done. The best one can do astrologically is to if a particularly country or person is using the "religion" card to prove a point or to run their lives. In our government officials using "religion" has historically led the world into great problems.

When Bosnia was bombed, I traced all the problems back to the first war there in the 11th century and the day it started and low and behold the present day coordinates related to that first war over "religion," or a belief system. One wants to say "let's just stop the blame game and need to prove ourselves right and start fresh." My sense is that in all cultures from the beginning of time, religion has more to do with getting the money and resources than God. That one simple truth continues to plague us, "follow the money."

Now back to the present astrological aspects, this sudden spate of resignations at the White House, no matter what they say the reason, looks to have it's roots buried with in-fighting. In the Inaugural Chart, the Mercury/Mars square from the 7th house (partners and open enemies) and Mercury (10th house of career and public image) was set off by transiting Mars conjuncting the 10th house Mercury) that aspect is an "I've had it, this is the last straw" aspect. For Ari, his Mercury is at 14 degrees Scorpio, very close to the Inauguaral Mars, close enough for him to have thrown a fit when transiting Mars squared his Mercury. A big enough fit that he might have said "I don't have to be here," and someone answered with "ok?" Whatever happened I can guarantee that transiting Mars square a natal Mercury can make a person pretty irritable and verbally snappish. I don't have Whitman's birth information but I would bet she hit the last straw as well.

Tommy Franks has had a pretty stiff dose of Saturn to his natal planets and I expect he is just plain tired of it all, Saturn does that.

the above comments were posted by me (Sally) not
Subudei, sorry don't know how that happened.

Thanks Sally! I would only add that this point in time is a little odd for Franks to retire. As the Commanding General he is either walking away, or being walked away while his "victory" is still incomplete. Very strange for a military General.

Whitman has been treated with some disdain as EPA is treated with disdain. They just can't separate the two. I think she was willing to go the distance for this administration if they had kept her in the loop. I doubt she was.

Can't you just feel the love??

I have to chuckle (Sally posting as someone else, etc.). Perhaps we are all suffering from a Mercury Rx hangover.

some people are obviously not reading my posts properly..it's not that i called palestinians demonic, it's that is said that SUICIDE is..and i haven't been to church in ages, so who's touting "religion"????

it was astrologers who said a messiah, a king would be born, they didn't go around debating if they were right based on their own individual hang ups and fears of being judged for what they may feel guilty of.

the reaction of people here is just like still believing in democrats..it's only slightly less shortsighted than the people everyone's complaining about...

it's too late.

Roxanne, you have a depth of knowledge, especially in history, that many of us do not have, especially me. You have a lot to offer to these conversations because of this vast knowledge. I have learned a great deal from you in many ways. We need to learn from each other, we all have our own qualities we bring to the table.

At the same time, I will not agree that suicide is demonic, no matter what it says in history books or religious books. My knowledge of this is from within, where else can one go for true knowledge? I also will never believe that throwing my precious vote at Ralph Nader will bring my country back.

Claiming that those of us who do not agree with your assessments are shortsighted is unfortunate and discouraging.

Enough. Astrology anyone?

Roxanne, your opinions seem pretty emotionally-driven, and fanatically expressed.

thanks for the compliments laurie..

i just always believe in telling the truth..fanatic? with five planets in virgo in the 9th house and (none of them squaring my) sag asc, and mercury leo...that's not emotionism at all, that is 'the pure truth' like it or not.....

i've never been a 'grey area' kind of person though, that goes hand in hand with mediocrity - not my thing; and if the evil we have seen lately isn't enough to show that the old 90's rubbish about good and evil being relative isn't enough, then i just don't know what to tell you...

i never 'judged' palestinians..i just tell the truth how i see it, in the order of events. we all know that if they had half the amunition of israel there would not be a jew alive in the neighborhood, yet the jews don't exterminate THEM..to say i crossed the line..it was art who crossed the line by putting in his obvious 'opinion' about a volatile subject, which to me has to do more with hating jews, than love and peace and justice. i was just commenting that i could do without that in his article, and why i thought so.

but if i have to reason with people who beieve that suicide is not demonic, then once again, i just don't know what...

it is precisely the idea that voting for someone who was for the people, was 'throwing' it away, that you got what you got...and now you all cling to the likes of Sarandon, Moore, NADER VOTERS, for hope and inspiration.

in the astro predictions here of people waking up, i have to honestly say that you are all included in that! and i don't mean that egotistically, or at all hatefully..

i have lived in three countries in europe and i've never met people like the republicans and democrats of america..

ralph said, "if you vote the less of two evils, you still get evil" - which is what you got.

maybe i can get branded being a christian mystic radical, but i do prefer the tag to luke-warm liberal democrat.

no harm done, i came here because people on the moore board don't believe in astrology, and so i thought i'd find some brilliance here, but i get ..democrats! hahahah..(p.s. don't worry i will vote dem if there's no other alternative)

Roxanne, we obviously are on opposite ends of the spectrum, yet I have 4 planets in the 9th (2 of them in Virgo) and they DO square my Sag ascendant.

One man's "truth" is another man's "lie." In the scheme of things, they are twisted and turned, and end up meaning nothing. And by the way, I did not vote for the lesser of two evils, I voted for a good man, Al Gore, and he won. Unfortunately in this case, the winner was the loser.

We are different but I am not going to say that I have the "truth," to me, that would be outlandish and presumptuous on my part. Anyway, I am tiring of this, and I think I'll let the others reply to your posts for awhile. All the best.

Jeez Roxanna, I'm old enough to understand the history you are talking about, but to say that we got the lesser of two evils is not even sane. If it had not been for Mr Nader, we wouldn't be in this fix. He devided the progressive people in this country and here we are.

I don't even want to talk about Nader any more. He is a wonderful consumer advocate, but the Presidency is out of his logical realm. He, like Bush is a divider, and who need that?

Enough already.

Something I learned a very long time ago when I believed I had "the truth" was "truth is truth and truth does not change, but our knowledge and understanding of truth does."

It's hard to know the truth when what we have is and has been altered dramatically through the years plus we don't ever get the whole truth of a public person or situation particularly governments.

Squares are not all bad, they have the effect of keeping a check and balance on us as opposed to taking our beliefs out on everyone else, and trines aren't all good.

Conjunctions can make us behave in such a way as to ram what we think or do down other people's throats without ever seeing that others have just as valid an opinion and that's what makes the whole; conjunctions can also impel a person to be so adament in their position they are afraid or cannot hear and think about someone else's opinion. And many planets can make us "one sided" unable to view the world from any perspective but our own. I know, I have a lot of planets in one sign and I've had to learn that my opinion of the "truth" wasn't necessarily the right one and certainly not the only one.

There was a day when I only knew enough astrology to be dangerous to myself and others, then as I studied more I realized that there was too much to know, for anyone to ever "know it all" about astrology or anything else in the world. I also found that in order to read my own chart, I had to ask other's the unvarnished truth about me and how they saw I was using my energy. It's been a good thing for me to do, and I recommend it to all astrology students, including my own students.

Sally, as usual, very well said!!

Well said, Miss Sally! Long ago, I had to come to the conclusion that I knew more than that guy, & I knew less than the other guy. When Being in a Cosmic Circle, that's the way it is... & it's more than fine! And I remember thinking how I cld use astrology for all "my own stuff" only to discover that I'm simply too much in the way with "my own stuff" to read accurately... EVER! I need to share with others to become "better rounded." I feed others; they feed me... we communicate. ...that's the way The Cosmos works... communions... imo. (Sounds kinda like a spiritual experience, don't it... hahahaaa!!)

Btw, Mr. Art tho... I have no idea where his consciousness is at, but I DO know he's in touch with some incredible multi-leveled awareness by which I get to grow Cosmic-time... kinda blows my mind (to use a worthy old vernacular). How very wonderful to have access to such a site with its amazing variety of fascinating minds working with symbols. How I enjoy Being "round" this particular Cosmic banquet table!

thanks Joanna, I appreciate your comments about the site. I want a variety of articles from the simple to the "outer bounds" astrology is so multi layered beyond belief and most of us, as professional astrologers and astro writers struggle with giving so much information we will lose anyone who is trying to learn. I want to find that balance on this site.

Geneve, Nancy and I try to keep it at a point that can be readily understood and Vis and Art hopefully will continue writing articles that touch the sacred geometry involved in Astrology.

This is a fabulous site. I'm so glad to have found it. I am learning more than I ever have, and in these times, this is a haven of insight.

Thank you all for such fine work.

Sally,
I would also like to thank you from the bottom of my heart for providing this forum. This masterful construct has taught me much in a short time. You are a great mentor.

Joanna let me say that I am not in touch with any special multi-level awareness then you or anyone else. I do appreciate you saying it though. It is my pleasure to serve.

May I conclude with a tribute to one of the Cosmic Poets of our Era whose birthday is May 24th - Bob Dylan:
his chart:
http://www.stariq.com/pagetemplate/t1.asp?pageid=1727

An inspiration:

YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO SERVE SOMEBODY

"You may be an ambassador to England or France,
You may like to gamble, you might like to dance,
You may be the heavyweight champion of the world,
You may be a socialite with a long string of pearls

But you're gonna have to serve somebody, yes indeed
You're gonna have to serve somebody,
Well, it may be the devil or it may be the Lord
But you're gonna have to serve somebody.

You might be a rock 'n' roll addict prancing on the stage,
You might have drugs at your command, women in a cage,
You may be a business man or some high degree thief,
They may call you Doctor or they may call you Chief

But you're gonna have to serve somebody, yes indeed
You're gonna have to serve somebody,
Well, it may be the devil or it may be the Lord
But you're gonna have to serve somebody.

You may be a state trooper, you might be a young Turk,
You may be the head of some big TV network,
You may be rich or poor, you may be blind or lame,
You may be living in another country under another name

But you're gonna have to serve somebody, yes indeed
You're gonna have to serve somebody,
Well, it may be the devil or it may be the Lord
But you're gonna have to serve somebody.

You may be a construction worker working on a home,
You may be living in a mansion or you might live in a dome,
You might own guns and you might even own tanks,
You might be somebody's landlord, you might even own banks

But you're gonna have to serve somebody, yes indeed
You're gonna have to serve somebody,
Well, it may be the devil or it may be the Lord
But you're gonna have to serve somebody.

You may be a preacher with your spiritual pride,
You may be a city councilman taking bribes on the side,
You may be workin' in a barbershop, you may know how to cut hair,
You may be somebody's mistress, may be somebody's heir

But you're gonna have to serve somebody, yes indeed
You're gonna have to serve somebody,
Well, it may be the devil or it may be the Lord
But you're gonna have to serve somebody.

Might like to wear cotton, might like to wear silk,
Might like to drink whiskey, might like to drink milk,
You might like to eat caviar, you might like to eat bread,
You may be sleeping on the floor, sleeping in a king-sized bed

But you're gonna have to serve somebody, yes indeed
You're gonna have to serve somebody,
Well, it may be the devil or it may be the Lord
But you're gonna have to serve somebody.

You may call me Terry, you may call me Timmy,
You may call me Bobby, you may call me Zimmy,
You may call me R.J., you may call me Ray,
You may call me anything but no matter what you say

You're gonna have to serve somebody, yes indeed
You're gonna have to serve somebody.
Well, it may be the devil or it may be the Lord
But you're gonna have to serve somebody."

Haa haa!! How wonderful, to see the words of Bob Dylan. I always felt his words rang loud and clear for me personally, and wah laa, no wonder, his Mercury and my Moon conjunct exactly! Isn't astrology magnificent??!!

My 11-month old grandson, Dylan, was named with this musician in mind. Enjoyed this very much, Art!!

Thanks Art! You got to love Dylan!

Wonderful.

Thank you, Sally, for your wonderful post explaining how those aspects can manifest in one's chart. This beginning astrology student deeply appreciates the Forum moving back to discussing astrology and how it can work in one's life. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Jonathan

Dear Astrotravelers,

I have just read all these postings and would like to say to Sally good job - I believe you are offering a profoundly valuable forum of which the body of readers is growing because the more those who want control of souls try to control our very thoughts the more we try to express ourselves earnestly and in the moment. I am often smiling at myself - anxiously I check here for articles and I must remind myself as you pointed out here too whether or not aspects are "malefic" or harmonious it is the choices of the free wills involved that decides the outcome. There is one other site that speaks to my heart - maybe no one reads my comments hear for I am not as capable in logical arguments ( Saturn in 3rd house?) but I would like to quote the recent posting there - here - because Sally has helped me exercise my voice - Namaste to all:

http://www.baproducts.com/april03.htm

Issue #69 April 2003 Newsletter of Mary's Message/Newsletter -

'...Most of all believe in peace and in the power of prayer. Believe that what you ask for is given to you. Believe that despite the war, despite the rumblings of terorism, despite the interference of one nation towards another, peace is attainable. Believe that peace is attainable now, not in some distant future, but today. I would not have you to look at world events as a hopeless cause...as long as you aspire to and live for peace and in peace, it is here now...Instead stay out of the conflict, in thought, word, and deed. Keep believing in prayer and the answers to your prayers. Believe so in peace that it is the way you react to all events...' part of message from Mother Mary , mother of Jesus who never in all the messages I read speaks of a chosen people but rather speaks with love for all.

I have recently read an article in astrology that pulled in the idea of seeing more female energy coming into the whole balance of returning to a more life affirming path for everyone...this seems significant to me.

I would like to find an analysis of Senator Byrd - I see these days that it is our elders who are reminding us of our own history (Gore Vidal, Charleston Heston, Zinn,my mother, others I am sure) helping light our way to truth - the powers that are resisting change are creating much amnesia during these times - does astrology point at all to where guidance will come forthe people ( I guess I'd have to narrow it to the american people) during this time?

M.

Madeline, those are beautiful thoughts and yes they are read. By the way Saturn in the 3rd doesn't necessarily mean a person isn't good at expressing their thoughts, it means they have fear or concern about expressing their thoughts. Quite often (depending on other aspects) they are very good at technical writing or good at the organization of their thoughts.

Your comments about prayer are very timely, one doesn't even need to believe in prayer or a religion or even God for that matter. People can exercise their positive impulses and we all have them. We get up in a day and think "well this is going to be a rotten day" or "wow, this is going to be great" and we treat others accordingly.

I use the analogy of the street I live on, it's a beautiful and busy street. Big old trees, big victorian houses, the Botannic Gardens and parks on both sides are on this street and I love driving down it every day. However, sometimes I get up and drive down my street and someone cuts me off and I want to run him into the park or call the police and have his license removed forever, I am furious. The truth is someone cuts me or others off every single day because it's a busy street, it's MY attitude that makes the difference, not the jerk who cuts in
front of me. And it is MY attitude that makes the difference in the kind of people I meet, because everything, good, bad and ugly is out in the world waiting to see what we want. We can choose the good, the funny, the positive, we together make the difference in this world

Roxanne, it's that Mercury in Leo that's doing you in. Just from observation, I have noticed that those with Mercury in Leo come across as being arrogant, opinionated or dogmatic, and not able to see another's point of view, especially if Mercury receives stress aspects from other planets like Pluto (even a conjunction); so maybe that is something that you may have to work on. And with that stellium in Virgo, I notice that you also have a tendency to harp, and carp (a negative Virgo trait),and that you are not able to let go of an idea e.g. as with the Nader subject. Please take this in good faith. It's not intended to belittle you in any way, because I do believe that you bring a lot of interesting ideas here, and that if you make a conscious effort, you may be able to minimize the effects of these negative traits. Take a closer look at your natal chart.

Ha ha. Let's hear it for Dylan! He sure does have a way with words.
Thank you Mr. Gianfermo.

oh yes i know its the merc in leo..but without that i'd be smashed by all the impurities in the world..

yes that dylan song is what i'm trying to say actually, thanks art for putting up the words of a guy who knows he loves god, even if he doesn't know if it's jesus or not, from time to time..

bush is going to egypt on june 4, maybe...saturn is in his 9th house there...hmmmm...and incidentally i think that pluto crosses his ascendant in nyc...food for thought? where is saturn in his 8th? i don't have the computer skills to figure this out..i just have his astrocartography chart..is it perhaps the koreas??
can anyone do this?

Sally, reading your latest post, you are so fortunate to live in that beautiful environment. I grew up living in a couple of Victorian houses, and still love them. But what you said to Madeline - "Your comments about prayer are very timely, one doesn't even need to believe in prayer or a religion or even God for that matter...." reminded me of a book I once read years ago, called "Enlightenment without God" by Sri Swami Rama. I recommend those who don't belive in God, and even more so those who do believe in God, read it. It was an invaluable experience for me. As a matter of fact, I think I'll read it again.

i hate to fall into crystals trap, but i must comment on this.

why would you want to be enlightened without God? humm???

what's man's hangup? ego. stop being mad at God. if you feel guilty of something, or unworthy, just face it and try to heal. you can run but you can't hide, y'know? be mad at the devil, he's the one responsible for all the bad things in the world..him tempting man to kill, and be smug, and..not believe in God..which all in all bring about poor results, bad karma.

it must be pretty sad to be living in these times and not have God to believe in. when i see revelation playing itself out these days, i am sad for the 'lost' who don't know what's going on..if you look at how it's all working out astrologically, that's an educational turn on atleast for me, of the mysteries, but it doesn't give a 'reason'.... I rejoice for the ones who believe in spiritual justice, and pray for ones who only can believe what they see and feel within their self-important hearts.

regarding astrology..conjunctions sally, while they may make someone want to shove things down other people's throats, they are mainly known for their 'power'..which has proven things out on this board..for example..someone like Art for example can throw in his opinion about the 'situation' and no one will say anything (except me), yet when I
disagree everyone gets up in arms..same thing with talking about God..someone can "recommend" a book saying one doesn't need God, and it will get merely noted, but if I post something "recommending" one does in fact need God, people say I'm dogmatic? That's unfair, and it's nothing to do with shoving an opinion down people's throats it's just to do with one's inherent power..i've had people staring at me when I walk into a room since I'm a child, and I am neither beautiful nor ugly, fantastically dressed, or a slob..it's unfair to accuse me of being one who harps when I'm just one who seems to affect. My mercury is only aspected to chiron of my 2/3 house cusp, in opposition..perhaps this leads to being misunderstood. astrologers who have looked at my chart said i could be a great religious leader, no one ever said i had a problem, they in fact said it was an incredibly great chart. all of my 9th house conjunctions trine my saturn in my first.

Isn't this a political astrology site? Doesn't the author have to interpret the chart for which his article is directed. Isn't the author allowed to have an opinion?

Yes, and as with religion and sex, the author is bound to hit the sore spots of some of his readers. That is natural. What is not natural is repeated attacks on the author and his article. If the reader doesn't agree (even passionately) one rebuttal is plenty. The second and third could and may well be harassment.

Roxanne, you are beginning to look like you are flaming. Everyone has tried to tell you enough. Please use your intellignece instead of you passionate opinion alone. You are going over the line.......jumping the shark.

Thank you, Pat. On to the discussions about Astrology!!! :-)

Jonathan

We came across this website a few months ago while seeking information on astrology related to our current world situation and through the wonderful articles and comments from so many enlightened readers we found a place of refuge from the maddening world around us. We live in a southern area where people hail this President as a God and where we dare not speak out against this administration for fear of losing friends or jobs. My husband and I felt alone and shaken in our belief that we were the only ones seeing the madness around us. Then we found this website and heard all your wonderful voices speaking to us through your words of wisdom and we knew we were not alone and that perhaps there is hope for us and this country after all. We came here daily to check the articles and read the comments - there are many of us who look but whose voices you don't see in print - and to feel the peace of your words that comfort our fears. All we ask is that you use this site for peace .. no fighting among yourselves about political issues or religious views. There is too much of that elsewhere and this site should remain a place where we can all go to find peace and truth. We all have our different opinions and view points and there is never any one "right" view on any subject. Let us listen to each other with open hearts and at times agree to just disagree and leave it at that. This Memorial Day weekend has been difficult enough. We went to a home supply store where we were met by two employees who insisted we sign a huge (and I mean huge) poster with the "We Support Our President and Troops" banner. We refused to sign and the one Employee wanted to know why we were not "Patriotic"! After that we went to a Winn Dixie where yet another employee wanted to stick a "We Support Our Troops " decal on the front windshield of our car! Again we declined and the employee was not happy that we also did not want to take it home with us. It's not that we are not Patriotic - this is the first year we have not put a flag on our front door wreath - it is just that we do not support this President or his crazy followers. We have decided that we cannot go out for the rest of the weekend as we don't want to be harrassed again! So, bring your peace to this site only - there are those of us who use this site as a life line to the "real world"! Keep up the good work - you all are such a blessing!
Siobhan

I can relate, Siobhan. It is frustrating when you can't even speak your mind at a lunch table at work without a strong fear of losing your job. Communication is important and it hurts to remain close-lipped on important subjects, like politics. And most Americans are very touchy about their sacred flag. And if you've noticed, it's the cars with six or more American flags who are adamant at cutting you off in traffic. I guess their patriotism gives them some divine right to have their way, at your expense. That's how I feel about this administration.

I want my country back, and this site gives me a little hope that the day is coming. This site is a blessing!

no flaming here at all, never was, sorry to come off as such a sword..

what siobhan is going through though is terrible, and to me it is proof that a spiritual war is going on: one is being forced to sign up that you support death of innocents..that will come back to those people..it's very sad, very sad...and the harmonic accordance/star of david/november eclipse, all supports that there is more going on here than trying astrology, and a disgusting president..

i tried to bring astrology back into the board days ago by asking about bush's june 4 in egypt..has anyone had a go at this?

Roxanne, I think Nancy talked about the date. She may have done it here or elsewhere. If I remember correctly, because of a lack of time, the astrology is inconclusive.

Roxanne & Janet, looks like he's starting with Putin on 5/28 Thursday. What is bothersome is that he is also heading to Israel to meet w/Sharon and the new PM, plus Egypt, plus Jordan, and there's the whole Iran thing threatening to spill over Rummy's got ants in his pants hear those tanks a movin' ! So we're looking at a swath of time, plus through the eclipse, he's going to be pretty close to it...how interesting.

Right on Morgana,
Bush moving thru Russia heading to Israel to meet w/Sharon and the new PM, plus Egypt, plus Jordan...

World War IV (counting the Cold War/VietNam as World War Three) has commenced with IRAQ.
Now with IRAN issues they are addicts that can't stop with just one line. Today's nasty overtures by the Hawks are spreading :
Yahoo News...
"Lawmakers Say Remove Iran's Rulers

WASHINGTON - Iran's hard-line government, accused by the Bush administration of harboring top al-Qaida members, poses a big problem for the United States and should be replaced, lawmakers said Sunday."

As I said Al Dabaran - the Follower of the Pleiades. It was one of the Four Royal Stars of Persia
(as in Iran the mother country of Islam) which borrows from all religions both Judaism and Christianity - Christ was only a metaphor for spiritual energy well over 5000 years ago during the age of Sumeria, Egypt and Bablyonia.
The true spiritual secrets are hidden in Iraq/Iran not in Jerusalem!
The powers that be Judeo/Christian religion don't want the truth discovered abt. the Gods who
travel back and forth between the stargates.
http://www.williamhenry.net/bearded_gods2003.htm

Bush and his Cabal will fall and the truth will be revealed! except what price will be paid for
their efforts to control and suppress the truth!

hey art, jesus was a spiritual metaphor ages before, but then he did manifest as man..all of that is holy land. if israel wasn't a hot bed, it wouldn't be...such a hot bed.

as a former student of the occult of 11 years, i never had the power i have had, in my life, in my good fortune, as i have since i believed in jesus, god as man. it's power is immense, it is a metaphor for 'love' but the man really did exist, rose the dead, rose from the dead, etc...

also, art, if your read rev..starting from where it really explains itself, like 16 on, you'll see we are living out the whole thing...the whore of babylon is now, as of 2003, irrevocably, the usa. the woman who sees no sorrow, and sits on many waters, with the multitudes within her..with violence she will be cast down. God gives the beast the freedom to destroy her, before God, the lamb, peace, destroys the beast. The whore rides the beast (usa controlling the middle east), but the beast devours her. the whole world morns, for the whore, for they have all fornicated with her..they mourn her singers, her stars, for she is no more..she has become the home for every vile bird (west nile?), and everything horrible...the beast gets it power from the dragon...visions of those missles on the way to yemen from korea? it's all there...read it. and rejoice! pick up your bed, and walk!

Is roxanne some kind of freak, or what?
Roxanne when are you going to become that great spiritual leader as foretold in your horrorscope? Go tell it on the mountains man. You are wasting your time here.

if i'm a freak in an age like this, that's ok with me! and mountains are better than a lot of people..

name calling is always a last resort when someone doesn't have a valid thing to say. this is a board of cool open minded spiritual people, who use their talent, to keep learning about everything...some even write to me personally.

it's you, a name caller and hung up person stuck in your own mind-set that does not belong here..

i wrote the end of the last piece in humour darling, something you obviously have no sense of! wanker.

Ah! So you specialize in black comedy?
Ideal quality for a preacher. Now, find that mountain top, and get started on that mission fast. The world is about to end! The kingdom is at hand! Fire and brimstone are about to descend!
Hahaha. See, I've got a sense of humour too! Or is it humeur?

I must have no sense of humor, either. That last piece of your post is enough to scare anyone . . . thank God (haa haa) I don't have much use for religion.

By the way, Art, I am looking forward to what you think of that "Harmonic Concordance" in November.

Laurie, there is a great deal of discussion regarding the Harmonic Concordance because there have been a number of them. One of the more famous was the Harmonic Convergence on Aug. 16/17 1987. According to Hopi tradition this date was a formal ending of "hell on earth" and we would go into the 1000 years of peace. That's an oversimplification, but basically that was the prediction of the time. Right now it doesn't look as if that's happened for millions of people around the world. I would be more excited about the Harmonic Concordance if it were exact, but it isn't. The Eclipse Point 16 degrees of the Taurus/Scorpio polarity have already passed the degrees of the other planets, indicating the power of the Eclipse relates to past events. (example: Saturn and Chiron aspect the degree of Mercury and Asc. in the 9/11 chart) However the 16 degrees of the Eclipse does activate once again the Aug. 11, 1999 Solar Eclipse which contained a grand cross, and everytime that is hit a dramatic event takes place. In Feb. 2008 there is another Solar Eclipse at 18 Aquarius the exact opposite of the 1999 eclipse, that seems to be when we will be at an end of this current world crisis. Mars in the Inaugural chart of 2001 also hits the 1999 eclipse points, in fact it hits the Mars of that 1999 Grand Cross. (16 Scorpio) and opposes Saturn at 16 Taurus, now we have an Eclipse in Nov. 2003 activating that point.

While the Harmonic Concordance will give a boon to the astrologers making trips to vortex points around the world and world wide days of prayer or meditation are extremely powerful, plus the Saturn in the Concordance chart conjuncts Bush, US, and Republican party's Sun which is limiting to say the least, (Saturn in its detriment in Cancer) plus Chiron opposes at 14 Capricorn I am more inclined to think this Concordance relates to past eclipse's, a culmination and potential wounding of some type. Certainly not a good Eclipse for the government.

Thanks Sally,
Great Explanation regarding the Harmonic Concordance:
"The Eclipse Point 16 degrees of the Taurus/Scorpio polarity have already passed the degrees of the other planets, indicating the power of the Eclipse relates to past events. ( However the 16 degrees of the Eclipse does activate once again the Aug. 11, 1999 Solar Eclipse which contained a grand cross, and everytime that is hit a dramatic event takes place"

FYI Roxanne, Laurie et. all,
I am not AG! this is the first time I posted today in PDT - I have been away all day watching softball and doing the holiday thing.
I do not resort to name calling and have experienced the power of Christ (Chirstos Energy). Secondarily I am open to revelations in terms of allegorical happenings.

Please don't confuse me with AG.
I only will post my real name on this BLOG.

Please Enjoy the Rest of the Weekend,
PEACE and BLESSINGS...

Oh gee, sorry Art, I think I did assume that but thought your words very unlike you. Sally, thank you so much for that. I hsd heard some different takes on it but your explanation put it in perspective. You are a good teacher.

Roxanne, I think you like a really good fight, you would have been a great Joan of Arc, and I mean that in a good way.

My apologies Art. I didn't mean to infer any connection with you in the choice of my nom de plume, Astroworld Ghost(AG), but I am very interested in hearing about your "Cristos Energy" experience. Perhaps you can post it at your website, and I'll read it there.

AG

No Problem AG,
actually I like the nom de plume, Astroworld Ghost.

Regarding Christos Energy - "Short Verison": ever since I was a child (being indoctrinated with the Roman Catholic/Apostolic stuff) I have always had a conncection with the energy called Christ. Like many of us I became increasingly suspicious of organized religion and sought anwswers elsewhere as a teenager (Psychedelia if you will). As a young adult (short version) I sought out many paths of spirituality but always the deeper occult meanings from Hindu, Buddha, Yoga (Pantangali and more), Kaballah and Islam. By 1991 with Neptune/Uranus in Capricorn crossing my 1st house my journey led to the Pleiadian/Sirian connection and the Christos Energy...my experiences of Cosmic Conciousness were with both the Mayan and Christos energy in Palenque, Mexico and Northern Calif. possibly a little to Neptunian to go into (Nept. trine to Jupiter)
Background:
It seems that Christ (the being) elevated the green plant realm of GAIA into blood - turning wine into blood which gave us all the ability to move beyond the control of the Annunaki (or any term you wish). In 325AD the Christian Church seized control to become the official dispenser of the Eucharist (you are Christ). Now with Pluto in Sag. we are in the midst of watching religious systems self destruct (Pluto) bringing us back to the original Christos Energy. If you haven't read The Pleiadian Agenda by Barbara Hand Clow, check it out.

Hope This is On Topic and Not too Confusing?

Thanks for the info Art, but most of that stuff is above my head. Maybe some day I will see the light, and be able to understand it all. Salut.

AG

hey laurie! yeah, i like joan of arc..she's a capricorn, but i don't know much else about her chart...i do have a sense of humor about things, i do believe in what i perceive too, but i'm friends with all kinds, in fact, i'm probably the only christian i know! maybe it's the rebel in me too! i'm an artist/musician, and sometimes it's better if we don't talk to people, and just communicate with our art, music, etc..because 'normal' people get so offended, then i get very hurt..i think if jimi hendrix and bob dylan spoke about every single thing that the felt they'd probably have no fans...i'm going to try to shut up on this board and just read the astro stuff! a "good fight" well yes i'm italian as i've said before, and i guess i was just raised like that. sorry! ag: i've been looking for that mountain top for ages...i visual it like julie andrews in the opening of sound of music? hahahah....
art - you're a brilliant astrologer, as is everyone else here..but i thought 'sea of death' was scarier than any of my posts! and i especially love sally, godspeed to everyone..i mean.....

Roxanne, don't you dare "shut up." We progressives and kind are a rough, opinionated lot, and that's how we like it. Yes, you can and do express yourself provocatively, but you also make me smile. That's a good thing.

Joan of Arc was born 1-6-1412 at 5:11pm
Donremy, France

Should religions or races be discussed on an astrological website? I think not unless you are discussing the birthchart of the religion or the chart of the founder of the religion. To proselytize one religion over another, or even a belief in One particular deity is to insult all those whose beliefs are in another deity or in many other deities. On behalf of all of those whose beliefs are in Buddhism, or Hinduism, or Muslimism, or Wicca, or Atheism,or Paganism or any of the thousands of other religions, as a professional astrologer, I apologize and would like you to know it is not common for any astrologer to push their personal belief and prejudice on another.

The problem appears to be Pluto's transit through Sagittarius;i.e. the mad and compulsive push to convert and force personal religious beliefs and philosophies on others. I doubt that Pluto's transit through Capricorn will be much better, but I do think there is some hope and relief from the Falwell's and Robertson's of this world when Pluto transits Aquarius and we may even find our true connection to spirituality when Pluto enters Pisces.

In the meantime may the force, whatever or whoever it is for you, be with you.

Hmmmmm interesting !!!

Hmmmmm interesting

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http://www.lg.agdrtv.com/ , który nie ten lienergee
http://www.toshiba.agdrtv.com/ laptop ale ktomenistecoon
http://www.sony.agdrtv.com/ , a gdzie nim
http://www.samsung.agdrtv.com/ , tam ale nie tu
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